Are Mbws Really The Best Right Out Of The Box?

[TJGladeRaider]

If you have to look that hard to see the flaws.... Well, then you may consider that you're not the only one who has to strain your eyes to see these imperfections. The only time when they're really apparent is when you've got them posted as images, in larger than usual resolution. Then, they become the subject of scrutiny.

Either way Dude . . . I know you and I know where you live! If my new toys trouble me terribly, I know right where to go!

LOL

Bill

[By-Tor]

@Bill: Sorry about that my friend.

My purpose isn't to put them down...far from it. They're still utterly amazing watches. They feel completely different than your average Rolly rep, even unmodified ones. Don't regret buying them, they're worth every cent. And with that (inaccurate) solid link bracelet they feel even better than a genuine Rolex (never tried on a gen 1680 though). Still, nobody ever suggested my 1680 to be a rep (despite those inaccuracies). Who would, just look at the dial job Tommy did. How many reps that look like 50 year old watches you see? Same can probably be said about ANY vintage MBW watch. They have the "feel" of an expensive watch. Only Rolex experts can call them out. I think we all are "experts", more or less.

When I did the review of my Navitimer (which I found extremely accurate in many ways, but extremely inaccurate in many ways too) I tried to be totally honest with it and point out the flaws. Of course, when I get my new watch I'm always excited (who isn't). But when I look back my initial review and impression I sometimes notice a bias in my writeups. That's why I'll try to edit them accordingly... as I get some new information.

But the original question was "are the MBW's the most accurate reps out of box"? My opinion is: No. Especially the red 1680 model. What "Sherrington" fails to understand is that I'm not doing the reviews (or examine these watches) because I want to present myself as some kind of Nostradamus... it's just that I'd like that everyone gets accurate and subjective information. That's what this forum has always been about (for me): You learn something new every day...especially from your mistakes...and the community benefits from this knowledge. This is just pure fun for me, I don't want to take any stress about it. If someone's watch gets insulted because truth gets told I really can't help it.

Edited July 27, 2006 by By-Tor

[crystalcranium]

@Bill: Sorry about that my friend.

My purpose isn't to put them down...far from it. They're still utterly amazing watches. They feel completely different than your average Rolly rep, even unmodified ones. Don't regret buying them, they're worth every cent. And with that (inaccurate) solid link bracelet they feel even better than a genuine Rolex (never tried on a gen 1680 though). Still, nobody ever suggested my 1680 to be a rep (despite those inaccuracies). Who would, just look at the dial job Tommy did. How many reps that look like 50 year old watches you see? Same can probably be said about ANY vintage MBW watch. They have the "feel" of an expensive watch. Only Rolex experts can call them out. I think we all are "experts", more or less.

When I did the review of my Navitimer (which I found extremely accurate in many ways, but extremely inaccurate in many ways too) I tried to be totally honest with it and point out the flaws. Of course, when I get my new watch I'm always excited (who isn't). But when I look back my initial review and impression I sometimes notice a bias in my writeups. That's why I'll try to edit them accordingly... as I get some new information.

But the original question was "are the MBW's the most accurate reps out of box"? My opinion is: No. Especially the red 1680 model. What "Sherrington" fails to understand is that I'm not doing the reviews (or examine these watches) because I want to present myself as some kind of Nostradamus... it's just that I'd like that everyone gets accurate and subjective information. That's what this forum has always been about (for me): You learn something new every day...especially from your mistakes...and the community benefits from this knowledge. This is just pure fun for me, I don't want to take any stress about it. If someone's watch gets insulted because truth gets told I really can't help it.

What gives them that magical alchemey of "feel"??? Is it the 440 stainless? The fit and finish?

[TJGladeRaider]

@Bill: Sorry about that my friend.

This is just pure fun for me, I don't want to take any stress about it. If someone's watch gets insulted because truth gets told I really can't help it.

Yes indeed - Pure FUN; that's true for me as well, and as weird as this whole thing seems to my wonderfully patient wife, it's a far better "guy fun thing" than most of the others she's heard about.

