Rolexman Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 (edited) Why pay around USD 300,- for a Pam with an Asian 7750 movement (no chronograph feature) if you can get the same one with an Asian 21-jewels automatic for around USD 100,-.... they're both Asian so what is the difference?? Edited May 2, 2006 by Rolexman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Tracy Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 I believe the difference is that the 21j movement must be modified to reach the seconds hand on pams, unlike the 7750. Modifications can and do cause problems later. The 7750 if relieved of the extra work is a perfect engine for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 2, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 Could be, but the Asian 7750 isn't that reliable either.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Tracy Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 I don't know about the reliability of them when running only a date function.. maybe someone can chime in ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertk Posted May 2, 2006 Report Share Posted May 2, 2006 I believe that there is almost no difference in reliability. These new movements are pretty damn reliable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadog13 Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 asian 7750 are pretty reliable..i think... the asian 7750 that is used in chrono watches seems to be a problematic one...even if my 196 runs perfectly... asian 21j is also a good mvt...however the 7750 used in non-chrono watches is better..but the question is if it is worth the 200$ extra?!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Indeed!!.... 200 bucks is a lot of money. Isn't there anybody who can shed some light on the matter?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Indeed!!.... 200 bucks is a lot of money. Isn't there anybody who can shed some light on the matter?? There is no light to be shed.. 1 and a half year ago the PAM 196 came out and it was one of the most accurate PAM visual (and still is in the top ten) with a fully working chronograph with date. If you are a chrono guy, you get a working automatic chronograph and you pay for it. The manual chronographs (like the Venus on the 192) they are not expensive probably because they don't have any modifications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) We're talking about the non-chronoraph versions....... For example Andrews PAM 104 PAM 104 USD 118,- (Asian 21-jewels automatic) PAM 104 USD 298,- (Asian 7750) Different angles but almost visually identical (except from some small dial differences)... not worth USD 200,- IMHO Edited May 3, 2006 by Rolexman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 Sorry.. i haven't seen the non chronograph on the topic.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tutima Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 The latest 7750 is a very good and reliable movement as verified by The Zigmeister. A lot of the parts are interchangable with the genuine Swiss 7750 so service is easy and available. For the 21j movement, I haven't seen any extensive review of it. As far as I know, there is no service or parts readily available. You can only replace the movement if there is a problem. The price difference also goes to the saphire crytal comes with the expensive version. The cheaper version only comes with mineral glass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) The price difference also goes to the saphire crytal comes with the expensive version. The cheaper version only comes with mineral glass. NOT TRUE!.... both are synthetic sapphire!! Edited May 3, 2006 by Rolexman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadog13 Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 NOT TRUE!.... both are synthetic sapphire!! there are versions with sapphire crystal...check offers from TTK ...EL.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tutima Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 NOT TRUE!.... both are synthetic sapphire!! The cheaper version advertised as "synthetic sahphire" but really is mineral glass. The 7750 version comes with "saphire crystal" which is real synthetic saphire. That is my understanding. Someone correct me if I am wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) NOT TRUE!! Both synthetic sapphire!! (Asian 21-jewels and 7750). No replica comes with real crystal sapphire!!! Edited May 3, 2006 by Rolexman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TmeShare Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) One reason why you should choose the Asian 7750 - SMOOTH SECOND HAND OPERATION: - The Asian 21 movement in a PAM circular second hand is often jerky as evident in the Pam 90 POwer Reserve as observed by posts on this and other Boards. - The Asian 7750 PAM circular second hand is very smooth and not jerky, see Arktos. This is the best reason to pick the 7750!! TimeShare Edited May 3, 2006 by TmeShare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 About sapphire: Some time ago I came to the conclusion that it is Andrew's dictionary to call 'sinthetic sapphire' for mineral glass, and 'sapphire' (only) for sapphire. Once you know it, it can't harm you. About Asian 21j vs Asian 7750: Naturally 7750 (or ETA 7753) is the only choice for chronographs. Chronographs excluded, i think that 7750 is better but it could stand for a $80-100 difference, no more than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tutima Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) NOT TRUE!! Both synthetic sapphire!! (Asian 21-jewels and 7750). No replica comes with real crystal sapphire!!! NOT TRUE & TRUE..!!! The Asian 21j version comes with mineral glass, not synthetic saphire. You can confirm that with the dealers. Edited May 3, 2006 by tutima Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2006 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) Problem solved.. thanks for the input guys. You were right in the mineral glass issue Tutima! Edited May 3, 2006 by Rolexman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MADRED7 Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 (edited) There is only 1 reason to take the Asian 21J The asian versions are more accurate to the real deal in their outer appearance.....all those 7750 B1 versions I saw had too many flaws: - A-series style but with lumed indizees that sit on stainless steel dots -> WRONG - A-series style but with a brushed bezel -> WRONG - A-series style but with a rotating bezel for 1 minutes -> WRONG (has to be 5 minutes!) - ....the list can be continued. So I got all those Asian 21J models, they are worth the bucks and I love them. I rather pay 100$, use the watch careless and when it breaks....who the [censored] cares ´bout. For 300$ it would be another game, I´d be very carefull with that piece...but I don´t want to, it´s a rep after all! Just my 0.02$ Theo Edited May 3, 2006 by PAM1A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted May 3, 2006 Report Share Posted May 3, 2006 The Asian 7750 - It has running seconds at 9 o'clock as you get with many PAMs such as the Arktos etc. It also has a day/date function. The problems with the Asian 7750 (as far as I know) is when there are extra gears added to move the subdials - a good example is the Daytona that has running seconds at 6 o'clock (as detailed in The Zigmeister's review). With no strain coming from chrono functions, I doubt there would be (m)any problems with this movement in a non-chrono rep with running seconds at 9 o'clock. As for the price, I think the price is similar to the chrono reps with Asian 7750. The way a dealer/manufacturer figures it, is they have to sell the same movement based watch the same price, regardless of the chrono functions. Personally, I would think that a chrono rep would cost more because there are subdials as well as extra hands on the watch for this function. The non-chrono rep doesn't need extra hands or pushers so should cost cheaper... although I don't know by how much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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