marrickvilleboy Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 I guess some people will never be convinced. Am I the only person who sees the irony in someone trusting the description 'Genuine Swiss ETA movement' on a product that is carrying a load of countefeit logos, even if it is said in good faith....? lol r11co, so true.. sometimes i wonder if its positive to even share information that we know to other members, I feel like half the times its like an arguement rather than constructive debate. I think thats why alot of the old timers don't even bother posting now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) lol r11co, so true.. sometimes i wonder if its positive to even share information that we know to other members, I feel like half the times its like an arguement rather than constructive debate. I think thats why alot of the old timers don't even bother posting now... Can someone please tell me what is so offensive about the questions I'm asking here? You seem to think, just by asking, I'm smearing the board with cynicisim and doubts about the authenticity of the responses or of the vast safehouse of knowlege here. I'm just asking questions! I got a wonderful response in this thread that illumined the differences between copies, licensed copies etc... but at what price to the general serenity here? Is simple question asking conveying the idea I need to be "convinced" to use your words?Maybe I should plaster smiley faces all over my posts to let you know it's being done in good faith. Do you really believe questions like this are driving old timers off this board? Edited June 23, 2006 by crystalcranium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dachshund Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 My question is not the reliabity of the rep 2892 (ST-18), I have 3 or 4 and all have given good service to this point, but about the repair of the ST-18, do any of you movement experts know if the ST-18 will accept ETA 2892 parts for repair, if so....... fine, if not we have the same problem that we have with DW movements, no parts for repair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marrickvilleboy Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 Can someone please tell me what is so offensive about the questions I'm asking here? You seem to think, just by asking, I'm smearing the board with cynicisim and doubts about the authenticity of the responses or of the vast safehouse of knowlege here. I'm just asking questions! I got a wonderful response in this thread that illumined the differences between copies, licensed copies etc... but at what price to the general serenity here? Is simple question asking conveying the idea I need to be "convinced" to use your words?Maybe I should plaster smiley faces all over my posts to let you know it's being done in good faith. Do you really believe questions like this are driving old timers off this board? @ dachshund from what i can still remember, majority of the parts can be interchanged, but i think the balance wheel is right-studded, while the ETA is left-studded. Even the ETA 2892 stem can be used with the ST-18. I remember comparing the two movements a while back and if i got them mixed up, I would have easily build a combination of "ETA-ST 2892-18". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dachshund Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 Marrikvilleboy Thanks, good information to have. @Pug Got it fixed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r11co Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) Can someone please tell me what is so offensive about the questions I'm asking here? OK, so let us go back to the question then.. What indication do we have that [the ST-18] is a high tolerance copy and not something manufactured to look like the 2892 but without the acuracy and longevity? Since the rotor hub on the 2892 is the signature landmark I use to identify it, how do we know Seagull isn't putting nice earings (rotor) on a pig? How about the experiences of several thread contributors who own these moevments, one of whom has dismantled one and compared it first hand to a genuine 2892? Was that not good enough for you? Apologies for the exasperated tone, but I really don't know what there was further to discuss except that the rest of your question (not in bold) seems to just be digging dirt that isn't there. What does it take to convince somebody? If the movement factory get their little 'ETA' engraving stamp out and bump one on there for you will that make things instantly better? Edited June 23, 2006 by r11co Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 OK, so let us go back to the question then.. How about the experiences of several thread contributors who own these moevments, one of whom has dismantled one and compared it first hand to a genuine 2892? Was that not good enough for you? Apologies for the exasperated tone, but I really don't know what there was further to discuss except that the rest of your question (not in bold) seems to just be digging dirt that isn't there. What does it take to convince somebody? If the movement factory get their little 'ETA' engraving stamp out and bump one on there for you will that make things instantly better? Good Lord...Hopeless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r11co Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) Good Lord...Hopeless Huh? I don't know where you are going with your point, but my point is that you were fishing for some dirt on these excellent movements. Why exactly were you doing that? Is it so that you can confirm your 'acquired knowledge' and go with the ill-informed consensus that all Asian movements are suspect? The fact is that many of the Asian movements on the general market (and in some of our reps) are the equal or in fact the equivalent of the so called 'Swiss' movements that some of us pay a premium for in order to achieve a misguided sense of peace of mind. The contributors to this thread are going some way to dispel these ill-founded fears. I'll go one step further