The thing that all the new people should learn, as I have learned reading all these posts from the "experts," is there is only one truly, perfectly knowledgable expert on these forums, and his opinion is the absolute final word for me.

That's me. (Can't you almost hear the new guys say, "WTF?!")

"Yep, you heard that right, not By-Tor, Tommy, Randy, Ziggy . . . I am the expert that none of those guys can ever hope to be, simply because I can answer the only really important question that none of them could hope to reply to, "what does Bill like?"

I enjoy reading what all you guys have to say, and I have learned a great deal from all of you, but the most important thing I have learned from you, as all of you guys have pointed out over and over at one time or another - this thing is for fun, and we should all enjoy what we like.

I really do think that's the most important.

Bill

[Sherrington]

If it turned out like that... sorry. That wasn't my intention. Whether I'm right or wrong doesn't matter, I'd just like to get the facts straight, that's all.

And I have a feeling this discussion is going off on a wrong track. Let's forget the egos now and try not to make it personal. Crystalcranium asked a good question and this could be potentially informatial, good thread. Let's not ruin it.

By-tor you are completely right lets not make it personal. If I appeared to offend you then for that I apologise. However what I meant to get across is that there are so many variations of genuine 1680 Cg's that it is almost impossible to replicate the perfect example. Why? Because they are all different from the largish fattish ones to small pointy ones. What is correct is the MBW out of the box CG's are too big and need modding. Your point about the dial is mostly correct. If you know exactly what you are looking for you can spot the difference. It is one of the biggest flaws in a MBW 1680 as you can't mod dial printing and to buy a real one, weel we won't even go there. Even if the dial print is spot on (which it isn't) then the fake tritium markers are not convincing, unless you have theses modded as well. But there are variations of the dial in the 1680's and unless you are a Rolex expert you would be hard pushed to spot the difference (certainly without a loupe). Only them and us rep geeks would know and then not at arms length.

[dvn]

Yes indeed - Pure FUN; that's true for me as well, and as weird as this whole thing seems to my wonderfully patient wife, it's a far better "guy fun thing" than most of the others she's heard about.

The thing that all the new people should learn, as I have learned reading all these posts from the "experts," is there is only one truly, perfectly knowledgable expert on these forums, and his opinion is the absolute final word for me.

That's me. (Can't you almost hear the new guys say, "WTF?!")

"Yep, you heard that right, not By-Tor, Tommy, Randy, The Zigmeister . . . I am the expert that none of those guys can ever hope to be, simply because I can answer the only really important question that none of them could hope to reply to, "what does Bill like?"

I enjoy reading what all you guys have to say, and I have learned a great deal from all of you, but the most important thing I have learned from you, as all of you guys have pointed out over and over at one time or another - this thing is for fun, and we should all enjoy what we like.

I really do think that's the most important.

Bill

Bill,

you said on your ealier post on this thread that you have more MBW watches comming, are they comming from luckyy or somesonw else like george? Where are you getting your MBW watches from? can you pm me the info. I have been in this forum for abou 2 years now and i have not been able to get one MBW so can feel exactly what you guy are talking about?

[TJGladeRaider]

Bill,

you said on your ealier post on this thread that you have more MBW watches comming, are they comming from luckyy or somesonw else like george? Where are you getting your MBW watches from? can you pm me the info. I have been in this forum for abou 2 years now and i have not been able to get one MBW so can feel exactly what you guy are talking about?

I got mine ordered thru George - my prior efforts to acquire them were, shall we just say, rather "unlucky."

They were expensive, but people I have come to trust assure me that he is a man to be trusted, and the watches will be worth it. I have an MBW 1680 on my wrist that I bought second (or 22nd for all I know) hand, and I really enjoy this thing - even though I do have some other nice ones to choose from.

That's JUST my Rolexes

The best Sub/SD versions sold by Josh and Eddie Lee are fabulous, and I am proud to have them in my modest little collection, but I have a love for old things, so I wanted some first rate vintage too.

