ceocorona Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Well besides ton of sugar, corn syrup, and some carbonation... Lol. Ok so I've been doing quite a bit of reading regarding franken 16710, 16760, or other early 90s to 2007 gmt master II. So we have some bk transformers, new explorer II, Noob factory gmt, etc. Do we have any good bare cases? It needs to accept all gen parts. Any good leads? Seems as if the good Pepsi base watches are extinct. I am not looking for a cheap franken but a great franken. Suggestions? Or maybe someone is selling? Ha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danielv2000 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 My issue has always been the incorrect hand stack or way-to-big LEC on the crystal. That's why i went gen on this model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 So the ichs doesn't bother me too much given that it's not completely evident throughout most of the day. Yeah I'm thinking gen since they aren't terribly expensive. I've considered this or a TT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiadeCuba Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 the best 16710 is to get a one of the new 16570 that are superlumed, take the bezel and put a tw bezel on it, and a noob dial. i did a build before and it was super close. it will take a gen crystal and crown/tube. however, i sold it and went to a gen 1675. the worse part of the build was the super thick case. there is no substitute besides going gen the rep factory will NEVER replicate a thin case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I did the BK suggested build. Not franken, but really turned out great. http://www.rwgforum.net/topic/144657-making-a-gen-style-16710-case-out-of-a-16570-case-and-tw-bezel-assembly/?pid=1089607#entry1089607 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Doesn't the 16760 "Fat Lady" have the thicker case? Could one of the reps not pass as one of these GMTs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 This is a must-read for GMT fans. http://www.doubleredseadweller.com/watch-info/gmt/gmt-in-transition.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsiadeCuba Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 yeah but the cg also were thicker. so you would have to get someone to spot weld the cg to add more meat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 This is a must-read for GMT fans. http://www.doubleredseadweller.com/watch-info/gmt/gmt-in-transition.html Thank you. yeah but the cg also were thicker. so you would have to get someone to spot weld the cg to add more meat. You're right... I forgot about that detail. Hmmm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 the big "tell to me is the crown. All of the early GMT's 1675.16750 have 5.3mm crowns. they are tiny!! When you put the correct 5.3mm crown in a rep case, there is a gap between the crown and the Case guard that isn't present in the gen. A 6mm crown will fill up the gap, but anyone who owns or is really familiar with the 1675,16750 can see the difference. AFA the hand stack, the ETA 2846 and the DG 3804 both have the same hand stack as the 1675, but not the 16750. There just aren't any ready made thin cases that are correct for the old GMT's, at least not any reasonably priced cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 I agree, the 5.3mm crown is a pain in the...fingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Someone mentioned phong case? This viable? Or the cartel 1655 with heavy case shaving. Where is the phong sourced? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irontomkidd Posted August 5, 2013 Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 Someone mentioned phong case? This viable? Or the cartel 1655 with heavy case shaving. Where is the phong sourced? http://www.jewelryandwatch.com/ Phongs prices are ridiculous and to me not viable for any build of a sub $10000 watch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 5, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2013 http://www.jewelryandwatch.com/ Phongs prices are ridiculous and to me not viable for any build of a sub $10000 watch Wow you're not kidding... I was expecting like 500-1000... north of that? Intense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 The biggest problem you have with this build, sort of the same problem as the 16610 or 1680, you are building a watch that can still be had as a genuine for around 4000.00 USD. I know folks say that ain't so, but if you shop around, and are patient, which most of us are not, you can find pretty nice examples for that price or a tad more. In fact I just saw a nice 1675, head only ,no bracelet on VRM for 3700.00 USD. Herein lies the dilemma , say you want to build a really nice 1675 or 16750, so you decide to use a phong, or Ming Quy or some other high end aftermarket gen spec case. probably north of 1000.00 USD, then a genuine bezel insert, 250-350 and maybe more if its a really nice faded one, genuine dial, good one will be 250-500,gen 116 crystal probably around 100, 5.3mm crown/tube 150--200 depending on condition. genuine bracelet, Jubilee bracelets in reasonable condition are around 500, Oyster bracelets are more expensive, around 600-800 depending on condition. Now you still have to find a movement (2836 with GMT module, or DG 3804 or possibly an ETA 2893-2 ) as well as hands. Plus if you can't do it yourself, you are going to have to pay someone to assemble the watch. What you are looking at is a rep, albeit a really nice one, I would even call this a super franken, but look at the cost. Low end of the price range for everything including movement (2836) 2450.00 High end 3200.00 (2893-2) So now you have a really great little GMT, it is really, really nice, runs great, you can wear it anywhere, because it's got everything genuine except the bezel and hands, and case of course, but it is pretty darn close to perfect. No one is going to call you out on this one I promise you. Especially if you build a 1675, as the hand stack on the gen 1675 is the same as the hand stack on the ETA movements But the real problem is on the high side you are within around 800-1000 dollars of a genuine 1675 or 16750 GMT. If you decide at some point down the line, that a GMT doesn't fit into your plans anymore, the genuine, provided it's in nice shape and hasn't been abused, can be sold for as much or possibly a bit more than you paid for it. The franken on the other hand is going to be a very hard sell on the rep forums. Not many watches sell here for 3k. you might get lucky, and find a buyer with some cash who really wants exactly what you or selling, but usually, the seller ends up breaking the watch up and seling the parts to get a portion of his money back. Don't get me wrong, I think something like this would be and interesting project, and one that would be fairly easy, as there are lots of 1675/16750 parts around, dials, crystals, inserts, etc. I just believe that anyone attempting a project like this needs to go into the project with his eyes wide open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 It's like you we're reading my mind... This is exactly where I am