Rolexman Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 ~~~~~Please know that everything in this thread is my opinion and I don't want to present them as facts!~~~~~~~~ Well, as an old timer on this board I've seen the entire life cycle of the Asian 7750. From the early replicas with the old 21.600bph jewels version which were poorly finished up to the latest 28.800bph version and all the alterations the Chinese could make up. One thing that clearly stands out when it comes to the Asian 7750 is that there are lovers and haters. The later are in the surplus! Especially the Asian 7750 with the running seconds at 6 gets a lot of negative attention. Not entirely without reason as the Chinese altered a perfectly designed movement (Valjoux 7750) to transfer the running seconds. They could have done that without compromising on the performance but they cut some corners and what you get is a relative unreliable movement when not taken care off properly. There are some modifications that can be done to it but I won't go in to that now. What I do want to share is what a great movement the Asian 7750 is. Yes, it is great! In it's original configuration (12-9-6) it is at it's best as all the parts and functions work like they should. It is the basic configuration with the least chance of problems occurring. So why is the Asian 7750 so notorious? Well theoratically it's not the movement itself but the condition under which it is assembled that causes most of the problems. 99% of all Asian 7750 movements are either dirty, dry, over oiled or a combination thereof. Ad poor quality checks /craftsman ship and you can ad loose screws, uneven hair spring coils, loose pallet stones and a lot of other stuff to the balance. But what can you expect from a 300$ watch? In order to give us these beautiful reps for such low prices they have to cut expenses somewhere. If they would ad 8 hours of proper assembling and QC's the price would dramatically increase. And let's be honest. Most people don't care if their movement is clean and on par with the genuine.They are more concerned with the aesthetics. And for the few RWG nerds that are? There is The Zigmeister of every other watch maker. So my point is: The Asian 7750 is in it's basic configuration a great movement and on par with the ETA 7750 if assembled and checked correctly. That does mean that sometimes parts needs to be cleaned, oiled or even replaced. But after that... just perfect. Some nice pictures to conclude! Mark Here's a random picture of an Asian 7750 as can be found in almost all reps. Dirty and shabby... Here's an Asian 7750 after a full clean and oiling with the screws replaced by silver ones. Compare it to a factory delivered Chronometer ETA 7750 Side by side... Performance of the Asian 7750 Performance of the Chronometer ETA 7750 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAHLER Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Thanks for sharing!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwatch Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Don't forget to add the fact that the date wheel mechanism is actually a better design on the Asian version and does not have the same issue as the ETA one when changing the date between 10pm and 2am. Quite an ingenious design actually. Surprisingly the Asian's seemed to have improved upon a swiss design flaw! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Don't forget to add the fact that the date wheel mechanism is actually a better design on the Asian version and does not have the same issue as the ETA one when changing the date between 10pm and 2am. Quite an ingenious design actually. Surprisingly the Asian's seemed to have improved upon a swiss design flaw! Very true! Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Hawkes Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 (edited) So basically what you are saying about the A7750 is: blueprint is good (since it is copied from the ETA), execution is crap. How does that make the A7750 a good movement? And how is it not possible to provide a clean A7750 movement, made and assembled in CHINA for 300 USD? 300 USD in China is comparable to how much in any western country? Probably around or more than 900 USD? Aren't there "real" companies selling clean ETA7750 watches for that price? And they have a lot more expenses than rep factories have.. How would 8 hours of additional work increase the price dramatically? Average factoryworkers are paid what, less than a dollar an hour? Instead you search for someone who is willing to service an A7750 and pay him 200 USD... Edited May 3, 2012 by Tom Hawkes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 So basically what you are saying about the A7750 is: blueprint is good (since it is copied from the ETA), execution is crap. How does that make the A7750 a good movement? And how is it not possible to provide a clean A7750 movement, made and assembled in CHINA for 300 USD? 300 USD in China is comparable to how much in any western country? Probably around or more than 900 USD? Aren't there "real" companies selling clean ETA7750 watches for that price? And they have a lot more expenses than rep factories have.. How would 8 hours of additional work increase the price dramatically? Average factoryworkers are paid what, less than a dollar an hour? Instead you search for someone who is willing to service an A7750 and pay him 200 USD... IMO $300 dollar is the 'consumer price'. That includes dealer mark ups, middle men, maybe pay offs (?) etc. If you look at the cost price of set watch it is much lower. The movement only being a small fraction of the total. So maybe $30 for a7750 whole sale in china? And if you knew how a Swiss watch is assembled like for instance at Breitling and how our reps are assembled in dark sweat rooms you will realize that that the price of a clean and well performing movement is not only made up by labor costs. Environment, tools, schooling etc. are all equally important and contributing. If you can get a complete new ETA 7750 powered watch for $300 please let me know where. I will buy a dozen! You can hardly get only the movement for that price 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laskos Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 totaly crap post! if you will try to wind the a7750 you will have one broken a7750... