freddy333

Well done review (especially for a 1st timer). Too bad the rep is not up to the standards set by the reviewer. One minor correction I would offer - I believe this is the 3rd or 4th SDDS rep to hit the market (at least that I have seen).

Another interesting idea & I appreciate your input, but this is the problem

Nanuq - Now THAT is a brilliant idea. Unfortunately, a bit beyond my skill & equipment level to execute. If I only had a machine shop & about a dozen cases to experiment on.......... But very clever!!!!

TeeJay, I think you missed a bit of the story (or I am not explaining it well enough). Yes, the red ring is the only part that needed to be lowered to allow the insert to lock down into the bezel. The thing is that I have already ground the red ring down as far as I can without compromising the lip that runs around its outer edge that the bezel spring needs to lock onto. The problem is that the red ring is still slightly too tall, but I cannot remove any more material from it (no matter what I use or what angle I remove it from) without damaging/removing what is left of that 'lip' (you cannot see the lip in the last picture because it is hidden by the bezel). Do you see how the bottom of the bezel (green line) clips around the bottom edge of the area in blue (that is the right-angled 'ring' I keep referring to that is part of the front opening of the case)? I ground down the blue area, leaving just enough of the right-angle 'lip' for the bezel to clip to. If I remove any more material from the blue area, the bezel will not stay on the case I am not sure if I am explaining it clearly enough, but, again, the entire problem is centered around the fact that the red ring is blocking the insert from sitting down deep enough into the bezel, but it is impossible to lower the red ring any further without losing the ability to lock the bezel onto the case. Does that make sense?

But there is no vertical metal left adjacent to the crystal around which to place a retaining ring even if I had 1. Remember, the only vertical metal near the crystal has been ground down to a nub (with just enough of the right-angled 'lip' left for the spring inside the bezel to latch onto & keep the bezel attached to the case). While not a perfect solution, I am thinking that either Ubi's suggestion of double-sided tape (which I am somewhat hesitant to use because removal of the insert would result in the paint on the underside of the insert remaining on the tape (instead of on the underside of the insert) or a bead of silicone sealant around the perimeter of the bezel (so the insert would be semi-permanently held onto the bezel only around its edge) might do the trick. I still think there is a better solution lurking out there in the ether somewhere, but it remains to be discovered by someone more clever than I am.

If it always sticks at the same point on the dial, then 1 of the hands is probably coming into contact with something on the dial or another hand. An easy fix once you remove the movement/dial from the case & locate the 'sticking' point. Most likely 1 of the hands is not level with the plane of the dial, so it will need to be nudged up or down to bring it into alignment. Be sure that none of the index markers on the dial are loose or sticking out further from the dial than they should.

Nice spotting. Thanks.

Daytona beater today (modeled by a friend)

Which Rolex model & can you post a good, clear macro (close up) pic of the problem area of your bracelet?

I am assuming you tried winding the watch to be sure the mainspring is fully charged? If not, manually wind it 40 turns & then see how it runs. Gravity & the movement's location in space can affect its running. This is why many movements are advertised as being 'Tested in x number of positions'. A properly running watch movement should keep accurate time with the dial up (the position your watch is probably in when you are not wearing it), the dial facing down, the dial facing sideways with the crown pointing up, the dial facing sideways with the crown pointing down, etc. A poorly designed or maintained movement may run properly in 1 position, but run badly (or not at all) in another. Your watch appears to fall into the latter category & may require servicing. Probably nothing major (clean/lube), but it is not something that you can fix yourself (unless you have the proper tools & knowledge to disassemble, clean, lube & reassemble your watch).

You would need to remove the movement from the case & then remove the hands & dial to gain access to the date change components. With the dial off, if you can run through all of the dates without any problem, that means the date wheel is coming into contact with the bottom of the dial. This may be due to the date wheel being bent or misaligned. If it gets stuck on certain dates without the dial, then there may be a problem with the date change mechanism, most likely the parts need to be cleaned & lubricated. I do not think there is a tutorial that explains how to troubleshoot this, but any watchmaker (willing to work on reps) should be able to diagnose & fix it.

I meant send the watch to Ziggy. But I was not aware there is a customs problem when exporting out of the EU & into Canada. If so, you will need to find a local watchsmith. Sorry for the confusion.

After I switched browsers, I found the link to your previous post & got the explanation from there. And as others have said, that is the nature of these movements. I find that some of them have more 'play' or 'slop' (imperfect machining/fit) within the components than others. Short of remanufacturing the movement, I am not aware of any way to stop the hand from jumping when reset. The important thing is that it resets correctly.

Definitely not Biden. Were it Biden, he would not say 'Ouch'. He would say, 'Don't put words in my mouth. What I said was, 'Ouch, that hurts. But it's not up to Congress to react every time an Alaskan bear wants to go fishing. Nor is it my personal purview, or responsibility, to exploit, or outline, or explain the situation as it is a global issue with far-reaching goals. What was the question?..........Do I have any pets? Yes, goldfish. Now, that's what I said.'

TeeJay - The inner blue ring is not related to the insert problem (nor is the outer blue ring), so it would not matter whether it was ground down or not. I modified this pic to show where the crystal sits (in relation to the 3 rings)

Great idea, but it will not work on the Silix case, because the crystal sits inside of the vertical ring. On the Silix, the bezel resides where your crystal is, so a retaining ring would not work. Unfortunately. Also, because the bezel is designed to fit the wider right-angled 'lip' of the case opening, if you grind off the 'lip' & cut another groove into the side of the narrower ring shaft, the bezel would then be too large. That would bring me back to square 1 - in search of another bezel/insert to fit a reduced diameter groove. But a clever idea.

