A garden on the White House front lawn.

[Nightstroker]

I posted this thread on another forum, but did not receive useful feedback....so here goes.

Im sure some of you are aware of an organization that is petitioning Obama to designate a portion of the White House front lawn and grow a vegetable garden.

Eat the View

A huge majority of people are supporting the cause and little or no resistance to it exists.

My feeling is that while it sounds like a great idea, the garden could cause problems for the Obama administration.

Im afraid that people would complain that he had time to plant a garden but not enough time to deal with other issues. A question of Obama's ability to prioritize his agendas or take his presidency seriously could arise.

Political cartoons might show him planting seeds of injustice or tobacco. It could open an avenue for endless ridicule.

People could say things like...."Well....he had time to plant a garden, but didnt have time to handle this issue?" Or things like...."I dont know what Obama was thinking, maybe he was plowing the field in his new garden."

The media might refer to the White House as "The Farm" and discuss Obama's activity at "The Farm" today.

If Obama fails to deliver some degree of the "Change" that he has basically promised America, then he could be remembered as "The President who planted a garden, but failed to make our country grow."

While some of what I have said may sound a little ridiculous, the point is that the garden could make him an easier target for ridicule than he already is. Obama is under massive pressure to "Change" the economy and I think that any questionable ideas, even a garden on the front lawn of the White House, could cause Obama unwanted grief.

IMHO, now is not the right time for Obama to explore "Fun" or what others might refer to as "Hokey" ideas.

Is there anyone out there that agrees with me?

At any rate, please speak your view on this issue

[KB]

Personally I think it's a stupid idea or a very cunning one started by the right (or wrong) people.

Can you imagine how the white supremacist and KKK are going to abuse the propaganda mill when America's first black President starts a farm at the White House?

Ken

[Pugwash]

It's a harmless idea, but a dangerous reality.

[HauteHippie]

LOL

"inspiring and teaching more people to grow some of their own food"

Sorry, but self-reliance is not a liberal value.

[RobbieG]

This can't be serious and I don't get the significance or why anyone would entertain it or think that whether he did or didn't would make any difference. He has to be thinking the same thing. Or maybe not? A garden on the White House lawn as a symbol of something? Christ. I'll tell you this: If we continue to focus on this kind of nonsense in our country instead of getting some real brains together to solve our real issues we are going to Hell in a handbasket. And we don't need to save the f'n whales or the glaciers or help the poor either. Everything and I mean everything else needs to take a back seat and come to a screeching halt until we figure out how to solve our crisises without printing reams of worthless money or being slaves to lobbyists or both.

When the currency bill comes due worldwide as a side effect of all this brainless thinking we can kiss the whole world goodbye. And I mean the whole world. You think the current market selloff is remarkable. It is nothing. Not even a blip on the screen. Just fear. Blue chips have cash positions twice their market value. It isn't real. But the currency IS! Even the big three issue is a world wide one as it relates to currency.Why? Because dirty money never stays in one place. It sloshes around the whole world and gets carry traded and bundled and margined and passed between banks and hedge funds and gets soaked in blood and bile and motor oil all along the way wrecking all the other currencies along with it. LOL. The price for printed money to pay for mistakes is insanely high and the bill is coming real soon and no country can pay the bill. When it doesn't get paid we don't get like refered to a collection agency or something. The electric chair. No time for a trial. Dead. Gone. See Ya...

Mark my words, when all this comes to a head noone will even remember the foolishness that started it and they will be saying things like if we had a f'n garden this never would have happened and stuff like that. Meanwhile, we will all be using jackal bones for money and a single tomato seed will be worth twice the GNP of California.

I posted this thread on another forum, but did not receive useful feedback....so here goes.

Im sure some of you are aware of an organization that is petitioning Obama to designate a portion of the White House front lawn and grow a vegetable garden.

Eat the View

A huge majority of people are supporting the cause and little or no resistance to it exists.

My feeling is that while it sounds like a great idea, the garden could cause problems for the Obama administration.

Im afraid that people would complain that he had time to plant a garden but not enough time to deal with other issues. A question of Obama's ability to prioritize his agendas or take his presidency seriously could arise.

Political cartoons might show him planting seeds of injustice or tobacco. It could open an avenue for endless ridicule.

People could say things like...."Well....he had time to plant a garden, but didnt have time to handle this issue?" Or things like...."I dont know what Obama was thinking, maybe he was plowing the field in his new garden."