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 totaly crap post! if you will try to wind the a7750 you will have one broken a7750... So you have a different opinion on the A7750. No problem! But I see no reason to discard my post as 'crap'. I took the time to share my thoughts with the rest. What have you contributed to this forum my friend? 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serge D Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 I will defend the OP author as well. I have many a7750 movement watches, i wind them, i ise chrono and havent had a single problem with any of them. You cant judge by looking at one example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dluddy Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 So you have a different opinion on the A7750. No problem! But I see no reason to discard my post as 'crap'. I took the time to share my thoughts with the rest. What have you contributed to this forum my friend? Seriously. I think it has been proven that when serviced, the A7750 is a good movement and proven to be reliable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Utheman Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 totaly crap post! if you will try to wind the a7750 you will have one broken a7750... Ban him! Ban him! Oh, wait. I thought I was at RepGeek.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serge D Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Ban him! Ban him! Oh, wait. I thought I was at RepGeek.... LMAO I was just banned from RG a few days ago, long story, no reason, their excuse was initially i had multiple accounts, which was false. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laskos Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Ok rolexman very good point this! But lets say that i made my answer without seeing that you have 2600 posts.... I think that any good word about a7750 drives me nuts since one watch with an a7750 died in the singe first winding... I had that watch working for only 5mins... Sorry me about my bad attitude and my bad english Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Hawkes Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 (edited) IMO $300 dollar is the 'consumer price'. That includes dealer mark ups, middle men, maybe pay offs (?) etc. If you look at the cost price of set watch it is much lower. The movement only being a small fraction of the total. So maybe $30 for a7750 whole sale in china? And if you knew how a Swiss watch is assembled like for instance at Breitling and how our reps are assembled in dark sweat rooms you will realize that that the price of a clean and well performing movement is not only made up by labor costs. Environment, tools, schooling etc. are all equally important and contributing. Yes, I get it. So if you get a dirty and maybe broken a7750 for 30 usd, why not provide a clean one for 60 usd? Make that a total of 330 usd then. You said it would increase the price dramatically and I say it would not. The point is, as you have mentioned already, that probably 95% of the rep buyers don't care. They could easily provide better quality checks and cleaner assemblies even without having to increase the price, but then then everyone would profit a couple of dollars less.. You are buying a 300 usd rep and then have to pay another 200 usd or more on a 30 usd movement for a service unless you can do it yourself. What's the point? You are proving that in theory the A7750 is capable of being a good movement. In reality it is not, imo. Iif you can get a complete new ETA 7750 powered watch for $300 please let me know where. I will buy a dozen! You can hardly get alone the movement for that price. I didn't say you can get an ETA 7750 watch for 300 usd. I said that 300 usd in China is equivalent to probably 900 usd or more in a western country. And for 900 usd you can get a watch with a clean ETA 7750. Why can't I get a clean A7750 watch for 300 usd in China then? Edited May 3, 2012 by Tom Hawkes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asf Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Yes, I get it. So if you get a dirty and maybe broken a7750 for 30 usd, why not provide a clean one for 60 usd? Make that a total of 330 usd then. You said it would increase the price dramatically and I say it would not. The point is, as you have mentioned already, that probably 95% of the rep buyers don't care. They could easily provide better quality checks and cleaner assemblies even without having to increase the price, but then then everyone would profit a couple of dollars less.. You are buying a 300 usd rep and then have to pay another 200 usd or more on a 30 usd movement for a service unless you can do it yourself. What's the point? You are proving that in theory the A7750 is capable of being a good movement. In reality it is not, imo. I didn't say you can get an ETA 7750 watch for 300 usd. I said that 300 usd in China is equivalent to probably 900 usd in a western country. And for 900 usd you can get a watch with a clean ETA 7750. Why can't I get a clean A7750 watch for 300 usd in China then? Our community wouldn't mind paying more, but the world wide rep buying, I don't care how accurate the watch is to the gen community could care less Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 3, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Yes, I get it. So if you get a dirty and maybe broken a7750 for 30 usd, why not provide a clean one for 60 usd? Make that a total of 330 usd then. You said it would increase the price dramatically and I say it would not. The point is, as you have mentioned already, that probably 95% of the rep buyers don't care. They could easily provide better quality checks and cleaner assemblies even without