Golfman Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 And what do you think about this one (the auto limited ed) All spec at the link below http://www.steinhartwatches.de/index.php?id=80 @Tourby : do you think it worth the money ? Regards GM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 delete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 tourby - I appreciate your insight and it is always good to hear from someone who has held the watch as opposed to those of us who are only looking at pictures. My thought on the quality of the Steinhart is that if the Steinhart is only as good as a high end China Rep - So what? I have a few friends in the watch industry. They all agree that the Swiss and Germans still make the best cases, however, here is another thing they all agree on - IT WON"T BE LONG UNTIL "Swiss" WATCH MANUFACTURES START USING CASES FROM CHINA!!! They have all told me that whether your are a Swiss powerhouse or a small manufacturer you can not ignore the high detail of the case and quality of the steel being used on the Chinese watch cases. Of course, a Chines watch case will not compare to a high end Swiss case, but their is no doubt that the high quality Chinese cases are really good. My understanding is that some Swiss and German manufactures are already using Chinese parts and it will not be long before some of the more established names in watches start to make entry level watches with Chinese cases. Tradition plays a BIG role in not using these Chinese parts, but the quality of the parts combined with the low cost has become to much to ignore. The other thing I hear from my friends in the industry is "turn around time" The small German and Swiss watch manufacturers are getting squeezed out by the big guns who get priority on cases. There are only a few place one can go to and have a quality German or Swiss case made (unfortunately it is a dieing trade) Because of this, if a watch company's case order is delayed or he has a need for another run of cases it can take several months of waiting and sometimes the watch maker is even told "Sorry, no can do! These problems are why you will start to see Chinese parts on "Swiss" watches (if they are not already there and we just don't know it!) I think you are exactly right when you say the price for the Steinhart is good, but I would be careful in describing the case as "poor" and then saying it is equivalent to a Chines case. There are some d@mn good Chinese cases out there!. Not as good as a $10.000.00 IWC Big Pilot?, sure! But do you really think the IWC Big Pilot case is worth the $9,500.00 more it costs over the Steinhart? I am sorry to hear the lume is of poor quality and I agree that the first thing I would do is install a nice high quality strap, but for the money, I just don't see how you can beat the Steinhart if you are looking for the big 47mm look of the IWC BP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRT Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 That is exactly my point, Jake. I don't think anyone doubts that a true "swiss made" watch is probably built with higher quality than most Chinese reps...but as you said, they are getting closer all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 (edited) they are getting closer all the time. XRT - I have personally spoke to people inside Panerai and ChronoSwiss and trust me - they know the quality of the Chinese cases and they have been worrying about it for some time! They know the Swiss and German cases will always be better, but the Chinese cases are getting scary good - especially for the prices! I see tourby's point, but do you really think you are going to spend $450.00 for a watch that is equal in quality to a $10,000.00 - of course not! I wouldn't want to spend $450.00 on a watch that is a pile of junk either, but from what tourby said, I think the Steinhart is no pile of junk and it seems like it is well worth the $450.00. I like that people are looking and talking about IWC Big Pilot alternatives in this thread. I didn't know about the Steinhart version and now I am going to buy one! (unless, of course, someone has another watch that they know about) Edited September 30, 2007 by jake48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRT Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Look at the Archimede watches. They aren't 47mm though. Here's the link to their U.S. distributer: website BTW- here's is a MUCH better review of the Steinhart/Debaufre Nav B on the "Watchuseek" forum (which is a great forum for getting ideas of other 'less' expensive alternatives): Forum link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Look at the Archimede watches. They aren't 47mm though. Here's the link to their U.S. distributer: website BTW- here's is a MUCH better review of the Steinhart/Debaufre Nav B on the "Watchuseek" forum (which is a great forum for getting ideas of other 'less' expensive alternatives): Forum link XRT - Good info! I used to go to Watchuseek & TimeZone a lot when I was buying Gens... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Thanks guys for your comments : they confirm what i think ..... Steinhart seems to be be a really good alternative of the BP, especially the Limited Edition i have post earlier in this post. Anyway, i gonna have a look on the links you have done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I dont think that you can compair this steinhart to an IWC big pilot, ok it is a pilot style watch and it is big, it has big wite printing on the dial but that is were the similarity ends, the IWC has a 7 day PR, a date and an in house movement, you just cant compare this to the IWC, an older ww2 big pilot ok but not thwe new one we are all waiting for! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golfman Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I dont think that you can compair this steinhart to an IWC big pilot, ok it is a pilot style watch and it is big, it has big wite printing on the dial but that is were the similarity ends, the IWC has a 7 day PR, a date and an in house movement, you just cant compare this to the IWC, an older ww2 big pilot ok but not thwe new one we are all waiting for! Perhaps that i haven't well expressed !! When i said that is a good alternative to the BP, i wanted to say a good alternative to the "IWC BP" Rep" that we will perhaps never see.... In addition i think that the Limited Edition has a Pilot watch look without a cheap BP look like. The last point is that i am not confident with wearing a 10K$ Rep watch (just personal feeling) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Not as good as a $10.000.00 IWC Big Pilot?, sure! But do you really think the IWC Big Pilot case is worth the $9,500.00 more it costs over the Steinhart? I am sorry to hear the lume is of poor quality and I agree that the first thing I would do is install a nice high quality strap, but for the money, I just don't see how you can beat the Steinhart if you are looking for the big 47mm look of the IWC BP! @ golfman, i was refering to this post not yours mate. @ Jake48, the $9.500 goes on more than the case and not all on the name it carries! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 delete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 good point i think this Steinhart is a good alternative to a IWC replica... which is not on market. but Steinhart can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 @ Jake48, the $9.500 goes on more than the case and not all on the name it carries! I agree with you on that one - but you didn't answer the question - When you compare the prices of the two watches IWC/Steinhart - Do you think the price for the IWC is justified? I don't. And as far as IWC goes as a "Brand" I think it would be a safe bet that if the exact same watch was sold for $10,000.00 - one that had the IWC brand name and the other that had no name on the dial - NO ONE would pay $10,000.00 for a no name dial watch, yet people would plonk down their hard earned cash for the IWC. Is it because the IWC branded watch is such a quality time piece - of course not! It is like most things in the high end scale - brand prestige... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 delete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Well sorry but i did not read that direct question, if i had then i would have to agree with you that it is not worth the tag given, and i dont think that any top flight items such as watches, clothes and many more items are worth the eletist price tag, if i did i would be on time zone with a bag of gens. I would say though i see more worth in the the iwc brand than say Hublot, at least they use an in house movement and as far as i know dont get the bezels made in china Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 (edited) i have no 47mm case and would never use this cheap Steinhart case i have a 42mm pilot watch for $750... but this watch has much better quality as Steinhart... from case (used in $5.000 Benzinger watches)... double side AR sapphire... genuine alligator louisiana strap... double butterfly deployant buckle... with knurled bezel http://s163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/to...nurled%20bezel/ with soft bezel http://s163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/to...20soft%20bezel/ here with swan neck movent for higher price http://s163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/to...eel%20polished/ here my pilot with RGM brushed case http://s163.photobucket.com/albums/t320/to...earl%20brushed/ sad that this watches are only 42mm... 44mm would be better Very nice watches - I am familiar with RGM - the only "real" watch manufacture here in the USA I like the case on the first two watches and it reminds me of a ChronoSwiss. I especially like the blued Swan Neck - nice touch! So what do you think? Who makes the best IWC Big Pilot substitute if you don't want to spend $10,000.00 + Is there a 44mm to 47mm Pilot watch that has a case around 14mm thick that has quality better than the Steinhart for under $1,000.00? I am going to be in Europe in a few months and want to bring back a watch as a reminder of my trip. I have heard very good things about the Azimuth, but it seems people agree that the case looks too thin. I thought about polishing the bezel of the Steinhart and refinishing the case myself to improve the refinement of the watch. This of course does nothing for the dial - is it really that bad? Got any ideas? The Steinhart still seems like it might be the best buy... Edited September 30, 2007 by jake48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I am not sure what the cost but i have seen them cheep in the past i think try Zeno, Also not an excpert on these but they are sold in my local rolex AD and that is a well snobby shop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 (edited) Dang - computer glich - double post!! Edited September 30, 2007 by jake48 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 I am not sure what the cost but i have seen them cheep in the past i think try Zeno, Also not an excpert on these but they are sold in my local rolex AD and that is a well snobby shop Randy - Thanks- When I was looking for a Franck Mueller style watch I found Zeno a few years back. I didn't know they made such a big cased pilot watch- I will look into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 delete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake48 Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 delete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangers158 Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 If the lume is as bad as what tourby described, they might not be applying as much superlume on the dial as before. The lume on my grand marquis is quite good but not as good as one of my very first genaration SS Steinhart pilot or the superlume on my PAM111H. But in terms of design, the Steinhart is certainly very nice... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XRT Posted October 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 My lume shots with 30 seconds of fluorescent light charge: 1 second exposure: 30 second exposure: not much difference between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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