The media might refer to the White House as "The Farm" and discuss Obama's activity at "The Farm" today.

If Obama fails to deliver some degree of the "Change" that he has basically promised America, then he could be remembered as "The President who planted a garden, but failed to make our country grow."

While some of what I have said may sound a little ridiculous, the point is that the garden could make him an easier target for ridicule than he already is. Obama is under massive pressure to "Change" the economy and I think that any questionable ideas, even a garden on the front lawn of the White House, could cause Obama unwanted grief.

IMHO, now is not the right time for Obama to explore "Fun" or what others might refer to as "Hokey" ideas.

Is there anyone out there that agrees with me?

At any rate, please speak your view on this issue

[Nightstroker]

Personally I think it's a stupid idea or a very cunning one started by the right (or wrong) people.

Can you imagine how the white supremacist and KKK are going to abuse the propaganda mill when America's first black President starts a farm at the White House?

Ken

Yep. Thats the kind of stuff that could arise, but from multiple angles, not just white supremacist, etc.

It's a harmless idea, but a dangerous reality.

That pretty much sums up exactly what im talking about.

LOL

"inspiring and teaching more people to grow some of their own food"

Sorry, but self-reliance is not a liberal value.

Interesting perspective. I knew that you would have a similar opinion to mine on this issue. Yes....arent the Republicans supposed to be the conservative ones, or self reliant?

This can't be serious and I don't get the significance or why anyone would entertain it or think that whether he did or didn't would make any difference. He has to be thinking the same thing. Or maybe not? A garden on the White House lawn as a symbol of something? Christ. I'll tell you this: If we continue to focus on this kind of nonsense in our country instead of getting some real brains together to solve our real issues we are going to Hell in a handbasket. And we don't need to save the f'n whales or the glaciers or help the poor either. Everything and I mean everything else needs to take a back seat and come to a screeching halt until we figure out how to solve our crisises without printing reams of worthless money or being slaves to lobbyists or both.

When the currency bill comes due worldwide as a side effect of all this brainless thinking we can kiss the whole world goodbye. And I mean the whole world. You think the current market selloff is remarkable. It is nothing. Not even a blip on the screen. Just fear. Blue chips have cash positions twice their market value. It isn't real. But the currency IS! Even the big three issue is a world wide one as it relates to currency.Why? Because dirty money never stays in one place. It sloshes around the whole world and gets carry traded and bundled and margined and passed between banks and hedge funds and gets soaked in blood and bile and motor oil all along the way wrecking all the other currencies along with it. LOL. The price for printed money to pay for mistakes is insanely high and the bill is coming real soon and no country can pay the bill. When it doesn't get paid we don't get like refered to a collection agency or something. The electric chair. No time for a trial. Dead. Gone. See Ya...

Mark my words, when all this comes to a head noone will even remember the foolishness that started it and they will be saying things like if we had a f'n garden this never would have happened and stuff like that. Meanwhile, we will all be using jackal bones for money and a single tomato seed will be worth twice the GNP of California.

Honestly, you went a little over my head here, but my Dad loved it! He thinks your perspective is spot on and represents the real issue. BTW, just so you guys dont think im some kid in front of a computer who spews what his Father pounds into his head, im 37 and my folks live with me for a few months out of the year. Unfortunately, I lived in Hawaii for about 10 years, lived on the beach part time and smoked you know what all day long like I was gettin paid for it. I recently became interrested in politics and world issues to disolve the ignorance. I have a long way to go, but much of this stuff is starting to gel.

What staggers me is how so many people look at causes like "Eat the View" and see it only at face value and dont see beyond its simple concept...."Plant a garden, spread a message, what a great idea!" You can search Google endlessly in an attempt to find opposition to "Eat the View"....but NONE exists. Virtually everyone supports the idea, like the blind leading the blind. Does not any single one of them have the slightest inkling that maybe RIGHT NOW ISNT THE BEST TIME TO POSE AN AGENDA FOR OUR PRESIDENT THAT DOES NOT REALISTICALLY ADDRESS ANY OF OUR NATIONS REAL PROBLEMS? Yet they are lining up one after the other like cows at the slaughter house who dont understand where all of this is going. MOOOOOOO....*chop

Good to know im not alone on this one. I think after Obama has delivered some "Change" he can mess around with ideas like "Eat the View".....until then, this isnt a game.