having to increase the price, but then then everyone would profit a couple of dollars less.. You are buying a 300 usd rep and then have to pay another 200 usd or more on a 30 usd movement for a service unless you can do it yourself. What's the point? You are proving that in theory the A7750 is capable of being a good movement. In reality it is not, imo. I didn't say you can get an ETA 7750 watch for 300 usd. I said that 300 usd in China is equivalent to probably 900 usd or more in a western country. And for 900 usd you can get a watch with a clean ETA 7750. Why can't I get a clean A7750 watch for 300 usd in China then? Excellent points. Definitely some 'food for thought' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laskos Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 (edited) Sorry about my attitude guys... i apologies... But i want to ask one more time: can you manually wind an a7750 or it is sure that this will break down the movement?? If you can, perhaps i will try to buy again a chronograph! Edited May 3, 2012 by laskos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolfire Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 Really nice stuff, Mark! Thanks for sharing Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icoopernicus Posted May 3, 2012 Report Share Posted May 3, 2012 My first Rep was a Tag heuer Carrera Day Date, purchased from Sinowatches before finding this forum. Other than being a little overpriced at Sino I think this is an excellent rep. Apart from having to reattach the rotor after a round of golf I have had no problems with this watch. I have worn it regularlly for the past 2 years, using the chronograph and manually winding the watch without a problem. The watch runs about +5sec/day without ever being serviced. I will not hesitate to purchase another a7750 (wait, I just did) and am considering proper service of my movements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExtraExtra Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 What a great post. Thank you. Having the movement overhauled is definitely a must if you want to keep your rep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExtraExtra Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 Excellent points. Definitely some 'food for thinking' I second this. Its a good point. Perhaps one of the reason for keeping it dirty or the way it is Would be to keep the high turn over or broken a7750. This way one would continue to buy more reps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
w0lf Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 Some great points but I partially disagree. I think that keeping Asian 775x in your reps makes sense in several cases: - You're not sure if you love the watch, so you're just testing waters - It's a A7754 clone for GMT models or another not easily obtainable concoction from ETA - You can do full teardown movement service yourself. In all other cases, I feel that going with ETA is worth the slight added cost. For the past year you could easily have sourced a top grade ETA from Zeno liquidations between 150 and 180 Euro. And even if you missed out on all of those deals, which was literally hundreds of movements, our very own FxrAndy a couple dozen of new Hamilton branded movements for sale for a special price of 200 Euro for VIP members. It just makes no sense for me to spend between USD150 and 200 on servicing your run of the mill 6-9-12 or seconds @9 A7750 movement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Carl Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 I agree with Rolexman. I'd also like to see where I can get a clean used gen with a working 7750 for $900. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hackR Posted May 4, 2012 Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 a fun post...thanks, Mark... i agree with w0lf...if you can pick up an eta 7750 for $225-$275usd when they come up (i picked up a couple in the Zeno deal and directly from Andy, too!), then sell your old a7750 for $50-75usd or so, you end up with a genuine eta7750 for a net cost that is less or darn close to a full service of an a7750... when a rep becomes a definite keeper (franken or not), i tend to go the eta upgrade route...yes - even they can be off in accuracy and quality, but i still feel its worth it... with all these "dealers" making 1-1 watches, using much better lume, etc - it sure would be nice if you had the option of a "serviced movement" for a reasonable add-on...assuming the dealer could "prove" the watch is clean, non-defective parts, assembled properly and is regulated right... R- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted May 4, 2012 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2012 In all other cases, I feel that going with ETA is worth the slight added cost. For the past year you could easily have sourced a top grade ETA from Zeno liquidations between 150 and 180 Euro. And even if you missed out on all of those deals, which was literally hundreds of movements, our very own FxrAndy a couple dozen of new Hamilton branded movements for sale for a special price of 200 Euro for VIP members. It just makes no sense for me to spend between USD150 and 200 on servicing your run of the mill 6-9-12 or seconds @9 A7750 movement. i agree with w0lf...if you can pick up an eta 7750 for $225-$275usd when they come up (i picked up a couple in the Zeno deal and directly from Andy, too!), then sell your old a7750 for $50-75usd or so, you end up with a genuine eta7750 for a net cost that is less or darn close to a full service of an a7750... You both have some great insights and loved reading your replies. Technically you are right off course. But as soon as the stocks of new and clean ETA 7750s starts to dry up the prices will creep up to what they once were $350 ~450 (I'm not talking about old stock or second hand as they are cheaper but also dirty and/ or dry). Then it's an whole other ball game! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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