Ultimate 112H VS Modded 112E

[Guest asad]

I had ordered davidsans ultimate earlier this week which i look forward to receiving but i have this once in a life time chance to acquire a fully modded 112. There is a (Big Price) difference between the two. I can always give the DVN's Ultimate 112 to my brother who really likes Panerai, and keep the modded one to myself. So tell me which one would you get and why?

The offerings contain:

Davidsans Ultimate 112

-44MM STEEL CASE WITH THICK CROWN AND CG

-SWISS H MOVT WITH DAGGER FUNCTIONAL SWAN NECK

-SAPPHIRE WITH AR COATING

-SUPERLUEMD C3 DIAL AND HANDS

-PU RUBBER BAND WITH DEPLOY BUCKLE

-CHOOSE AN EXTRA LEATHER STRAP BLACK/BROWN OR TAN COLOR

-EXTRA PAIR OF SPRING BARS

-FULLY TESTED WITH 3ATM WR

-FULLY SERVICED AND TESTED MOVT

For $368.00

(Pictures from Aquaracer and WATCHDUDE)

Sellers Modded 112E

- JF case NEW

- JF crown (with flat pin, tight lever etc) NEW

- JF bezel NEW

- Pantina dial

- Fat and flat lume to match exactly with gen

- Gen sapphire crystal (would not fit rep case, but fits JF perfectly) NEW

- Gen Panerai seals (teflon) NEW

- Correct E series case back new

- Asian swan neck dagger E series movement

- dial font dyed off white to match gen

- Movement service (a must for asians)

- Flav dial super lume

- Palp crown

- Gen hands NEW

- Cannon pin fix and polished flat exact like gen

For $1000.00

(Pictures from the seller)

Edited January 18, 2008 by asad

[bwhitesox]

$1000 dollars is a lot of money when it comes to reps but boy O boy that is a lot of watch.....No contest at all.!!!!

[t]

it is not only a big price difference.

it is also a big quality difference. I think the second watch worth $1.000. All this mods... never saw this before. AMAZING.

and you couldn

[capice]

I would take them both just cannot decide

nr uno for the price

nr due for the looks......

[ProZac]

If you decide to decline the offer (for the 1000 buck pam), let me know, I

[fishgodeep]

If detail is really important then the 112-E is handsdown winner ....if it's price - DSN watch is excellent for the money.

Personally I think the 112-E is worth the extra - JF case is worth probably $200 on it's own nowaday and that dial is pretty unique - at least $150+

Doesn't take longe before the value scales balance.

Good luck with your purchase/s!

FGD

[Watchmeister]

Between gen hands, crystal, etc. Palp and full Jimmy I think that second one is fairly priced. If you have the budget go for that one. I do have one question on the crown guard (if you want to get incredibly picky) which relates to the lever on the CG. I have never seen that level of spacing between the lever and the body of the CG (looking directly on from the side). It may be because of the Palp crown or it may be a replacement lever which doesn't degrade the value in any way but is a common occurrence as Jimmy CG's get ever rarer and are increasingly being reused. Make no mistake, IMHO that second watch is beautiful.

[mezzanine]

Ya gotta admit, it's pretty funny that you would go and rip on my watch that is for sale with a Greg Steven's Crazy Horse (new) and a lot of similarities to this watch in principle (serviced asian, palp crown, professional SL).

I mean, hey, it's an awesome watch. Why someone would spend this much on the rep instead of just buying the gen doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

[slai]

Ya gotta admit, it's pretty funny that you would go and rip on my watch that is for sale with a Greg Steven's Crazy Horse (new) and a lot of similarities to this watch in principle (serviced asian, palp crown, professional SL).

I mean, hey, it's an awesome watch. Why someone would spend this much on the rep instead of just buying the gen doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

And it doesn't even have the world renowned CG!

[dluddy]

No contest, the modded one if you are a fanatic and it seems like you are like the rest of us

I think the CG is one that has had the infamous Flav Silicon mod so I would count on having the CG redone properly if you are in it for the long haul. Too bad they went to all the trouble to use the Jimmy case and didn't use the Jimmy CG.

@Mezz, I had asked Asad to start a new post rather than discuss the merits of both in your Sales thread.

[PAMman]

Buy the 112E. The difference between Jimmy Fu's parts and the normal rep parts is significant and the fit and finish of Davidsen's frequently isn't even on a par with the regular rep. You list the CG to be Jimmy's also (although you just refer to it as 'crown') and without one of his in my hand I can't deny that it may be. If that's really a gen crystal and hands then the package is well priced in my opinion. Personally I would rather get a B, C or D series solid back and an unaltered Swiss 7497 as I prefer the older models but that is just a personal thing, which includes a mistrust of Asian movements generally.