at. My rep rule of thumb is to stay at or below 1/3 of the actual gen watch. Some exceptions of course but having that in mind keeps me from making huge investments into a single rep watch. That was a very good analysis, thanks for taking the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 A 1675 is nice but before I would spend $1000 to $2000 on a watch that you can buy genuine for $4000, I would build something that is currently selling for more than $4000 for about the same $$. A 1655 for instance. Advantages... No 'thin case' requirement. No rotating bezel to worry with. Lots of case choices that accept 6mm crowns. Easier to fit genuine spec crystals without the hassles with inner/outer bezel fit, getting knocked off/falling off etc. If you spend a little extra $$ on a 1655 dial rather than the 1675 case, you can end up with a convincing watch. You will have a replica of a $10k watch rather than a $4k watch. I have owned a few watches with DG GMT movements, both the old style with non adjustable 24 hour hands and the later models with adjustable 24 hour hands and even though they are Ok after c/o, I would try to use a swisseta with the Asian 24 hour hand modification in a 'keeper' watch because they are more reliable and all parts (except 24 hour parts) are easy to find. I have changed a few swisseta 2836 (already modified to GMT) over to 21600 bph by swapping the running guts out or putting the GMT works on a 2846 and they all worked fine. I tried one 1655 with a genuine rolex 1575 changed over to GMT with genuine parts and it sunk my boat ($$!). Lesson learned...stay away from genuine rolex movements in projects, especially GMT movements. eBay item 190878061947, probably a fair deal at today's 'no parts 4U' prices... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-ROLEX-WATCH-MOVEMENT-Cal-1575-GMT-1675-0-Recently-Serviced-Running-/190878061947?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c7138157b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptTripps Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 I've bought 3 gen 1675s in the last few weeks...all under $3,500. One was $2,600 for a head. If you shop around and are patient, you can have a killer watch for very little.Get the worst 1675 you can find, and refinish the case. Buy a refinished or "rep" dial, if that's the piece that's bad and swap it out.I'm the last person to preach patience...trust me...but that's paid off for me in this game a few times now. (Well, that and having cash available to strike when you have an opportunity!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 "Get the worst 1675 you can find, and refinish the case. Buy a refinished or "rep" dial, if that's the piece that's bad and swap it out." Good advice! The 'deal killers' for me are hairspring/balance wheel trouble and rotted out cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 A 1675 is nice but before I would spend $1000 to $2000 on a watch that you can buy genuine for $4000, I would build something that is currently selling for more than $4000 for about the same $$. A 1655 for instance. Advantages... No 'thin case' requirement. No rotating bezel to worry with. Lots of case choices that accept 6mm crowns. Easier to fit genuine spec crystals without the hassles with inner/outer bezel fit, getting knocked off/falling off etc. If you spend a little extra $$ on a 1655 dial rather than the 1675 case, you can end up with a convincing watch. You will have a replica of a $10k watch rather than a $4k watch. I have owned a few watches with DG GMT movements, both the old style with non adjustable 24 hour hands and the later models with adjustable 24 hour hands and even though they are Ok after c/o, I would try to use a swisseta with the Asian 24 hour hand modification in a 'keeper' watch because they are more reliable and all parts (except 24 hour parts) are easy to find. I have changed a few swisseta 2836 (already modified to GMT) over to 21600 bph by swapping the running guts out or putting the GMT works on a 2846 and they all worked fine. I tried one 1655 with a genuine rolex 1575 changed over to GMT with genuine parts and it sunk my boat ($$!). Lesson learned...stay away from genuine rolex movements in projects, especially GMT movements. eBay item 190878061947, probably a fair deal at today's 'no parts 4U' prices... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-ROLEX-WATCH-MOVEMENT-Cal-1575-GMT-1675-0-Recently-Serviced-Running-/190878061947?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c7138157b I've bought 3 gen 1675s in the last few weeks...all under $3,500. One was $2,600 for a head. If you shop around and are patient, you can have a killer watch for very little. Get the worst 1675 you can find, and refinish the case. Buy a refinished or "rep" dial, if that's the piece that's bad and swap it out. I'm the last person to preach patience...trust me...but that's paid off for me in this game a few times now. (Well, that and having cash available to strike when you have an opportunity!) I would have never thought about that. Well I have been (well started to shop used ten gmts) but I never considered a "bad" case. But you are very right. I can have it fixed up with minimal costs... This thread has really provided some great advice on this build. Puzzle is starting to come together! The 1655 is nice and you have a very valid point but I am really after that pepsi look. So I was trying to add a pepsi and vintage watch into one piece. I am considering the route of the new explorer II case for a modest build. I have less then zero patience, lol. Thanks again guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptTripps Posted August 6, 2013 Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 Here's an example...I bought this one for $2,600.Terrible dial. I mean....REAL bad dial.I bought this for $220 from a guy on VRF.Cleaned it up...took me all of 5min and it looked like this.End result?So I'm $2,900 with shipping into a 1675 head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 6, 2013 Thats awesome. I would definitely jump at gen for that price but 4k not so much. I can get away with building a 1675 for just at 2k. Does this look like a "gen" rolex 1675 case? bay ID: 380683065397 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted August 7, 2013 Report Share Posted August 7, 2013 "I have less then zero patience, lol."We have all learned there are two things this twisted hobby will teach you (if you stay with it)...patience and persistence. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptTripps Posted August 7, 2013 Report Share Posted August 7, 2013 We have all learned there are two things this twisted hobby will teach you (if you stay with it)...patience and persistence.My nickname used to be FedEX, because I wanted everything ~NOW~! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ceocorona Posted August 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted August 7, 2013 Thats funny, I am like on a first name basis with my post office and UPS guy. Thinking about inviting them over for Thanksgiving Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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