[jjfesq]

Y A W N

[RobbieG]

In all seriousness, if anything I said went over anyones head, please take the time to learn about it. It is so important! My main message is that when you print money to pay for problems it is only OK if you have a way to "pay back" the printing press. We never do that because we don't have ANY MONEY. We haven't for a long time as our world runs on debt. But in order for that machine to function properly it has to work just like a loan: We loan you money, you pay it back or you lose something. That concept keeps getting forgotten at government levels. So what happens eventually is that printing money causes a currency to devalue and then there is no way to fix it. The more money you print the less each bill is worth, unless you "take back" the printed money once the problem is solved so to speak. When a company crashed you can throw money at it. When an equity market crashes you can throw money at it. But when a currency crashes, you can't do a thing about it...

Yep. Thats the kind of stuff that could arise, but from multiple angles, not just white supremacist, etc.

That pretty much sums up exactly what im talking about.

Interesting perspective. I knew that you would have a similar opinion to mine on this issue. Yes....arent the Republicans supposed to be the conservative ones, or self reliant?

Honestly, you went a little over my head here, but my Dad loved it! He thinks your perspective is spot on and represents the real issue. BTW, just so you guys dont think im some kid in front of a computer who spews what his Father pounds into his head, im 37 and my folks live with me for a few months out of the year. Unfortunately, I lived in Hawaii for about 10 years, lived on the beach part time and smoked you know what all day long like I was gettin paid for it. I recently became interrested in politics and world issues to disolve the ignorance. I have a long way to go, but much of this stuff is starting to gel.

What staggers me is how so many people look at causes like "Eat the View" and see it only at face value and dont see beyond its simple concept...."Plant a garden, spread a message, what a great idea!" You can search Google endlessly in an attempt to find opposition to "Eat the View"....but NONE exists. Virtually everyone supports the idea, like the blind leading the blind. Does not any single one of them have the slightest inkling that maybe RIGHT NOW ISNT THE BEST TIME TO POSE AN AGENDA FOR OUR PRESIDENT THAT DOES NOT REALISTICALLY ADDRESS ANY OF OUR NATIONS REAL PROBLEMS? Yet they are lining up one after the other like cows at the slaughter house who dont understand where all of this is going. MOOOOOOO....*chop

Good to know im not alone on this one. I think after Obama has delivered some "Change" he can mess around with ideas like "Eat the View".....until then, this isnt a game.

[ryyannon]

This can't be serious and I don't get the significance or why anyone would entertain it or think that whether he did or didn't would make any difference. He has to be thinking the same thing. Or maybe not? A garden on the White House lawn as a symbol of something? Christ. I'll tell you this: If we continue to focus on this kind of nonsense in our country instead of getting some real brains together to solve our real issues we are going to Hell in a handbasket. And we don't need to save the f'n whales or the glaciers or help the poor either. Everything and I mean everything else needs to take a back seat and come to a screeching halt until we figure out how to solve our crisises without printing reams of worthless money or being slaves to lobbyists or both.

When the currency bill comes due worldwide as a side effect of all this brainless thinking we can kiss the whole world goodbye. And I mean the whole world. You think the current market selloff is remarkable. It is nothing. Not even a blip on the screen. Just fear. Blue chips have cash positions twice their market value. It isn't real. But the currency IS! Even the big three issue is a world wide one as it relates to currency.Why? Because dirty money never stays in one place. It sloshes around the whole world and gets carry traded and bundled and margined and passed between banks and hedge funds and gets soaked in blood and bile and motor oil all along the way wrecking all the other currencies along with it. LOL. The price for printed money to pay for mistakes is insanely high and the bill is coming real soon and no country can pay the bill. When it doesn't get paid we don't get like refered to a collection agency or something. The electric chair. No time for a trial. Dead. Gone. See Ya...

Mark my words, when all this comes to a head noone will even remember the foolishness that started it and they will be saying things like if we had a f'n garden this never would have happened and stuff like that. Meanwhile, we will all be using jackal bones for money and a single tomato seed will be worth twice the GNP of California.

And gold bullion (i.e., physical gold)?

It's a serious question, Rob.

Aside from that, yo-yo markets = good times for day traders, no?