Right. Like a Rolex case. Unfortunately, there are 2 things that would prohibit my doing that with the Silix case. 1st, the crystal sits inside (as opposed to outside) the vertical ring. 2nd, the ring's height had to be reduced in order to give the insert room to sit low enough into the bezel & there is not enough rise left to be able to fit a retaining ring even if the bezel were not in the way. I superimposed the Silix case over your drawing so you can see how its construction differs from your case

I was focusing solely on the finish of the plates & bridges & completely missed that spring, but I think that is more of an assembly error than a key to the movement's age or source. No? You are not bothered by the rough finish of the pillar below the balance wheel? That is something I have never seen on the dozen or so V72s I have handled here. The pillar, along with most of the other plates & bridges, just does not look like a well-crafted part to me. And I have been going over & over the pics of gen Daytona movements in my archive & none of them have a finish like the movement in my 1st post above. Worn or dirty, yes, but not that unfinished/rough texture I see below the balance. Not to mention the similar grain of all the flat surfaces & their pristine appearance. That is what makes me suspicious. But, as we all know, until/unless 1 of us has the opportunity to disassemble 1 of Honpo's 6263s, there is no way to know for sure.

I cannot quite make out any microstellas in this picture since the balance is in motion (while there are no microstellas in evidence in my pic), but this movement looks like a gen due to the overall patina/wear on most of the components & typical (smooth) finish of the Valjoux pillar plate. But if you compare the finish of the pillar plate below the balance wheel on this pic with the finish of the movement in the pic I posted above, I think you will see there is a difference.

I would, but the ring on this case is not there to retain the crystal, it is there to retain the bezel. If I grind it down any more than I already have, I will grind off what is left of the right-angled 'lip' that runs around its outer circumference (which is what the bezel spring latches onto) & the bezel will not stay on the case. Great idea, but I do not have the tool or experience using 1. That would work. But I would pretty much be starting over trying to locate a bezel that will fit both the insert & this case.

When you install the bezel, the spring inside it expands as you slide the bezel over that ring. As soon as the spring reaches the lower lip of the ring, it contracts & locks the bezel down on top of the ring. I have reduced the height of the ring by grinding down the top of the ring to the dotted red line in the picture. This leaves just enough material for the spring inside the bezel to latch/lock onto. Trouble is that the ring is still a bit too tall & it comes into contact with the underside of the insert. The problem is that if I remove any more material from the top of the ring (to lower its profile so the insert can sit lower into the bezel), I will weaken or break the right-angle 'lip' on the side of the ring that the bezel spring needs to lock onto. I need to find a way that will either allow the insert to sit lower into the bezel without removing more material from the ring, or I have to find a way to 'lock' the insert into place in the bezel even though the insert is only contacting the bezel around its edge.

Thanks. I am sure that 1 of us will come up with the right solution.

Yes, that makes complete sense. The effect would be similar to using silicone sealant.

Correct. The outer lip (part of the bezel that holds the insert) is not related to this problem & should not be modded in any way. The inner lip (the 'ring' I have been referring to) is what is causing the problem. The bezel insert is supposed to fit down into the bottom of the bezel, but that ring, or inner lip, as you called it, is sticking up where the backside of the insert is supposed to be. The red ring is in the way. The ring, as you see it in the picture you photoshopped, has already been ground down as far as I can get it without damaging the lip that runs around its outer circumference (this is the other lip that the bezel spring latches onto). Do you see the flat-sided wire spring that runs around the inside of the bezel Well, that spring latches onto the underside of that lip that runs around the side of the red ring (the 'inner lip' as you called it). The following picture shows the ring you marked in red before I ground it down. The right-angle below the top forms a 'lip'.....it is this lip that the bezel spring latches onto The bezel spring latches onto the bottom of that lip. As you can see, there is very little material left between the dotted red line (the current top of that ring) and the right-angled lip below it (covered by the blue arrow). There is also a small black rubber gasket that sits in the groove, which you can see in this picture (the gasket is pushed down & out of the way by the bezel spring when the bezel is installed). The outer ring (blue) is not related to this problem. You can ignore the blue ring.

I am not sure I see how removing material from the top of the ring with sandpaper would be any different than removing it (faster) with a dremel & grinding bit, as I did. The problem was/is that if I remove any more material from the ring (regardless of what I use to remove the material or from which direction I remove the material from) I will weaken or remove the lip that runs around the outer perimeter of the ring. As it is, there is just a fraction of a millimeter left between the top edge of the lip & the top of the ring. That is, if I remove any more material from the top of the ring (to lower the ring's height), I will probably lose the lip that the bezel spring needs to latch onto. Does that make sense? Or am I still misunderstanding you? What does everyone think of this idea -- I could apply a bead of silicone sealant (not grease) around the circumference of the bezel......right along the inside outer edge, where the edge of the insert contacts the inner edge of the bezel. The silicone would fill in the empty space between the floor of the bezel & the underside of the insert and, when dry, should hold the insert in place, while still allowing me to be able to remove the insert should the need arise?