Watchmeister

Interesting info. Titanium has been more expensive than SS for some time. It is also more difficult to work with. For starters ti is formed in a pressurized environment. It also is much harder and thus harder to work with so what you say is not surprising. On the 2892's I am guessing the thin comment relates to the movement itself. 2892's are very thin relative to other standard ETA and rep movements. The base movement is often used with various modules (chrono, PR, etc.) for exactly that reason. It is no surprise that PAM's first auto watches were largely 2893/3 based as it allowed them to use the same standard handwind case.

D- Would you pay your image cave bill. I wanted to see your pics. I have been thinking about this one. I was also curious to compare to gen. Palladium is the poor man's platinum but still a beautiful metal in its own right. I have found it typically shows as a smilar color but a little more muted.

The PVD RXW looks great. Wear that one well. The first one is fantasy but that is a nice homage piece is well.

Lots of great ideas here. But it might be helpful if we knew what your favorite reps/watches are. What watches get the most wrist time? It would also be helpful if we knew how important resale value is. If it is important it narrows down the options significantly (even within brands). Let's start with - do you tend to wear 44mm PAM's and Brietlings or 37-40mm Rolexes, Omegas, etc.

No it is not possible to get a Graham with a real chronograph for $150. They cost $300 +. Now that you are here you have a wealth of information and reputable dealers here. If it sounds too good to be true.... I am sorry to hear of the mishap though. If you don't want to double down and your conclusion is he sold you something as described than you might ask the original seller if he has the real chronograph version and is willing to allow you to ship the original back. Then again you are probably better off chalking it up to experience.

It shouldn't impact anyone but be forewarned that if you are planning on using your crown with a manual wind (1.2) buy 1.2. There is not enough room for a stem adapter in a 44mm PAM for the adapter when using a 6497. Otherwise you will need to get custom stems which taper from 1.2 to 0.9 which can be done but you are better off getting the right one in the first place.

Ubi- Just reverse the front double cover and use a bookmark.

And those watches are only hand winds.

Congrats on a great project. VBD does do fabulous work. Wear that one well.

VDB- Beautiful work - as always. - Kruz

This weekend I picked up the latest double issue of Revolution magazine. Now I don't go out of my way to read watch magazines but they have an interesting section interviewing the movement specialists at the various Haute manufacturers. It is not only an interesting read to see what the watch companies are up to and where they are headed. It also is a fairly good way to learn about the various complications and materials being used in watches - whether it is the new Gyro-tourbillons and the various watch companies methods of adapting a traditional tourbi to rotate on multiple axis for better functionality in a wristwatch or the various methods of providing shock protection through materials or even use of "air shocks" to the use of new materials in upcoming watches. Too many things to bring up but I thought that for those who were interested it is a fascinating read - but it does take quite a while. At least for me. This is not going to improve your rep buying but it is fairly interesting.

This one is not a candidate for relume.

Thanks guys. I am satisfied with the crown on this one. You can argue whether it is gen or not but it is the only older crown available that fits perfectly into the gen case tube/crown guard set-up. T's new crowns are absolutely beautiful but they are built specifically for a rep case tube and as such don't have a spring loaded mechanism. On Luminor Frankens no "pop" - no Panerai for me. I may give in one day and put on a newer gen crown but they are getting tougher and tougher for me to source so I tread carefully with them.

Second pic is a different watch. And yes the first rotor pic looks like a rep.

RR- Congrats on the hands.

No question 48 teeth and designed to fit rep case tubes is the way to go. On the Turkish crowns everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I just counted a spare automatic one and I found and it was also 52 teeth. I can tell you that the crown spring mechanism is virtually identical to that on today's crowns except that it is not sheathed. At best they were an earlier design and at worst they were rejects from a particular sub-contractor to Panerai. I did do enough research on some of the other items he bought at the same time (which seemed to have come from one source that had gone belly-up) and the majority of other gen items (Omega bracelets and crowns, etc.) dated back to no later than the early 2000's. I did chat with the seller at the time we did the group buy. He had no idea what they were or what they were for. I now see that his description on the few remaining odd pieces he has left actually tell folks what models each crown is good for. Most importantly, 48 teeth it is.

I thought it was 117. 492 was the predecessor version.