[RobbieG]

Funny you should mention that Ryyannon. Yes, incredible times. We are effectively huge S&P daytraders. My asset classes (all) in my funds are all intraday. We hold no positions overnight and the alpha dogs are all 100% volatilty based. Some have fixed risk, some variable, some have smoothed exits, some wide open, some trend biased, some countertrend - and good times? All I can say is WOW. Depending on what MM (Mother Market) decides to hand out (I don't believe in prediction of direction or intensity) we will return somewhere between 24-60% or more in the Alpha (meaning our leader) annually. 2007 and 2008 have both been record years with steadily increasing volatilty. For us more motion always means more favorable excursion which means more profits. It is simple math. We always win around the same percentage of trades (a bit less than half on average) and we always win at least a little more than we lose. That is constant so the wildcards which ultimately determine profit are the size of the average winners/losers (as they expand it just means more money) and of course the numbers of trades. When what turned out to be the atom bomb for the rest of the trading world hit in October the size of everything blew up like balloons and the number of trades more than quadrupled. It was insane to watch but not really scary as the system is the system and we are fully automated. I was calling the floor every day checking my numbers on screen because I didn't believe them at first. The Alpha returned 81% on its capital and we traded 18 days that month. November was significantly less but still would have also been a record in its own right if not for October, bringing in 33%. As you can imagine we and our investors, which are now all institutions, are blown away. I look like more than a hero and the high from that has been great. I'm grounded though and I know things will calm down and we will go back to more reasonable returns eventually.

So yes, these are great times to trade intraday, but I would caution anyone strongly against doing it unless you really know what you are doing. I have spent years developing complex models to manage volatility and risk which kind of make it look easy but these markets are very scary. You have to know and be comfortable with expanding stops to bigger numbers from understanding risk and your system so you have the utmost confidence that your stop that used to be 12 ticks from the entry is now 50, but your math will hold as you are unbiased. It took years of testing forward and backwards to have that deep of an understading of my systems and how they interact with themselves and the market. In the end, if you saw my trades on a chart you would say, "Well yeah, duhh..", but it really took some major effort and a lot of failures to find that elegance and have it work well in ANY condition. The best part about October was not the money we made but the test of the system for me. I always had great data of what a REALLY contracted intraday market traded like so I could find the worst case low side, but until October I never knew what a really crazy intraday market expansion looked like. Knowing that I know how to NOT LOSE in both those conditions is all I care about. Winning and how much is not up to me. I manage risk and make sure I don't lose in the long run. What I make is whatever the market decides to give me...

Gold? Long term trading only right now. Volatilty is here to stay - not fundamentally but because everything is going to be wild and news driven. Crazy news times are not good for gold trading IME. But with the long term currency issues worldwide being long metals is hard to fault. The problem is that even gold may not hold up as it is after all money. If things get really bad certainly one could make a case that it would be better to be long commodities. But I don't trade long term so I'm not really the guy to ask about any of that stuff really...

And gold bullion (i.e., physical gold)?

It's a serious question, Rob.

Aside from that, yo-yo markets = good times for day traders, no?

[ryyannon]

Rob, a fascinating (and tantalizing) peek into the algorithms you've developed and the years of charting and number-crunching you must have devoted to working them out. And it must be a glorious moment when you see it all coming together as you hoped it would! So felicitations, and may you always be at the right place at the right time, market-wise

It's true that at the end of the day, gold is just another commodity with no intrinsic value. On the other hand, it's value has never been 'zero'. Which can't be said of all kinds of paper, right down to printed money itself. Physical gold is also a wonderful way to lose your shirt, so to speak. I've been hanging on the sidelines of the gold investment freaks for nearly a year, reading the daily input on the Kitco gold discussion forum https://www.kitcomm.com/

Incidentally, there is (was?) a guy named AuBull who was posting some of the funniest [censored] I've ever read, bar none, until he apparently disappeared into Mexico about a month ago, leaving his thread 'Goldville: the only town worth livin' in ...' to his alcolytes - who are a hell of a lot less funny than he was. It takes a lot to get me to laugh, but this guy managed to do it on a daily basis.

Imagine a hillbilly Dave Barry writing about gold investment and the economy...Damn, but I miss him.

"... mid-day glory ... Divergence Heaven .... ain't seen a spread like this since Nadia Comaneci worked the parallel bars ... "

Check out his posts if you have the time - forum page 2, and backtrack three or four months in his thread ....