alligoat

Maybe you could sand down the top of the tension ring- kinda like I did on my Euromariner. I'm surprised the Clark's crystal doesn't fit but I've heard of others having trouble fitting T-127's, period, so that's not unheard of. MBW quality does vary. I made out OK with my Euromariner, but I wasn't that impressed with it- certainly not the dealers fault- they come that way from the factory.

I'm only aware of three people selling MBW's, TTK, Paso, and Chris @ Eurotimez. Of course, you can go to the MBK Mall in Bangkok also and buy. But I'm not up on the new dealers and I wouldn't buy an MBW from the cartel since I already have one! The more I think about your bezel assembly, the more I realize it isn't right. Right in that it doesn't conform to the correct assembly and that's what MBW's were noted for- you could install a T-127 and gen insert and be good to go. The acid test would be if you could source a correct tension ring and flat washer and have it all fit with the crystal, bezel and insert. I hate to think that MBW would bastardize the 1680 assembly, so I'm kinda thinking it's a knock-off. But you never know what the rep makers will do. Wholesaleoutlet990 might sell them (tension ring and washer) on ebay, but you never know if his parts will work. Clark's Watch Supply would be another place to look possibly.

More importantly than 1680 or 5513 is does it say "ORIG POLEX DESIGN" above the model #? That's a major key to an MBW. BTW, the SN on my WM is L341068. Those 'L' serials sure do suck! Anything above 5 million on a red 1680 is way too bogus for me, but what can you do? My bezel assembly is like the one shown by Ubi in the post referenced by Southcoast68. Whether or not MBW has changed the construction of the bezel assembly, I don't know. The case itself seems to have the correct lines and look. Who did the sub come from? That would also help if we knew.

You might check ebay- there's a model 1002- it's an Oyster Perpetual, no date. Chronometer grade movement- 1570. Maybe you could find a dial from one of those- the cases are the same size as Datejusts. Black would be rare though, heck, the watches are somewhat rare themselves- in the late 60's and early 70's everyone wanted the date feature.

My Watchmaster 1680 says 5513 and has an L serial# like yours- maybe the same, I'll check tonite. The lugholes don't look bad, IMO. Mine are smaller and still need to be drilled out. The pic you show of the movement has a spacer ring in it- same color as the movement- gold. As for the copy movement- we all just have to accept it- Swiss eta's are becoming scarce- if you bought a 2846-2 from Jules Borel, it would run over $100, I believe and it still might need to be serviced sooner than later possibly. I don't know about the bezel assembly- I glued in a gen insert 2 years ago and I don't want to mess with it.

You won't know what the rep Air King dial diameter is until you buy the watch. You could also look at a rep Datejust dial- I've seen them in the 28mm range- probably just right for the Silix case. BTW, the Silix case had a plastic spacer ring, but what would you expect from a $75 watch?

Yeh, it's been my experience that Rolex dials are typically 1mm smaller than the rep dials- frustrating to say the least. I thought I was dead in the water trying to build a 16800 franken until I saw Stephane fit an old Sub dial in a noobmariner case. And then, lo and behold, Omega was drillling the lugholes out on the noob case. Suddenly I had a case to build a 16800 with. The gen Sub dial is 27.4mm and the inside rehaut on the noob is around 27mm- just enough to make it work. Here's the franken on the right, next to a gen 16800- both matte dials.

Buy a pair of digital calipers for 10 pounds, or do you guys call it 'quid'? Edit: I just pulled apart a Silix no cg sub- inside rehaut measures 27.24mm- maybe yours will be different, Teejay. The Air King dial is too small to fit my Silix case.

A perfectly tight movement holder would keep the movement and dial in place, but how would you get it in and out of the case- you have to have a little play for removing everything. Hold down tabs help, but when the dial fits the case, everything works just that much better. Have you uncased your Silix sub yet?

I don't see how sticky dots will help. You take your AK dial and yes you will have to attach it to the movement (which is 25.6mm in all likelihood- 2836-2, 2824-2, DG2813, etc.) with sticky dots or glue. But when you put the assembly in the case, if the dial is the same size as the inside rehaut, or just slightly larger, it's going to be very hard to position the dial exactly in the center and hold it and the movement in place without it getting kattywombus. If your Silix case has a 27mm rehaut opening and a 28mm dial- that leaves .5mm on either side of the opening. And the case is made for the dial, or vice versa. What you really need to do is remove the dial and movt from the Silix case and measure the inside rehaut with a set of calipers. Also, movement rings enter in to the equation, but the gist of the deal is, the dial has to be bigger than the inside diameter of the rehaut ring, and I would think by at least .5mm.

As a recreational diver you are certainly limited as to how deep you can go. But commercial/professional divers do go 300m. Of course it's not free diving and they don't take a 300m dive watch with them. They're in contact with the surface via radio and decompress in a chamber before they come to the surface- they don't even need a watch because they are closely monitored by the guys up top. A guy like brtelec over at RWI could certainly bring you up to date- he's a professional diver. Another thing to keep in mind is that 300m is in perfect conditions- any underwater activity is not perfect conditions. Additional forces are brought to bear by movement so really a 300m watch is only good for say 200m. Watch manufacturers don't recommend swimming or snorkling with anything less than a 100m watch. That means you can watch dishes with your 50m watch and feel safe. Anything more and your taking a chance.