Go for the JF watch - it will always be very desirable within the rep community and would be very difficult to replace. I have only 2 complete JF cases and 3 CGs left now, having used a few for myself and sold a couple of others. I think that I have only enough parts left for my own projects, using a mix of JF and gen parts and I know that things like gen hands are very costly. I got 2 gen preA dials (01 & 03), both tritium dials with matching tritium hands and these cost real money. However I know that they will continue to be valuable parts that can be sold to Paneristi all day long. BTW, I was offered a genuine preV white Slytech dial recently at $5000 if anyone is interested???

[Sweattdogg]

Modded 112E hands down. It is pricy, but you will not see many of these around. Custom built and a piece of art!!! To be honest I really don't like DSN's 112 too much. Give the DSN to your bro, buy the 112E and remind your brother how much better yours is everytime you wear them

[PAMman]

[quote name='Sweattdogg' date='Jan 18 2008, 03:57 PM' post='388036'

............... To be honest I really don't like DSN's 112 too much................

Edited January 18, 2008 by PAMman

[Sweattdogg]

This would be a total longshot, but if you could ever find a gen dial for the 112E it would be very hard for anyone to call out. It is quite a longshot, but Flav had his 111 parted out and for sale on the bay a couple months ago so these parts do come along every once in awhile. As far as I know all of Jimmy Fu's stuff is truely 1:1 of gen and accepts any PAM parts you find.

[PAMman]

This would be a total longshot, but if you could ever find a gen dial for the 112E it would be very hard for anyone to call out. It is quite a longshot, but Flav had his 111 parted out and for sale on the bay a couple months ago so these parts do come along every once in awhile. As far as I know all of Jimmy Fu's stuff is truely 1:1 of gen and accepts any PAM parts you find.

A gen 112 dial will be almost impossible to find but a better rep dial may become available as a small batch if it all works out OK. How about a T SWISS T 2A dial with 'tritium' hand lume???

I'm as anal as anyone here but I'm not sure that I have ever met anyone in normal everyday life who has ever even heard of Panerai so the chances of being 'called out' on a normal rep are slim, at least where I live. Maybe if you live in Hollywood / Beverly Hills you should keep your hands in your pockets during daylight hours.

[Guest asad]

Ya gotta admit, it's pretty funny that you would go and rip on my watch that is for sale with a Greg Steven's Crazy Horse (new) and a lot of similarities to this watch in principle (serviced asian, palp crown, professional SL).

I mean, hey, it's an awesome watch. Why someone would spend this much on the rep instead of just buying the gen doesn't make a ton of sense to me.

Hey mezzanine, I am trully sorry about that. I was being very stupid and hope you forgive me for my mistake there. Now i come to appreciate that your model was quite a bargain and a great deal, Sorry for noticing so in the first place.

and thanks for your opinion here.

[Guest asad]

No contest, the modded one if you are a fanatic and it seems like you are like the rest of us

I think the CG is one that has had the infamous Flav Silicon mod so I would count on having the CG redone properly if you are in it for the long haul. Too bad they went to all the trouble to use the Jimmy case and didn't use the Jimmy CG.

@Mezz, I had asked Asad to start a new post rather than discuss the merits of both in your Sales thread.

Yes dluddy, Coming from Gens i am a fanatic about having the most perfect watch. I am very much leaning toward the Modded 112E due to all its modification and i am sure i will not come across such a watch in a very long time. I have researched the seller and he seems very legit and trust worthy in doing justice in this transaction so i will probably pull the trigger on it. Also as a deal topper he is throwing in the pictured OEM Panerai Croco Strap which from what i know is worth $250. All in all i am sure it is well worth the "Grand". The pictures he provided do not have some of the Mods present. He is working on getting me updated pictures which shows the finish project (I will post the Updated pictures here soon), though i am sure i am going to take it.

[Victoria]

That's the best 112 (of whatever series) I've ever seen. It looks gen.

My only concern for you, Asad, is the money. Yes, it's worth it due to the mods, but ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS for a rep Panerai? If you save some more, you can get a used gen...

But I guess you have gotten a lot of these replies, so let me just say, unless Verbal Kint is on to something about the seller, buy it.

[V]

Definately the modded 112..

[milsub5517]

good PAM rep is when for $300-500 you get quality very close to the gen. wear it and enjoy.

[doc savage]

A gen 112 dial will be almost impossible to find but a better rep dial may become available as a small batch if it all works out OK. How about a T SWISS T 2A dial with 'tritium' hand lume???