Bill

[dvn]

I got mine ordered thru George - my prior efforts to acquire them were, shall we just say, rather "unlucky."

They were expensive, but people I have come to trust assure me that he is a man to be trusted, and the watches will be worth it. I have an MBW 1680 on my wrist that I bought second (or 22nd for all I know) hand, and I really enjoy this thing - even though I do have some other nice ones to choose from.

That's JUST my Rolexes

The best Sub/SD versions sold by Josh and Eddie Lee are fabulous, and I am proud to have them in my modest little collection, but I have a love for old things, so I wanted some first rate vintage too.

Bill

Hi Bill,

An impressive collection of Rolexes. How do i contact George? Can you pm me George's contact info?

thanks

[ubiquitous]

Well... For what it's worth, pictures of my 1665 (the pics were the former owner's) were posted sometime back on TZ. The watch passed the visual as a genuine; crown guards and all.

Here is the link.

Toni can attest to the image, and will verify that the watch in the posting is the one I have in my possession now.

So... At the end of the day, in many cases, I don't think the experts can really verify one way or the other from pics; there are so many variations out there that no one can be 100% certain, unless the watch is just an obvious fake (and believe me, those you can tell). I suspect this is why many of the collectors, when asked for authentication from a visual, will answer 'take it to an RSC and have them open the back to verify'. Just because sometimes it is so difficult to tell without physically handling the watch, flipping through the dates, looking at the movement beat, looking at the movement, and running s/n checks.

[TJGladeRaider]

Hi Bill,

An impressive collection of Rolexes. How do i contact George? Can you pm me George's contact info?

thanks

He posted his website, and he's posted a lot of comments in the thread - just click on his name and use the link. I'll go back and find it for you if you have trouble.

Bill

[By-Tor]

By-tor you are completely right lets not make it personal. If I appeared to offend you then for that I apologise.

No problems. I'm not that easily offended. I speak up my mind but try to avoid getting too "personal". And I make mistakes too. I read your reply sloppily and didn't examine the pics very carefully.

However what I meant to get across is that there are so many variations of genuine 1680 Cg's that it is almost impossible to replicate the perfect example. Why? Because they are all different from the largish fattish ones to small pointy ones. What is correct is the MBW out of the box CG's are too big and need modding. Your point about the dial is mostly correct. If you know exactly what you are looking for you can spot the difference. It is one of the biggest flaws in a MBW 1680 as you can't mod dial printing and to buy a real one, weel we won't even go there. Even if the dial print is spot on (which it isn't) then the fake tritium markers are not convincing, unless you have theses modded as well. But there are variations of the dial in the 1680's and unless you are a Rolex expert you would be hard pushed to spot the difference (certainly without a loupe). Only them and us rep geeks would know and then not at arms length.

That's true. And I have never been so anal about the flaws. One of my favourite rep watches, Speedy BA Venus is a half-fantasy watch, a hybrid model, not accurate at all. Some people obsess much more over little inaccuracies. Of course it's nice to get a watch that's better in accuracy department, but for me the overall quality and "feel" is more important (besides the good looks of course). And perhaps we require more from the Rolex reps because they're automatically always "suspect" in people's eyes.

I was just thinking how beneficial it is to invest large amounts of money to create a rep that's 80%, or even 90% accurate...if it won't pass the "expert eye" anyway. I think people underestimate the knowledge of the collectors in places like TZ. If someone posts a pic of his MBW there (which I hope never happens) I'm sure 4 out of 10 Rolex guys there would spot it right away. Perhaps even more? Partly because I have a feeling that most of them read these forums too.. and they are aware of these reps. So the question remains: why do we modify them... for who, and is it worth it? Everyone can decide themselves.

I also find it strange that there's still no competition to MBW if people want a good vintage Rolex. Those other vintage reps don't come even close. Maybe outside the hardcore rep circles there's no real market for them?

