building a 5513 and 1675

[mav16]

I'm looking to build a Submariner 5513 and GMT Master 1675 and have the Cartel 5513 and 1675 with Asian ETA 2836 clone movements on order.

 

I'm hoping that some of the more experienced that provide a little help?

 

Here are the list of parts that I'm looking to add and some questions...

 

Submariner 5513

- Replace clone movement with ETA 2824-2 or 2836-2 - Is this a straight, simple swap?  All the hands will fit fine?

- Clark T25-19 Plexi - Is this a plug and play part; no modification to the case needed?

- WSO Bezel Assembly - WSO offers different versions, rotating bezel, retaining ring, insert, and tension spring for $180 or rotating bezel, insert and tension spring or $80?  Which one is the right one to get?  Looks like the difference is just the retaining ring.  And is this part plug and play?

 

GMT Master 1675

- Replace clone movement with ETA 2893-2 or Hangzhou 6460 - I would prefer the ETA 2893 as I already have one from a donor watch that I can use, however the Hangzhou seems like it might be easier to swap without too much modification.  Will the ETA 2893 even fit the Cartel 1675 case, meant for the 2836?  Will I need a movement adapter or spacer?  Will the 2836 dial fit onto the 2893?

- ETA H5 Pinion Set for hand clearance

Cannon Pinion With Drive Wheel Height 2.90mm ( 242 ), ETA 2890 (ETA2890242H290)

Double Toothed Hour Wheel, Height 2.04mm ( 2558 ), ETA 2893.2 (ETA289322558H204)

Hour Wheel 24 Hour Height 1.19mm ( 251 ), ETA 2893.2 (ETA28932251H119)

Fourth Wheel Centre Seconds, Height 5.61mm ( 227 ), ETA 2890 (ETA2890227H561)

- WSO GMT Hand 250 hole size

- Clark T25-116 Plexi - Is this a plug and play part; no modification to the case needed?

- WSO Bezel Assembly - WSO offers different versions, rotating bezel, retaining ring, insert, and tension spring for $180 or rotating bezel, insert and tension spring or $80?  Which one is the right one to get?  Looks like the difference is just the retaining ring.  And is this part plug and play?

 

I'm also planning to send the watches to pbdad to reshape the crown guards, reluming, re-drill the lug holes and some aging.

 

Right now, I'm trying to figure out all of the right parts needed and start ordering them.

 

Thanks for your help!

Edited September 13, 2014 by mav16

[ceejay]

Don't know about the 5513 build but the 1675 seems a rather complicated build.

 

Tried and tested method for 1675.

Cartel 1655 case http://www.pf-818.com/00rlex00102-vintage-explorer-1655-ssss-asian-2813-p-9157.html

DG3804 Movement  https://www.cousinsuk.com/search?SearchTerm=3804

Movement has correct handstack & non independent GMT hand setting like gen, hand sets readily available.

Handset, correct case back (should be flat not bubble)  & 5.3mm crown (unless you stick with the incorrect 6mm) from raffle times http://www.rafflestime.com/servlet/StoreFront

Clarks is good for the crystal and bezel assembly including insert. This will all fit straight on to the 1655 case.

 

If you go with the WSO bezel then yes you need the retaining ring as that secures the crystal to the case and then the bezel clips on to the retaining ring. Same as the Clarks (clarks is cheaper)

 

This leaves you with a dial to buy, I went with Ingod44 but theres Yuki and NDT or gen or 'other'?

 

Mines a PCG 'cornino' GMT_2.jpg GMT_1.jpg

[jackflash]

For the 5513 go for an ETA 2846 slow beat. Don't bother with the WSO bezel assembly, Cartel is gen-like. Just get the insert from WSO, the version with the acrylic pearl. Get a better pearl from Yuki, fat font insert from Yuki is also alternative option. Get the 5513 ETA dial and hand set from Yuki. Alternatively a refurbished Singer dial from Yuki or Ingod44 (you'll need to clip the feet to apply it to an ETA movement). A 703 crown and tube set, or the rep 702 set from Athaya. T19 from Clark is fine. Here's my Cartel based 5513:

[sputim]

I am on the fence builing a 1675 aswell. I already have a gen plexi and recently ordered a yuki 1675 white dial. I wanted to go with ingod44 but as far as I know he's out of business or extremely hard to contact so I went on with yuki. I will order a cartel 1655 and caseback as well as hands I will get from Rafflestime. Ceejay why is everybody using the dg3804 movement and not the eta2836 with gmt function?

 

About the insert and bezel assembly I am not sure what the difference is yet between these both but I will certainly get one of them. Any experts can chime in and tell us what's the difference is?

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BEZEL-INSERT-ROLEX-BLUE-RED-GMT-1670-1675-16750-/160797503878?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2570473186

 

or the more expensive one from Clark's

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ROTATING-BEZEL-INSERT-ROLEX-OLD-GMT-BLUE-RED-1675-16750-/170838596185?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c6c61a59

 

Thanks for any help

[ceejay]

I am on the fence builing a 1675 aswell. I already have a gen plexi and recently ordered a yuki 1675 white dial. I wanted to go with ingod44 but as far as I know he's out of business or extremely hard to contact so I went on with yuki. I will order a cartel 1655 and caseback as well as hands I will get from Rafflestime. Ceejay why is everybody using the dg3804 movement and not the eta2836 with gmt function?

 

About the insert and bezel assembly I am not sure what the difference is yet between these both but I will certainly get one of them. Any experts can chime in and tell us what's the difference is?

