crystalcranium

Welcome...Happy Holidays!!!

I love the sound of an audible automatic winding. I used to be facinated by the sound my Dad's Girard Perageaux made when I waved it next to my ear when I was a kid. Want a quiet watch, buy a quartz!

In 4 years, I have helped create 2 collector monsters and at least a half dozen fans with potental. One guy got it real bad buying about $3500 in reps over about 3 months.

Hence, my comment to the OP that he wouldn't be "screaming fake" if he took off his fake Rollie before he went swimming!

I'm just an old wuss. Yes, I take off my expensive genuine diver's watch and put on an infinately disposable and replaceable Seiko diver when I go swimming. There's no way my $5000 genuine gets anywhere near water even if it is 1000M tested. Just too much of a risk. Do I think this screams fake??? No, it screams paranoid genuine owner without enough insurance. Your statement is full of disclaimers about the vigorousness of swimming, depth of diving etc....I have had 150M guaranteed genuines fog playing in the surf and fog on my sweaty wrist. There is no way I subject an uncontrolled QC replica near water, greased and checked or not. Do it at your own risk and more power to you if they survive. Just not worth it IMHO.

Richard, you are deep man!!!

This is my typical rant about WR. Remember, this is a replica designed to give the appearance of a Rolex but as far as performance....it's an unwaranteed watch assembled in an uncontrolled enviornment with NO QC so expect nothing as far as WR. Now, these can be had pre serviced for WR to 50M which in the real world of WR means you can wash your hands with them on but, if even these serviced watches fail WR....where are you gonna go??? They are almost certainly trash if this happens. Best advice I can give you is to buy a Seiko Diver for your water adventures and save the fake Rollie for the dry confines of the local bar where it can perform at its' optimal best...attracting chicks.

Agreed. I can't imagine someone in the basement of their grandmother's house in the outskirts of Bejing assembling 1000 near perfect replicas a week making sure he obtains the caseback with the tiny error on it to cover his ass in case Rolex comes knocking.

I don't know Richard, we're screaming for perfect forgeries and declaring how we'll pay top dollar for them but so far, no dice. I find it hard to believe it's because of fear of the hammer. There are plenty of other business that cater to the illegal wants and desires of the public without fear of retribution. To me, a perfect forgery (one that could seriously threaten value of the genuines on the market) would have to be indistinguishable inside and out right down to the accuracy and traceability of serial numbers and movement caliber. Anything less than that is a replica and anyone who buys a replica and pays a genuine price for it is not a responsible buyer. The level of accuracy we are talking about here is not forgery class, not by a long shot and in my opinion, that class of copy is well beyond the ability of the replica state of the art as it exists today or will exist in the near furure. Now, if seagul makes a 3135 copy that's close, that might make for some mischeif

I have both and have had both accused and the fake call out is more fun and more facinating to play with. When a jerk who thinks any expensive watch that sparkles must be a knock off accuses my 98%+ replicas of being such I simply look him in the eye and say "You think this is a fake?" Most of the time, the next words out of his mouth are "That's a real.....???!!!" So far, I have never had a replica knowlegeable person call out a replica and I wouldn't care if they did. I would shake hands and say "Mon Ami!!!" My discussions with interested and facinated newcomers to the world of high quality replicas have been far more satisfying than talking about my genuine Omega SMP Chrono to another Omega owner. I think the world of high quality Swiss watches is facinating but I also think the world of 1/20th priced 98% copies holds it's own special, a little bit naughty appeal.

And those operations and knowlege of them is something I'm so grateful to RWG for because without the insider information it IS a crapshoot. I hope my much hoped for "next step in our evolution" as replica collectors will be a larger community of connected assemblers we have direct access to. It would be ideal to request custom high quality assemblies and allow the producers the security of a large enthusiastic consumer base

That vid was quite an eye opener. Now, it could be that our dealers here, who have become the cream of the crop, have terrific networks that allow them contact with reliable assemblers that have access to the best parts etc...but the process is still a home baked industry. There is no "Little Le Locle" in the rural hills in China turning out quality controlled 99% reps. The reality is probably a network of highly skilled and well networked mom and pop operations that have themselves interlaced with the best decentralized parts manufacturers to produce, while they can, a higher quality product. But this is why there's an ever changing ideal. The product is variable because it is at the whim of so many uncontrolled influences. I guess when we look at a new generation of a replica and wonder why so many things we wanted addressed have been, but several things we took for granted qualitywise have fallen off, the answer lies in this web of suppliers and assemblers. Better cases and crowns this time around but they couldn't get the old terrific dials....is a common complaint and understandable scenario.