I'm as anal as anyone here but I'm not sure that I have ever met anyone in normal everyday life who has ever even heard of Panerai so the chances of being 'called out' on a normal rep are slim, at least where I live. Maybe if you live in Hollywood / Beverly Hills you should keep your hands in your pockets during daylight hours.

I was wearing my first and only rep in Hollywood; it was a Canal Street gift from a friend who moved to NYC and we were meeting her in a trendy bar. We wound up at one of her Hollywood friend's place nearby to sip vodka and chat all night. He turned out to be a cool guy, and asked me if my watch was a Panerai--here's my watch:

It turned out he just wanted to pass over his obviously gen Daylight Chrono, needless to say I didn't take mine off!

We ended up chatting about watches for a while, I fessed up about my awful Porsche rep and he showed me a case full of Rolexes that he doesn't wear since he got the PAM...too small!

So yeah, I would have to say in my experience gen owners aren't prowling around comparing everyone's dial fonts and cannon pins, they are too busy showing off their own baby!

[mezzanine]

Serious question about this watch- I understand the value of the Jimmy parts, but what's the rep-to-gen price ratio on this one? I'm of the mind that these very expensive reps are warranted depending on the value of the gen. My understanding about the market price of a used gen 112 is that it's not excessively expensive- meaning around $4000 (?). That being said, if it would come with the strap, then you have to give pause.

If that's correct, then my belief about the value of the rep is diminished somewhat. As a reference, I've got a couple of Rolex reps that would be similarly priced ( at least). The thing is, the price of the gens are around $7k and $13k, and the value of the watch is largely composed of gen parts that are re-salable on the gen market. Outside of this market, the value of the 112 in question is limited, however impressive it looks. I'm not sure what the Jimmy parts fetch on Ebay or whatever, but unless there is a sure-fire likelihood of being able to get good value for them in an outside market, I'd hesitate.

For example, if you were talking about getting one of highly modded vintage pieces on the sales board, I would applaud your judgment. Even if it was a Fiddy, where you could at least be in a rep-to-gen price ratio that would make more sense.

Also, it sounds as though you'd be dealing with someone reputable, but I was offered a similar watch on the darkside (RWI) and was ripped off for $600+ recently, so be careful about who you're dealing with. You're going to be pleased enough with the DSN. If you're new to the rep world, don't jump the gun so quickly on going for the absolute best. His watch is a pretty good taste, and if you really find it insufficient, then I think going for the more exotic solutions is a potential alternative...

If you're coming from the gen world, there are certain reps that have unique characteristics, such as the ability to accept genuine parts. These are the watches I would look at more closely. It's a good bridge from the experience of being a gen owner, and there could be some possibilities that you'd never considered due to the cost of owning the gens- such as some of the vintage Rolex reps. If you're exclusively a panerai fan, then I would hang around and do more research. Spend a few days combing over the forum and researching the spectrum of options- it sounds like you've already done some research, but my impression is that it's more based on the valuations of others, rather than your own understanding.

[911RS]

The 112E watch pictured is mine. I think my watch is more "Ultimate" than DSNs hahaha!

What's not pictured is all the new parts... ie JF case, JF CG etc etc.

I originally purchased it from flav. I'm a person of habit.... I need everything to be THE BEST. So I moded a perfect Flav watch to be even more perfect.

Just a note the strap in the pictures is not included. But an exact same strap from my gen 112G is.

The story about this was I wanted to buy a Panerai... Didn't know if I'd like it enough... so I purchased the best rep I could find. Ended up falling it love with it. It's a shame Flav is no longer doing this stuff. So I went out and bought a Gen 112G and i'm so much in love that I'm flying to Hong Kong to buy a Gen Fiddy.

I own 2 reps.... UPO fully moded $1800 with gen metal strap (I have a gen as well and they are 1:1) and this Panerai 112E.

Reps are great fun... I own a few Gens.... so if and when I do purchase a rep... I mod the CRAP out of them.

I know I could get a Planet Ocean for about 2200-3000... but what's the fun in that? It was a fun "could it be done" project and I had a blast doing it.

Gens I own

Platinum President Rolex day date with rolex diamond bezel and dial

Gold President Rolex day date

Rolex Daytona SS

Rolex Daytona two tone

Panerai 112G

Cartier Roadster

Dior D'Trick chrono full diamond bezel

Omega Planet Ocean

Tag Carrera Chrono

Oris Williams F1

Oris Chrono

soon Panerai 127 FIDDY

enjoy the pics =O)

Edited January 19, 2008 by 911RS

[Guest asad]

Serious question about this watch- I understand the value of the Jimmy parts, but what's the rep-to-gen price ratio on this one? I'm of the mind that these very expensive reps are warranted depending on the value of the gen. My understanding about the market price of a used gen 112 is that it's not excessively expensive- meaning around $4000 (?). That being said, if it would come with the strap, then you have to give pause.