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BEZEL-INSERT-ROLEX-BLUE-RED-GMT-1670-1675-16750-/160797503878?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2570473186

 

or the more expensive one from Clark's

 

http://itm/ROTATING-BEZEL-INSERT-ROLEX-OLD-GMT-BLUE-RED-1675-16750-/170838596185?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27c6c61a59

 

Thanks for any help

 

Hiya Sputim,

 

The ETA 2836 was never a real GMT movement, it has bits added to it to make it a GMT. I don't think there is any problem with it it's just more expensive and harder to get hold of than a DG3804.

The DG3804 is cheap, reliable and hand sets for it are easily sourced.

 

Now look at your 2 links and you will see that the Clarks link contains 4 items, the bezel retaining ring (this is the expensive part) the bezel, friction ring and insert.

The WSO link has only 3 pieces, the bezel, the insert (already installed on the bezel) and the friction ring. The expensive retaining ring is not included hence the price difference.

 

This is the bezel retaining ring for the WSO assembly http://www.ebay.com/itm/RETAINING-BEZEL-INSERT-ROLEX-GMT-16750-1675-1670-PARTS-/310304838741?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item483f9c1455

 

Hope this helps.

Edited September 13, 2014 by ceejay

[tframo]

Now you guys have me wanting to build a 5513 and 1675. Great looking piece ceejay

If you ever want to sell it, let me know

[droptopman]

Both beautiful classic time pieces.

Recently finished a 16750 and it turned out really nice but ended up way over budget. Getting everything to fit correctly was somewhat challenging even using genuine or gen spec parts.

Finished piece. Good luck.

Sent from my droptop using telepathy.

[mav16]

Thanks for the replies.

It seems the 5513 build will be more straight forward than the 1675.

I'm still debating to try to fit the ETA 2893 or go with Hangzhou 6469 or DG3804. I want something that will be reliable and easily serviceable in the long term.

[ww12345]

Personally, I'd go with either a 2836gmt or a dg3804gmt. The 2892/3 is too thin to fit in a regular case without extensive modifications.

[ceejay]

To service a automatic movement, whichever model it is will cost at least twice as much as putting in a new DG3804 Unless you can service it yourself.

[sputim]

To service a automatic movement, whichever model it is will cost at least twice as much as putting in a new DG3804 Unless you can service it yourself.

Ceejay you have sold me for the dg3804 movement but will the cartel or rolexpete dw fit the movement and is the movement ring included by cartel version of 1655 usable in this case? Thanks for all the info guys

[ceejay]

Ceejay you have sold me for the dg3804 movement but will the cartel or rolexpete dw fit the movement and is the movement ring included by cartel version of 1655 usable in this case? Thanks for all the info guys

Yes, the ring & DWO will fit. You could even use the movement that comes with the 1655.

The are basically the same movement. The movement that comes in the (cheapest cartel 1655) is a modified 2813. The DG3804 has a better (IMO) implication of the date change & GMT functions.

The DG is machined better and offers better reliability. But the gear train side is identical to the 2813 except for the balance c ock.

Here's the important part... Some retailers are selling the cheaper movement (modified 2813) as a DG3804 but it doesn't have the DG logo stamped on the mainplate. That's why I recommend buying from cousins uk as you will get the correct movement.

Got mine on today

Sent from my toilet using Andrex.

[JoeyB]

To service a automatic movement, whichever model it is will cost at least twice as much as putting in a new DG3804 Unless you can service it yourself.

Yep. As I've said a few times before, the way to service a DG movement is to remove it from the case. Lay it on the workbench. Hit it with a 40oz hammer.   Brush what is left into the trash can. And install a brand new movement for under $30usd.    

[mav16]

So DG3804 it is!  Thanks ceejay and JoeyB.

 

I think I might get the bezel assemblies and crystals from Clarks.  Some of you guys refer to WSO as Mr. Slimeball, which can't be good.  HAHA

 

Are the Clark parts easy to install, meaning do they simply snap into place?

 

I'm also adding a Rafflestime Milsub caseback to the 1675 to finish it off.

Edited September 15, 2014 by mav16

[ceejay]

Don't go into this thinking everything is going to just click into place. You will run into little issues that will require a bit of manipulation to fit.

The Clarks & WSO parts are meant to be gen spec but for instance... I had to sand the clarks crystal a little so the bezel retaining ring would fit correctly.

 

Tip: Order 2 crystals as I have cracked a couple when I installed them, it's a fine balance between them being too tight or too loose

 

Gary Clark is a gentleman to deal with, I don't know if it's the same but there was no option on combined shipping on a few items I ordered from him. I ordered anyway and got a message soon after that he had refunded me the difference. He was also happy to put the value under the threshold so I avoided import duty.

 

I haven't had a problem with the stuff I have ordered from WSO but it has always been declared at full value and I have been hit with the custom charges...just my experience.

 

The Millsub back is what I used.

[JoeyB]

My 1675 was built using Gary Clark's crystal and bezel and insert. If fit together correctly leaving the friction ring off. The bezel turns as gen by slight downward press and turn. Gary is a great guy, honest and fair. 

 

[mav16]

For the Clark T19 crystal for the 5513, there are two different versions - vintage and dome. Which one is more authentic to get?

[alligoat]

The 5513 was made for 30 years- from 1960 to 1990! There are bunches of crystals- just check Ofreis and look at their selection. www.ofrei.com

Notice the sizes also vary..

here's one from jandkwatches

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Plastic-Plexi-Watch-Crystal-For-Fit-Rolex-Tropic-19-Swiss-Made-/300731202037?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4604f9f9f5

this is the flatter variety- I guess you'd call it later.

Which crystal you get depends on which model of watch you're trying to replicate- early, middle or late 5513

You could also buy extra crystals and play around and see which you like best.