Rose Gold FA Jones

I agree with TVT that subtle nuanced differences that might allow you to say "Well, technically its not a copy" go right out the window when you print "Rolex" on the dial. The reason replicas have a variety of variations from the ideal in the 95%+ accuracy range is the lack of QC, no financial incentive, no centralized start to finish parts production and assembly, ..etc. The half dozen or so "perfect" reps we see are better controled in these departments but also suffer from the same variations in quality genuines have. I don't recall who posted it, but there was a facinating comparison of vintage dials here that had obvious variability in quality, variations that would have us howling if they were in a replica.

Yo Zeus, you're not exactly endearing yourself to those gracious enough to take the time to make suggestions. This isn't Bloomingdales, you're not a rich customer who needs to be coddled and were not abuseable sales people. A post like this one where you toss off well meaning and voluntary suggestions with "No...too big...No too ugly...Nope...just don't like it" like a spoiled debutante isn't going to make you any friends here Not to claim to have any handle on message board etiquette here but I would think the manerly thing to do would be to let the suggestions play out, thank everyone for their contributions, and make a decision you're happy with.

The Tissot Seastar 1000 is a rock. I almost bought one last month but i already have a Seiko automatic diver so it would be a luxury purchase.

I think I'm getting a Hamilton automatic and a Speedmaster X-33 replica in the watch department on Xmas but I've also written Santa for the following. Another display case winder for the ever growing collection A watchmaker's tool kit including loupe, micro tweezers and hand pullers. A subscription to WatchTime. I'm looking forward to Xmas morning!!!!! PS. My wife is not being neglected. Shes getting a Hamilton Vintage Art Deco ladies watch and about a bazillion $$$$$s in jewelry from our favorite jewelry store. For what I spent on her, she could have had an 18K Ladies Datejust but......she hates the look of Rolex. "Looks like Timex" is her favorite thing to say to me.

I think I understand your post.... Yes, Invictca makes some decent Rolex look alike ripoffs. You would be better served by going for quality over looks. Any of the Seiko 17-21 jewel automatics will run forever. They are the most underrated movements on the planet. If they were Swiss made, we'd be talking iconic status. Tissot, Hamilton, Accutron et al make very reliable ETA powered automatics, a little more expensive that your budget but in range, that are great lookers. How about a radical idea????!!!! A vintage GP!!! Puts you in Haute Horology class for about $250

Well, I'm not going to......ah what the hell!! The second hand flaw bugs you. You have the disease. It's the crooked line that has worked its way into your bloodstream and it will be all you see every time you look at this replica. Don't feel too bad, your affliction is common and the diagnosis is easy. Delusional rationalizations like a generic movement that has gears found in just about every cheap replica on the planet will fool most everyone but a wrongly colored second hand on a watch that hardly anyone knows will fool no one are part of the syndrome. The fact is that this watch isn't anywhere near the holy grail of replication you think it is,...OK, maybe it's a little closer if you don't take it off and show anyone the back, and the rep manufacturers not getting the second hand right on a $98 copy isn't the major dropped ball "Why the hell did they do this" you might think it is. It's just that that damn second hand has gotten into your brain and has ruined this watch for you. Whatever you do, don't go to the advanced stages of the disease, spending $150 to have a custom hand fitted only to have the dust that gets under the crystal during the work become the next obsessional flaw!!!

I would get it done quickly before that 1.7mm total dimmension difference begins to bug ya!!!! Do you realize that this is such a minute difference in a small production watch that the number of people on the planet who would actually recognize the fault could probably fit in your living room and most of them would be production line employees of JC???? And why would this minute transgression on the front bug the hell out of you when the rotor modified Asian 21j movement visible through the case back looks nothing like the genuine?????? The stuff that crawls under the skin of some collectors and the stuff that doesnt never ceases to amaze me. All reps Have Flaws. Find One With Flaws You Can Live With And Buy It!

I think and hope when the crackdown does come down, it will be on the open market nature of sales and not on production which, apparently, is decentralized and underground. What it probably means for us is higher risk and prices in the future.

Unlimited, something with a tourbi....but I could never wear an unlimited budget watch. Like a rare restored classic car, I'd sit in it in the garage but that's about it. Realistic extravagance that I would actuall wear.....Zenith Open Class El Primero in Rose Gold. About 10K

Welcome!!!! A small head's up. You have come to the coolest fraternity at Replica University. In college, you might have pause to walk up to the coolest frat house on campus, start pounding on the door shouting "Hey guys, what kind'o beer you got on tap here. Let me in. I wanna start drinking!!!!!" Most of the seasoned vets here are terrific people, full of information and wisdom and willing to share......but you sort of have to earn your stripes first. Eight hundred posts since I got here and I consider myself a newcomer still. I hope you'll be another in a long line of passionate forum members and collectors!!!

Correct, the original thread was asked to get opinions on what is the best 1:1 copy. I'm happy it's inspired so much enthusiasm. With so many new close 1:1 copies, the state of the art changes almost daily.