Actually you can build a Frankenjust with a 2836-2. It just needs to be a 16013, 16014 or a 16030. These are the cases from the middle 80's with the 3035 movt. and plastic crystal. Here's one from a seller in Hong Kong: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewI...=tab%3DWatching You pick up the 'Tudor' hands which fit an ETA from Clark's watch supply on ebay, and a 24-602-0 crown and you're about good to go- oh, a datewheel overlay from www.cubic-works.com over in Hong Kong. You probably won't be able to get the correct datewheel font with the open 6's and 9's, but the Rolex overlay for the modern watches will work just the same and most people won't know the difference.

I doubt it will work- a 27mm dial needs a 26mm showing (rehaut) inside measurement- your tolerances are just too tight- 27mm dial in a 27mm (inside measurement) case will slide one way or the other and not work.

The gen which Gio showed is actually a white gold Sub- 116619- the 9 signifying white gold. It was introduced at Basel 2008. It is available for around $27K at your AD! It's sister model is the YG with blue bezel and dial- 116618- same high price. So buying the $129 rep can't be a bad deal- so long as you don't run into someone who really knows their Rolex Subs. Two tones are coming out this year, all stainless in 2010.

Case size on my 5501 is 34.25mm and dial is 27mm. Air Kings and Dates are the same sizes as far as I know.

Very nice, Marty. That countersink is beautiful! Laz, yours is looking good also. These look to be two very nice 1665's.

No, it's not worth getting. The bezel itself on an MBW 1665 is fine. You just need a better insert- or actually just a better pearl in the insert. PMWF sells a good insert and then you can get a good pearl from Ofrei- illumines dot- for $20. Together, you can build a very good insert. The pearl on the older 24-5513 inserts is all acrylic- no metal surrounding the pearl.

As much as I like my Euromariner, I've pretty much concluded that the quality on these babies varies from watch to watch. My insert snapped in, but I was playing w/ it last week and it just popped out. I snapped it back in by hand, but I'm thinking a few drops of glue might not be a bad thing. I sanded the heck out of the top of the bezel retention ring so that the insert and bezel could sit down correctly on it , but then I failed the WR test miserably- the crystal popped off. I had installed a Clark's crystal -it originally came with a crystal w/ the top and bottom gaskets???? If I could find a gen bezel, I'd give it a try because I already have a spare gen retention ring. This Euromariner has been a frustration for me- it's a good looking watch, but the quality of the bezel assembly just isn't there yet.

I did not countersink my case- I had a small recess there and the tube fit nicely. I used the aftermarket tube from Faisal Ali- wholesaleoutlet999- down here in Sugar Land, TX. It worked very well for me (unlike most of his parts which have been a disappointment). Sorry, I don't have a pic- my wife lost her camera (heck if she or I know how!) Gen pearls are definitely worth it- I put a gen insert on my Euromariner. But I also like the watchmaterial pearls- I've used them on the noob cases where you don't want to file down a gen insert (diameter especially) to make it fit the slightly smaller noob bezel- kinda a waste of a perfectly good gen insert, IMO.

Like trailboss says, the key is finding a small independent watchmaker- one who does his own work. It shouldn't be too hard to find one that can work on an ETA movt. And the only tricky part about putting a case tube in an MBW is that you have to enlarge the hole to 3mm first because MBW uses a smaller hole for their case tube. Then you tap it w/ a 3mm x .35 tap. Also might have to chamfer the hole so that the tube will sit in there correctly. You've got the tube and crown so you've already saved yourself $75 give or take.

Maybe you could tell us where you are on this planet- no point in mailing stuff halfway around the world. Sounds like you botched up the keyless works- no big deal.Any watchmaker can fix that. Changing out the case tube is a little more work- you'd probably have to drill and tap the case hole, install a new tube and at that point it would be advised to put on a gen crown. Not a big deal, but I would think it's worth between $100-150. Fixing the keyless works is a $30-40 deal. I don't think a movement swap would be necessary. Oops! I was on the phone while Andy was asking you where you were!

It never fails to amaze me how the rep mfrs can install a rep tube in a case w/ no splines to twist the booger in with! When I took my rep tube out of my Euromariner, the tube broke. Luckily I was able to jam a rat tail file in there and remove the threads which were still in the case- after heating the case up to melt the glue! Then I tapped the hole and installed the aftermarket case tube w/o a hitch- I didn't countersink/chamfer the case either before installing the tube and it worked fine. The nice thing about changing out the case tube is that it gives you the perfect oppurtunity to file down the cg's w/o the tube in your way.

At this point, he is referring to it as 'based on the 2892-A2' which is OK w/ me, assuming he services the movement. He throws a few other terms in there like 'customized' which looks to be bull, but a serviced Seagull movt ought to do fine. http://www.watchmaker9.tv/products/parts/eta2892-a2.htm That other article from watchuseek on the 2836 comparison with the eta/hangzhou/seagull movements which we saw earlier this week (from ajoesmith) indicated even w/o service, these chinese movements could last as long as 18 years. That's certainly longer than I expected, but I think most of us around here realize that the days of getting eta movts are numbered, so we're going to have to start using the clones sooner or later.

A seller on ebay usually has very nice cases- 16200's- for around $220- his name is 'roling'. Don't see any of his cases at this time. Here's a nice TT case: http://cgi.ebay.com/Mens-ROLEX-16233-Two-T...%3A1%7C294%3A50 I agree with everyone else, don't buy a rep case- the 3135 might not even fit- the rep cases are typically machined for a 2836-2/DG2813 movt.

Interesting, it sure looks like it to me. George refers to it as the KU-92. whatever that means- he doesn't say ETA or swiss in his description. Of course, if the movement were serviced by George's watchmaker, I would assume that it would be a very reliable movement.