b16a2

Nice picture, and welcome!

I've got mine on order from Puretime. Good communication, as always. The pics and reviews really do prove this to be one of the best reps available!

No, but if I owned a Maserati I'd sell it, buy an NSX, and the Ferrari watch

The review is great Neil, and the watch.....well the pictures speak for themselves! Incredible!

'Swiss Quality', 'A++' are all marketing terms to induce the customers. As MickyPadge says, steer clear.

That's fair enough, and yes forgiveness should be given to those who make a mistake. It shouldn't be to those who knowingly misrepresent products to increase their revenue. Aqua Terra, B&R, unserviced watches that are meant to be serviced. I don't consider those to be mistakes......

We have actually done this, to no avail, this was the course of action after the Aqua Terra incident which they STILL haven't changed.

i realize we have asked repeatedly that they correct descriptions for the aqua terra and the b&r.....my whole point is this: ask them again, with the understanding that if they do not comply, they will be banned (as i said in my original post).

I see where you are coming form here, but I believe that this is one time too many. If we don't take action against them now, then they are going to continue knowing that they have got off lightly. They have scammed people, the should be punished. They have had two chances already, lets show them that we mean it this time.

I don't think that Angus has had a massive role in this personally. Banning him on the basis of being in a cartel is too harsh. I may have missed something, but I don't recall him being involved in any deceit of any kind. The only thing I read was that he was co-operating with them for marketing and distributing their products?

So it's coming out on April Fool's Day? You sure?

And what's a ceramic HBB?

Ceramic Hublot Big Bang

This would have been a great thing to implement prior to all of these occurences, as mentioned in the three threads we have had over the past few months. It has now got to a point where something needs to be done, preventative measures will be useless, the harm has already been caused.

When we get back to a point where we were before these scandalous acts (if we do) , then it would be worth considering to employ such a system.

Three strikes and you're out sounds a little civilised for an American system

I thought something along the lines of an outright ban would be the American policy, and you know what, I would fully agree with it! They deserve a ban, even if only temporary for what they have done!

P.S. The American thing is only friendly banter, they're not my views in anyway

I have seen conclusive evidence that "serviced" watches from one of the cartel members are not serviced at all. Bone dry!

Another fraudulent act perpetrated on unknowing buyers.

That is something that has always worried me. Ask me about the look of a watch I'm fine. Ask me about the internals of one, and the in and outs, Im not so good! I have always bought a watch without being serviced, and if I want it serviced I will get it serviced, then i know the work has been done.

If this is the case, again price comes into it indirectly. We're paying too much for a product that is of lesser value = Edge's point, we're being lied to!!!

I used to have such high regards for the few dealers mentioned here, but over the past few days I am gradually feeling cheated by them. I hope that this thread, along with the previous white lies and B&R thread and the current poll leads to some action that will make a change in their ways!

It makes the dial so clear. Looks like there is no crystal. It just seems to add an air of quality to the watch for me.

Where's PaneraiLord? (just kidding hehe)

Welcome back Mark!

Im not too sure either............

Yes that the predecessor to the Ultimate. A good watch, but not the Ultimate one you are looking for. Below is the ultimate.... and a way of telling

A quick way to tell is on the top sub dial. You see the number 10, directly after that is a mark, whereas on the predecessor there is no marker there. And the lack of AR. The two ways I use to distinguish the two, there are more, but they're the most obvious for me.

Maybe they just upped the prices because they've decided to do something about improving quality control?

I don't think QC will ever be a big factor for the manufacturers. Threaded crown stems on Ultimate PO, badly applied lume on Steelfish, wonky markers on other watches. (part of buying a rep)

They have however improved the aesthetics of the watches being released, but the view is the prices have not been increased proportionately with this increased standard of look, the problem is the underlying cartel possibility. This is particularly evident in the email from Joshua that was posted, and the fact that another member can get the AR'd Steelfish for alot cheaper. I would like to know who! I have an idea who it could be, as a dealer on RWI is offering an Ultimate PO, Swiss for $165 (maybe a few dollars more or less, I cant remember exact price)

EDIT - I have left the above statement the same otherwise it won't make sense, but the dealer has upped his price, so it is now $200. So it is still cheaper than the other dealers are currently offering, but ascheap as it was.

care to share who?

Ok this is going to become just another reference point for a future topic if we don't take a stand now. We have some substantial material to point towards something scandalous. If that email is authentic (not questioning it in anyway) then that is a true nail in the coffin for that dealer!

We need to have a poll to make anything move on. We can sit here and put points forward between ourselves, but we need to get numbers. Numbers of people who are willing to take action. When we have evidence of willing participation of this forum, then we can take a stand and think about a course of action. Until then, if people are going to continue as normal, then this fine effort to highlight a discrepancy in our community will go to waste.

What other scams have occured aaprt from the B&R? Do you mean other watches that have had different movements to ones advertised?

Ok I started off reading the thread about a cartel, and got to page 4 and it seemed to be all about a slanging match about the B&R, haven't we been there before!

The B&R project was a disappointment for me. It supposedly came with a good movement and superlume . Like has been mentioned, the photo's of the movement were lacking, but does this point the finger to the dealer knowingly removing the picture and selling it as something it is not? It's circumstancial, but very suspicious.

Sinc this watch we haven't seen anything like it happen again. So was it to test the waters, or was it a pure mistake? Even if it were a case of testing the water, of course the dealers are not going to admit it was a case of seeing if they could get away with it, it would destroy the trust we are looking for.

I happen to believe it was a big [censored] up. Mistakes were made, issues were raised. As Edge has said, it is something we can all use to make decision for the future, BUT it is ridiculous to keep bringing it up in such an aggressive manner. It is going to get us no-where.

If we have a problem with a cartel group, price fixing and what the hell else I don't know, lets address this issue, maybe in light of the B&R issue, but for a whole post to become a slanging match between TWG (who is the only dealer who was in the [censored] with the B&R who has come forth and willing to post here) and us as the community.

We are a community and need to stick together. Thiis our safe haven for buying quality replicas from qualty dealers. - Agreed

We need to address the possibility of the B&R being more than a mistake, and make sure it doesn't happen again - Agreed

We need to pull together and sort out an issue of price fixing if there is one - Agreed

We need to try and increase the dealers quality of service to how it was just a year ago - Agreed

What we don't need is to [censored] off the dealers, and for them to [censored] us off. Yes there are plenty of other dealers who are there to supply a great service, but I have had good service from Joshua, TWG and Angus in the past, and I for one don't want to see their services disappear. Let's sort this out constructively!

However, if there is some evidence that does conclude there is something sinister going on, it should be put forward. It would make people's lives alot easier in understanding the bigger picture!

He's under the name 'Puretime'.

The previous gen of Chronomat is available with numerical markers, but the watch itself isn't as accurate as this new Ultimate model.

They're pretty rare now. If you're after the closed factory version, then you'll have to wait until someone on the board sells it, which is unlikely due to its rarity. If one does come up it will be like an auction in here

:yucky:

It is a beautiful watch. Only thing is the sub dial spacing would be completely wrong.

You could allways rent a gen and return a rep in its place

The scary thing is with the quality of things like the Chronomat and the Steelfish it's probably not that unfeasible!

haha, I really thought I was going mad!! Should have realised I had been had! What a numpty

It is a beautful watch (the gen that is ) It is my holy grail watch.