I also wonder why Breitlings, PAMs and Omegas are (generally) better reps than Rolexes. Or perhaps I've lost my perspective... we've become ultimate geeks and "watch Trekkie bastards" and we're discussing about ridiculously small flaws here.

Rep will always be a rep, and they'll probably never become perfect. Maybe that's why they're so fascinating too? Just like Randy says: Everyone can walk to an AD and buy a Submariner. Where's the fun in that? I agree, paying $4000 for a watch isn't sane. It's much nicer to get 20 nice watches for the same price.

[ubiquitous]

Just to clarify- That wasn't me posting the pics on the TZ link that I posted. Rather, I ran into that one morning, recognized the pic, and contacted the former owner, and said... 'Hey, isn't that my watch? Looks like someone's hijacked some pics...' Sure enough, stolen pics. And of a rep no less.

Needless to say, that one had me scratching my head...

[By-Tor]

@Ubi: I have no idea what incident you're talking about...but someone from the forum once posted pics of my CN Sub to WatchUSeek Rolex forum. Actually I think it was the guy to whom I sold the watch. He was a noob and perhaps he just wanted to "test the waters". Only the fifth or sixth poster called him out though. I found that quite amazing because looking at that rep now... it was rather bad.

Needless to say it was an embarrassing thing to do, and I made a thread about it in the old RWG.

[Sherrington]

I totally agree. I could never afford to buy the gens of the reps I have:- Rolex MBW 1665, Rolex MBW 1680, Rolex DW 6263, Rolex 5517, Navitimer & Rolex LV. The fun is in making them as close as possible. Yes and probably 10 out of 10 Rolex experts would have to look twice before deciding. Like Randy my personal favouirite and daily beater is my 1665 white dial. And for the record the 1680 dial isn't that close but probably the best we are going to get in a rep.

[ubiquitous]

@Ubi: I have no idea what incident you're talking about...but someone from the forum once posted pics of my CN Sub to WatchUSeek Rolex forum. Actually I think it was the guy to whom I sold the watch. He was a noob and perhaps he just wanted to "test the waters". Only the fifth or sixth poster called him out though. I found that quite amazing because looking at that rep now... it was rather bad.

Needless to say it was an embarrassing thing to do, and I made a thread about it in the old RWG.

Ahhh... Have a look at my post at the bottom of page 3 in this thread... I posted about how my MBW 1665 made it's way onto the TZ Vintage Rolex forum and went unidentified (with a link to said post)...

[By-Tor]

Wonder how I missed that post... Well anyway, like I said, that white SD of yours is light years better than any average MBW 1680. It's light years better than my fully modded 1680 as well...which again proves that it's the best MBW base watch to start with.

Like I said, I couldn't call it out as a fake. Especially not from that angle. I could never, ever haven't been able to tell from your franken-Tudor, either. Didn't you put genuine dial in it...and the SD too?

[ubiquitous]

Well... The Tudor was a fun project... And a bit of a fluke. But it turned out quite nice. I do miss it... When I look at old pics...

As for the 1665; I fitted it with a CWP dial, though it's not exactly correct...

I'll be fitting the old MBW dial once again when my next (and final) mod shows up.

[freddy333]

Don't know what an MBW is... Bumped.

[preacher62]

On 7/25/2006 at 8:53 PM, cpt390 said:

I have a real Sub Dial.

 

Who's watch will it fit??

That's like asking, "How long is a piece of rope."

[hugop]

Wow! 10 year old blast from the past thread! Nice one to revive for a bit. Funny that we are still having these discussions about MBW and vintage Rolli's. This is still pertinent today considering the resurfacing of the cache of old MBW's that@rolexfinder has made available this year. MBW accuracy is still like it always was but we do not often see genuine examples of these great old watches in the wild anymore. Their stratospheric prices have locked them away into safes all over the world. So I will leave just this one main thought.

I get to enjoy this every day if I wish. I don't have to worry that I will loose a fortune if it is lost, damaged, or stolen. Thanks for that MBW.