New Yachtmaster

[Mickey Padge]

What are we waiting for?????...lets contact Paul and call him out. I want and need an explanation with this one. I almost bought this watch and I think God that I changed my mind and went for a Roadster.

Well you could email him with this thread link if you like. I would like to see the other dealers response too, has anyone contacted them?

Maybe board moderators/admin could ask Paul? After all he posted his sales thread on this very forum.....

[By-Tor]

I'd give Paul a benefit of the doubt.

He's such a dope... I'm not 100% sure if he even knows what he's selling, most of the time.

Not that I want to defend him, but remember in the old days when even Ziggy was fooled by the old factory 007 SMP (another Seagull/ETA incident). Paul has always been sloppy as hell, but I don't think he's stupid enough to try and scam anyone like this. Maybe the factory has misled the dealers?

I know this is not likely, but before we start any kind of inqusition maybe we can give them a chance to explain.

Either way, using misleading descriptions like this isn't acceptable.

[Mickey Padge]

I'd give Paul a benefit of the doubt.

He's such a dope... I'm not 100% sure if he even knows what he's selling, most of the time.

Not that I want to defend him, but remember in the old days when even The Zigmeister was fooled by the old factory 007 SMP (another Seagull/ETA incident). Paul has always been sloppy as hell, but I don't think he's stupid enough to try and scam anyone like this. Maybe the factory has misled the dealers?

I know this is not likely, but before we start any kind of inqusition maybe we can give them a chance to explain.

Either way, using misleading descriptions like this isn't acceptable.

Thats true and fair enough. Maybe an email from the board, officially, sent to the dealers would be called for? Just asking for clarification in an attempt to protect forum members...

[Mickey Padge]

Well, genuine watches aren't that expensive compared how much money buyers are burningh all the [censored] and lies going on. I am SO glad that I am not buying any reps any more... Buying reps is no fun - dealers act more and more like the scam sites, false ads and high prices. Leave em do their shady jobs - but don't go ahead and buy the crap they offer. Just stay away - and grab a gen. They are so much nicer. You don't need a Rolex, there are so many recognised and quality brands for cheap money.

SHamilton Khaki, serviced 2893-2, adjusted, Sapphire glass and such a great built quality - warranty, waterproof gurantee etc... for the price of one of those shitty new 1:1 superduper reps.

Its true, why buy watches that are falsely represented? I too am getting dishearted regarding this rep hobby....

[FxrAndy]

May be so RepA but i like reps and can have lots compared to one or 2 Gens, maybe the fun is now sorting the chaff from the wheat with the dealers and the liers

[By-Tor]

But then again, we usually been one step ahead of false advertising and misrepresentations. Just like we are now, thanks to the knowledge of the membership. That's originally what this forum was all about... to prevent people to get scammed.

This Seagull/ETA thing is nothing new. Like I said, the SMP 007 and Aqua Terras (those with transparent backs) were sold as ETAs. The age old "Lemania" thing, etc.

Which dealers exactly are selling this watch as ETA? King and Paul only?

[Mickey Padge]

Which dealers exactly are selling this watch as ETA? King and Paul only?

For sale here:

http://www.pam111.com/product_info.php?products_id=2240

http://www.trustytime88.com/index.php?main...c96ec895293443c

http://www.kingshowbox.com/goods.php?id=480

Also on this very forum: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=68065

Cheers!

[By-Tor]

Yes I agree. That price is utterly ridiculous.

You have to be a complete dumbass to buy this watch for $500. Especially if it really has a cheap Seagull inside. These prices are soon getting to Idealwatches/BestSwiss territory.

[Jimmythree]

quote =

I'd give Paul a benefit of the doubt.

He's such a dope... I'm not 100% sure if he even knows what he's selling, most of the time.

/quote

I think you are right.

It sure would be nice if someone bought one of the suspected 2892 clones (not me!) just to see what it is and then there would be absolute proof.

Otoh (1), the next one just might have a genuine eta 2892 in it. It's slow motion gambling at $600 a shot.

I remember when oversize watches started showing up with the genuine eta 6497 and when they started putting Asian clones in them, the price stayed the same...until buyers caught on.

Otoh (2), I always wondered who knew first...the sellers or the buyers.

I did not have any watches with a 6497 except a Kienzle Atlantis and I doubt if I would ever have known about Asian 6497/8 clones unless The Zigmeister posted about the pallet bridge with one screw in the clone vs two screws in the genuine eta.

Otoh (3), Turns out that I finally wound up with a watch in a trade that had a 6497 clone so I knew how to tell what it was before I put too much $$ in it.

Proof that times change...

I bought 4 nos off brand swiss watches with 2892 movements a few years ago for $100 each and at the time I thought I paid too much.

Next, I bought four nib Oniss with eta 2836 for $55 each and six nib "swiss" Gruen automatics with eta 2824 for $45 each and thought I paid too much for them too.

Otoh (4), I bought some seiko 5 and orients and lost $$.

I had some rolex stuff and sold it when prices took off and thought I hit a home run.

Otoh (5), I sold the genuine rolex stuff way too cheap judging by today's prices.

It's always the 'Otoh' that gets you.

Otoh (6), Otoh (5) sunk my boat.

[t]

i think also that all this dealers don

[By-Tor]

I sincerely hope that's the case here.

I would love to hear the explanation for this one.

[Mickey Padge]

I sincerely hope that's the case here.

I would love to hear the explanation for this one.

Have they been contacted?

[Mickey Padge]

Oh, I wouldn't believe ANY second that the dealers are the ones that are mislead. Do you think they are stupid? Okay, please explain - why were there no lies long time ago? Did the oh so evil rep factories suddenly start to mess around? I can't believe that a dealer would be mislead by his factory - with all the long established relationships and friendships dealers keep talking about... haha.

True enough, they have been in this business long enough, can we really believe they are that naive? Maybe we are the ones being naive?

[DemonSlayer]

I certainly think that the more seasoned 'trusted' sellers here know exactly what movements are in these watches. Judging by some of their responses in the infamous threads started about these lies, its obvious to see that they know somewhat what they're talking about when it comes to watches, they certainly where using this knowledge to defend themselves as to why they were misrepresenting their products.

[Mickey Padge]

This whole discussion is obsolete - it's obvious that dealers are scamming again - nothing's gonna change - they will continue.

Oh btw - somebody need some Grade AAA+++ Panerai? Soon at our dealers - for as low as 2999US$ MSRP.

Hehe, top grade swiss quality A++, with a picture of some crappy myota movement

Precious Time was kind enough to reply to my PM, he offered to get it for me for about $400. Knowing that PT has great quality control, I am sure the watch would have been immaculate. He did say the price is high, considering it is most likely a clone movement.

Quote:

"HI Friend,

Yes no problem. I can order this model for you. However if though its a clones movement, price is still high..

Cost is approx

[FxrAndy]

Mods, is it possible that we could get the dealers to give us a responce here before this turns into a LWL thread, i thinkj it is an important issue that need to be addressed, i know that we ultimatly have the choice of who we deal with and i have exorcised my right since LWL not to buy from people that have shown to be less than honest and as we can all see that this is again one of those issues!

[FxrAndy]

I want to hear what they say, and the more we advertise these lies the more people will use there right not to buy from dishonest people.

[Mickey Padge]

I want to hear what they say, and the more we advertise these lies the more people will use there right not to buy from dishonest people.

I agree, best to keep things out in the open, and if it helps a least a couple of people, and stops them from buying the wrong thing, then it is a worthwhile aim...

[perry563]

Could someone tell me why a rep YM with an Asian movement is selling for 400 bucks? What makes this watch so diffrent? The case is a little thinner? thats it? How does it stack up against the others on the market? Is it that much better?

[By-Tor]

Could someone tell me why a rep YM with an Asian movement is selling for 400 bucks?

That's a good question, and that's what this thread is all about.

So far, we don't have any answers.

[Mickey Padge]

Paul (PAM111) replied to one of my emails regarding this watch.

I asked him how much the Asian watch was, as the "Swiss" version he listed cost too much for me.....

Quote:

"Hi Mike

thank you for waitting

if you want to use Aisa 2892 movement for our item W-3310 price will be USD 339 Free Shippping

thanks

Paul"

Now $339 is the best price so far, and now we know the Asian 2892 version is in the dealers mind, I still think over $300 is too much for Asian clone based watch....

Have the sellers been lazy and uploaded the pictures of the Asian watch and posted it as Swiss? When you buy do you actually get the Swiss ETA2982? I do not know, it is not a gamble I would like to take, considering there are not many/any ETA2892 movements to buy in the market....

If they changed the pictures to show a true ETA2892 movement, then I suppose all would be well. They could then also list the Asian clone version, so there would be two versions to buy...

[Mickey Padge]

Have a look at the thread here: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showto...oob+yachtmaster

In the first post Purtime says:

Quote:

"Just got the case and dial from a factory, saying this is a 1:1 Yacht-Master case, which will accept genuine movement, as I dont have a 3135 movement on hand and I did not try but for sure this dial does not fit an ETA movement (the date window is to the left of the ETA datewheel).

The factory also says they use 904L steel for this case and the bezel is platinum plated, as I dont know how to test so I just skip them.

Hope By-Tor and BK and other experts will comment on this. 200+ mails are waiting for me, I let the pictires talk."

Do you think this is the same case? If it was would the materials "used" explain the expense?

[FxrAndy]

If it was 904l then i should be more expencive as the tools to cut and work the case would have to be different than with 316L ss, but whether i belive it is 904 from china?

[Mickey Padge]

If it was 904l then i should be more expencive as the tools to cut and work the case would have to be different than with 316L ss, but whether i belive it is 904 from china?

I know, but it does go some way to explaining the higher price. It is the factory charging more, if I believe the story.....

Still does NOT explain the movement issue. I would love to see dealers post pictures of the ETA2892 version, and then list two seperate watches, one Swiss, one Asian. Unless of course they are unable to do so, and that again leads down another road.....

[Mickey Padge]

Are you for real - I bet they use 904L as much as they use solid gold for thee reps. Have you got any idea what the toolage costs to properly machine 904L - just because of the YM? It's available from pics for a long time now - and we failed to see other examples with that Steel grade.

Also - the Steel used in "normal" reps is nothing like 316L either.

One more thing - if they indeed would use 904L they would NAME it and announce it with trumpets. Would yo uthink they would release one thing without mentioning it? Even the crappy bigger tube used on the SSD was announced heavily - even though it's utter crap.

Please, do all stop telling that Watchmaker9 overcharges - at least he didn't lie about the bezel assembly - and how many dealers lied about this... without bringing it to the user.

I did not say I believed it, but just that is what it appears the factories are telling the dealers.....

In fact trustytimes site says it is 14K Wrapped Gold!