Agreed on the hands. Here are a couple of gen pics: I waa told that if you send in your gen for servicing these are the hands you get back for any of the 2893 GMT's but I have no idea whether that is true. The other mystery is how well the 63 rep dial lays out against the gen. Someone who had looked fairly closely at both had mentioned that this particular rep dial is pretty far off in terms of layout and that would impact the visual layout of hands against the dial. I did ask Ziggy to measure out the difference between the gen lume hands and a set of t hands and other than the placement of the dot on the seconds hand the overall length differences were miniscule. That is what causes me to believe that the issue is as much the dial as the hands.

I don't know who made it but Eddie was selling his 4rth generation Fiddy's with the box-set as an option for what was then a very reasonable price.

Freddy- It depends from which angle you are coming on with this one. If you are a long time fanatic of traditional Rolexes it is a honker. But if you are a long time wearer of ROO or 44mm PAM's than they finally have gotten it right. And it is in any case a real technical masterpiece. Most large watch wearers have either gotten used to the concept of the watch sticking out or go the next step and have their dress shirts made with an enlarged left sleeve. And congrats on having the opportunity to try it on. I just wish you had whipped out your camera phone to snap a quick pic.

Agreed. The datewheel has got to go.

D- Very nice looking watch. The only issue you can't currently resolve on a 63 is the caseback. 63 was a C series while the 23 and 29 were B series. The recipe above is a great recipe. I can't remember why but I seem to remember the hand lengths may be off as well. But I can never remember what goes with what. Here is a 63 with most of the mods mentioned above (more primitive watchmaster cylops though). This one has gen hands but I am not sure they are the right size as they could be from a 29B.

48 teeth it is. I am now going to shut up. I gotta cut out this rep stuff and stick with gens. It is a lot easier.

Yeah, that rep is horrible. Wrong size and wrong everything else. I am the one of the few folks who actually like the Deep Sea. I have been waiting for a larger Rolex for years. Now I just got to save up my pennies.

I will second Jay's comment. Irrespective of the number of teeth they do look really good. T is a complete gentleman for bringing this up to the forum membership And to address the the Turkey crowns again the ones I did as a group buy are from the person in Turkey. He is the same person who sold dozens of gen Omega bracelets, crowns, etc. And I did at the time check out the large authorized repair person whose inventory he bought out. He did exist. But those who don't want to believe it shouldn't. At the time we debated it everyone came to their own conclusions. I satisfied myself by measuring out the crown including overall crown tab sizing and depth, fitting one into a gen case and crown guard combo and actually destroying (unsheathing the spring loaded portion) of one of my crowns directly from Panerai to compare mechanisms. If they are copies they are the best copies ever made and they were far cheaper than Palp's which had no spring loaded mechanism. And for those who own gen Panerai - you know that it ain't the rubber tubing in a gen crown guard which gives the crown/crown guard its feel (the two gen cg's I bought separately don't even seem to have any tubing) it is the finishing of the pin and pin tube and the sprung mechanism on the crown. To give you some of my references: Recent picture of stuff I typically have laying around - gen and Jimmy cases, crowns of all varieties, gen and Jimmy cg's, etc. Here is a gen crown and Jimmy case which has a perfectly sized case tube (the gen crowns and "Turkey" crowns depicted below slide in perfectly): Contemporary gen handwind crown: Enesafe Crowns: And for good measure - Palp 2.1 and 1.9: I can't comment on Ferretti and his buying out all the inventory. I can tell you that a number of sub-contractors were left high and dry when Panerai was sold (and thus the sub-contractor theory may be valid). But as for Vanni - he turned out to be full of it. His NOS ain't so NOS. His dials typically have markings or scratches, do not come in gen dial cases and his NOS tritium handsets were not NOS or entirely Tritium. All sets came with luminor hands combined with tritium ones. Of the six 03 sets he sold I can account for four sets and not one was entirely tritium. I had them analyzed by a skilled re-lumer on this forum. I like the guy and hope it was an honest mistake but we will never know. Now back to the subject at hand: I continue to believe that crowns vary from model to model, etc. It took Vendome 2-3 years after they purchased the Company to standardize anything. Having said that I am sorry for any misleading of T on my part. And I do hope that folks will either step up for the next round if he makes them or for the original. And T - you can count me in for two of the whichever you elect to sell. I applaud all your efforts.