and say that often the thing you are paying extra for is the very thing you believe you should be avoiding, and you have no way of knowing for certain the provenance of any movement, 'Swiss' or otherwise, and neither do the majority of the dealers selling these watches. The only people who do know are those who work on the watch movements, and those people are the only ones you should be listening to. As I said, the classic example was the manual chrono 'Lemanina' movement that people were paying extra for in the misguided belief that it was a superior 'Swiss' movement. It was an Asian Venus copy, but it took a strip-down and detailed analysis from one of our members here to reveal that. The sudden discovery that it wasn't what people thought it was didn't however turn it overnight into a 'pig' It remains one of the most reliable and well constructed movements currently in our reps. Edited June 23, 2006 by r11co Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 (edited) Huh? I don't know where you are going with your point, but my point is that you were fishing for some dirt on these excellent movements. Why exactly were you doing that? Is it so that you can confirm your 'acquired knowledge' and go with the ill-informed consensus that all Asian movements are suspect? The fact is that many of the Asian movements on the general market (and in some of our reps) are the equal or in fact the equivalent of the so called 'Swiss' movements that some of us pay a premium for in order to achieve a misguided sense of peace of mind. The contributors to this thread are going some way to dispel these ill-founded fears. I'll go one step further and say that often the thing you are paying extra for is the very thing you believe you should be avoiding, and you have no way of knowing for certain the provenance of any movement, 'Swiss' or otherwise, and neither do the majority of the dealers selling these watches. The only people who do know are those who work on the watch movements, and those people are the only ones you should be listening to. As I said, the classic example was the manual chrono 'Lemanina' movement that people were paying extra for in the misguided belief that it was a superior 'Swiss' movement. It was an Asian Venus copy, but it took a strip-down and detailed analysis from one of our members here to reveal that. The sudden discovery that it wasn't what people thought it was didn't however turn it overnight into a 'pig' It remains one of the most reliable and well constructed movements currently in our reps. Where I was going and the point of the asking was to get information like you just provided, albeit without the ire and indignation. I'm sorry the "earings on a pig" which was an attempt at humor, was taken by you as an indictment of the Asian watch industry. Edited June 23, 2006 by crystalcranium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted June 23, 2006 Report Share Posted June 23, 2006 Weasel words CC. The above comments come from people who have owned watches containing these movements and they are relaying their (good) experiences. Heck - Marickvilleboy has even worked on them. You know these movements are good because people who have them are telling you they are. Who is it has been telling you they aren't? I have on my wrist right now an aqua terra that i bought from a dealer here that i thought, and was advertixed as eta 2892, it turned out that it is a seagull st-18, now i have a gen AT here and for the difference in price i would get the seagull powered one every time. Why? I have regulated it to COSC standards no problem. 6 months and still reliable so far water proof with swimming ect. who was it from, well that is for me to know, but i am happy with what i got for my money, the watch is great, and the movement is as good as a 2892 IMHO. ok the finish does not quite match up to the gen but neither does the price. so the ST-18 works and it works well, it is a very good compromise between a myota and 2892 and i would but it a bit above a gen ETA 2824, but hey im no expert but this is my most worn watch and i can compare it every day with the gen. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasng Posted June 26, 2006 Report Share Posted June 26, 2006 The ST-18 has been working very well for me recently, it functions like a genuine 2892, the movement keeps time +/- 1 second a day, and the hand sweeps as smoothly as a genuine 2892 as well. I could only tell the the difference was the lack of the ETA engravings, but I don't care, as long as it runs well and reliably. I can vouch for all the members who write good reviews about this movement, it really is that good. I think the notion of "genuine ETA" movement being better is pure [censored], as quite a few Asian mvoements are as reliable, if not more reliable than ETA movements. The Venus copy also comes to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted June 26, 2006 Report Share Posted June 26, 2006 quite a few Asian mvoements are as reliable, if not more reliable than ETA movements. The Venus copy also comes to mind. I'm glad you say that as I've got a Moon Watch on the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted June 26, 2006 Report Share Posted June 26, 2006 I'm glad you say that as I've got a Moon Watch on the way. Are you going to 'freeze" the 6 o'clock subdial? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted June 26, 2006 Report Share Posted June 26, 2006 Are you going to 'freeze" the 6 o'clock subdial? I'm considering it, yes. At first, I'll let it run and see if it annoys me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penguin_M Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 Very insightful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doug Posted June 27, 2006 Report Share Posted June 27, 2006 What is/are the main difference(s) between the 2892 and 2824 ETAs? From what I'm reading, I infer that the 2892 is superior in some way. Is this true and, if so, how/why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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