If that's correct, then my belief about the value of the rep is diminished somewhat. As a reference, I've got a couple of Rolex reps that would be similarly priced ( at least). The thing is, the price of the gens are around $7k and $13k, and the value of the watch is largely composed of gen parts that are re-salable on the gen market. Outside of this market, the value of the 112 in question is limited, however impressive it looks. I'm not sure what the Jimmy parts fetch on Ebay or whatever, but unless there is a sure-fire likelihood of being able to get good value for them in an outside market, I'd hesitate.

For example, if you were talking about getting one of highly modded vintage pieces on the sales board, I would applaud your judgment. Even if it was a Fiddy, where you could at least be in a rep-to-gen price ratio that would make more sense.

Also, it sounds as though you'd be dealing with someone reputable, but I was offered a similar watch on the darkside (RWI) and was ripped off for $600+ recently, so be careful about who you're dealing with. You're going to be pleased enough with the DSN. If you're new to the rep world, don't jump the gun so quickly on going for the absolute best. His watch is a pretty good taste, and if you really find it insufficient, then I think going for the more exotic solutions is a potential alternative...

If you're coming from the gen world, there are certain reps that have unique characteristics, such as the ability to accept genuine parts. These are the watches I would look at more closely. It's a good bridge from the experience of being a gen owner, and there could be some possibilities that you'd never considered due to the cost of owning the gens- such as some of the vintage Rolex reps. If you're exclusively a panerai fan, then I would hang around and do more research. Spend a few days combing over the forum and researching the spectrum of options- it sounds like you've already done some research, but my impression is that it's more based on the valuations of others, rather than your own understanding.

You are 100% correct in saying everything. I understand but as i am coming from only dealing with gens i think only the best rep would maybe satisfy me, I am some what sure i would appreciate this model more due to how much work this has had done to it. But i am still not 100% sure until i hold DVN's 112 in one hand and this in the other only then i can be sure which i like more. Though i am not that big of a Panerai addict but that is the first thing that drew me to this forum as i thought the Panerai is the closest watch that can be repped to 1/1 scale. But as i have done a bit of research on what other have said i have come to realize that there is alot more that goes into making such a simple watch perfect. Sure i can buy a used 112 for around $3200 on T.Z, then it would bother me that i spent 3X more to get the same simple looking watch that with all mods can be had for 1/3rd the price. As i previously owned a gen Pam 111 and 210 even though i really liked them, but sold them because i could not justify having paid that much for such a simple watch with a hand wound movement. So i think at a Grand i am diffenetly getting what i pay for, and truly that is what Panerai's should be worth ( I do not want to put the Gen owners down But i cannot understand paying 3-4 Grand for a basic hand wound watch, Just my .02 cent. Thanks mezzanine for your very honest and practical opinion and i respect you a whole lot for forgiving me for my mistake earlier as i got of on the wrong foot.

Thank You

Edited January 19, 2008 by asad

[Guest asad]

The 112E watch pictured is mine. I think my watch is more "Ultimate" than DSNs hahaha!

What's not pictured is all the new parts... ie JF case, JF CG etc etc.

I originally purchased it from flav. I'm a person of habit.... I need everything to be THE BEST. So I moded a perfect Flav watch to be even more perfect.

Just a note the strap in the pictures is not included. But an exact same strap from my gen 112G is.

The story about this was I wanted to buy a Panerai... Didn't know if I'd like it enough... so I purchased the best rep I could find. Ended up falling it love with it. It's a shame Flav is no longer doing this stuff. So I went out and bought a Gen 112G and i'm so much in love that I'm flying to Hong Kong to buy a Gen Fiddy.

I own 2 reps.... UPO fully moded $1800 with gen metal strap (I have a gen as well and they are 1:1) and this Panerai 112E.

Reps are great fun... I own a lot of Gens.... so if and when I do purchase a rep... I mod the CRAP of of them to meet my Gen standards.

I know I could get a Planet Ocean for about 2200-3000... but what's the fun in that? It was a fun "could it be done" project and I had a blast doing it.

Gens I own

Platinum President Rolex day date with rolex diamond bezel and dial

Gold President Rolex day date

Rolex daytona SS

Panerai 112G

Cartier Roadster

Dior D'Trick chrono full diamond bezel

Omega Planet Ocean

Tag Carrera Chrono

Oris Williams F1

Oris Chrono

soon Panerai 127 FIDDY

Thanks 911RS, Look forward to closing the deal,

Here are all the gens i have dealt with in the past few years:

(All Pictures are Stock Manufacturer)

Here is the current gen collection: