By-Tor Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Hey guys... if we think about the magnificient reps from the last 12 months what did we get? Omegas, IWC, Breitlings, TAG Link, Bell & Ross, Hublot, AP, PAMs (I guess) etc. But not even one single magnificient Rolex replica. Noobmariner is great and perhaps one of the best bargains ever in the rep world, but it's not playing in the same level with the new "super reps"... like the Ultimate PO, TAG Link, some IWC models or the upcoming Breitling Chronomat. The popularity of Rolex has also dramatically decreased here. If you forget our "modding masters" Ubi, Sherrington, Repaustria, etc. you don't see many members (save the newbies of course) buying or even talking about Rolex anymore. Wonder if the Rolex (as a brand) has lost appeal among the members, or is it just that the Rolex reps are generally quite pathetic? I'm not sure... what do you think? I mean... If you think about ExpII, Sub date, GMT Master II, etc. they're fairly close visually, but they still have some fundamental flaws. For example... how can the factories make the white dial Explorer II hour marker boxes grey instead of correct black? There are thousands and thousands of reference pictures of this dial all over the Google. And remember that HORRENDOUS dial and bezel insert print on the new model of GMT II replica? All Rolex Oyster reps have more or less inaccurate crown guards. Even the "fixed" ones usually look downright horrible. And the pearl usually looks like a pimple that's about to burst... even on the MBW's (I got utterly superior pearl from a $1 replacement insert), that endless crystal/rehaut issue... it's always wrong, etc. etc. To be honest Submariner has dramatically improved from the POS it used to be, but it's still not very close (compared to many other less popular reps). The best rep Submariner case is the TW best which is probably 4 years old!!! All new attempts have been counterproductive. You gotta admit it's pretty pathetic. And don't even get me started with the MBW's. I know it's bit of a "taboo" here due to their large fan base (I'm a fan too)... but let's be straight here: You need to buy grossly overpriced rep which is very inaccurate in "out of the box" condition. Then you need to invest significant amount of extra money to buy genuine parts (change almost everything) and on top of that find a skillful modder to make this very simple and basic diver watch to look even remotely right. And yet the MBW's are completely superior to the new models. Some of the new rep attempts of vintage Oysters are so pathetic that I don't know whether I should laugh or cry. And why do the factories refuse to forge the SeaDweller properly, despite all those thousands of requests. Our members won't buy the cheap-ass versions with Submariner case and bezel. Period. I completely understand the limitations that the factories have with the Daytona. By now most veteran members know to stay away from the "seconds at 6" Daytona... and the El Primero subdial spacing of the old Daytona is impossible to mimic with the 7750. DW Daytonas are supposedly great, but they're hard to source, very expensive and have shitty movements. I also understand the limitations of repping the TT models perfectly. So... what do we have left? Bunch of completely outdated reps that only uninformed noobs buy anymore. Perhaps the factories haven't paid attention to Rolex lately, and the "big bang" (no pun) is just waiting around the corner? I'm still a fan of the whole Rolex sports line and would like to buy some new Rolly reps. Right now the only Rolex I think it's worth keeping is the "old batch" GMT II (which at least visually is quite good, despite the wrong hand stack). ExpI is of course excellent too, but I don't quite enjoy wearing gents' watches in ladies' size. So come on factories... a nice glossy pearl, good rehaut and correct crown guards on a basic Sub can't be that hard to produce if you can replicate extremely difficult stuff like the "electric middlesection" on the TAG Link Chronograph dial perfectly. How about making the factory communicate with us through a dealer... like Angus did with the Hublot and Chronomat? PS: I could also be wrong about this whole thing. Because in most people's minds Rolex is synonymous to FAKE (or at least a potential fake) ...so perhaps we're much more anal and provincial about the flaws in Rolexes.. and more "liberal" with the other brands? Post your thoughts!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gioarmani Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Fugedaboutit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 We are simply not the target market for the replica Rolexes made today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted January 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 We are simply not the target market for the replica Rolexes made today. Hmm... but if obscure, complicated and non-mainstream watch like HBB can sell enough to make profit... don't you think replicating a 1:1 Submariner / SeaDweller (they should be very simple watches to replicate) wouldn't be profitable for the factory? Or at least to the factory that takes such project? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Hmm... but if obscure, complicated and non-mainstream watch like HBB can sell enough to make profit... don't you think replicating a 1:1 Submariner / SeaDweller (they should be very simple watches to replicate) wouldn't be profitable for the factory? Or at least to the factory that takes such project? Yes, but they'd be competing with the big boys. The last time someone mentioned this idea, words like 'chinese mafia' were bandied about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted January 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Yes, but they'd be competing with the big boys. The last time someone mentioned this idea, words like 'chinese mafia' were bandied about. Ahh...sounds melodramatic but at least that'd make sense. First time I heard this, actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elprimerozen Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I think that people in general are trying to avoid Rolex because everybody froma child to a 40 years old man will tell you its fake....if you have on your hand a Rolex they will first think that its a rep and thats a fact!But you are 100% correct that the watch maker has turned his back on a 1:1 Rolex rep....maybe the clue is that everyone of the noobs will go for a sub or gmt or daytona,so money are coming with no need of a good rolex rep(when i was a noob i also go for a rolex,but an expl 2 witch for me was and is a very accurate rolex rep).We have to see that in Josh site(from which i ordered all my reps) there are more than 600 rolex come on watch makers make a good and accurate Rolex rep!!!.....and this crazy story for mbw rolex its no solution to more than 99% of rolex rep byers....so we all have to say the watch maker to go for only 4-5 1:1 Rolex rep : First ofall an ACCURATE Sub(all subs are screaming that they are fake),No2:GMT master,No3:seadweller,exp2,datejust ,daytona........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Ahh...sounds melodramatic but at least that'd make sense. First time I heard this, actually. It was mentioned in passing in this thread here: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=16728 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
t Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 who is rolex? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longshot Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 i think we don't talk as much about rolex anymore because all the members who want one, have what they want and have for a while. i have a modded tw sub (gen insert and sel's and clasp and re-done cg's and drilled and fitted with gen springbars) and a GMII and even though by-tor hates the newest GMTII i wanted one that worked like a gen and had the correct hand stack and with a replacement insert it's of my favorites! we are a tiny fraction of the rep buyers and i'm betting that most anyone who gets the same reps we get from our dealers, who is not a WIS, is overjoyed with the product. i would love to see a really excellent seadweller and would buy one in a minute. but since they seem to have no problem selling the seadwellers and subs and daytonas etc they are making now i don't see it happening Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfreeman420 Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I have to say I think the Rolex reps are actually getting WORSE!!! I bought one of the first seconds @ six daytonas over a year ago when they first got the dial spacing right. The asian 7750 movement runs smooth and flawlessly to this day. The watch is amazing. Only real flaws are the case width and crown guards. No big deal to me. Now I look at the newer daytonas and the subdials have these thick silver or gold rings that scream fake. I waited forever for a good two tone version and bought a white dial with the new "solid gold" end links and it died in a week. I have the second black dial with diamond markers still running but this version is inferior to my old SS model. First the case is even thicker and the gold dial printin is awful. The gold is good and appears to be solid or heavy wrapped, but because of the thickness it doesn't get as much wrist time as I anticipated. I also just got one of the new two tone blue subs with the solid end links. The dial on this one is about the best I have seen but everything else is horrible. The crown and bezel are dark color and don't even match the band. The bracelet is totally flimsy and the clasp has this big thumbnail shaped dip in the foldover part. The crown on the clasp is also horrible. I have a TT blue sub I bought over three years ago from Wade (some may remember). This has holes in the case, but the crown and bezel are solid gold. The clasp is about perfect and the gold has not worn off the bracelet. There is a tad of tarnish on the endlink (most of these suffered that problem). I bought the new sub with hopes high and thought it would surpass my old daily beater from long ago, but I have been highly dissapointed. I am a die hard Rolex fan, but can't seem to get anything decent latley. I have been purchasing alternatives and my "perfect" yachtmaster does get more wrist time than I thought it would, but I do think we have taken a few steps back when it comes to Rolex. Another new Rolex I have purchased is a gold day date. I have to admit the gold plating is the best I have seen and the dial printing is good. That is where the good part ends. What is supposed to be a rolesor clasp just snaps into place instead of being spring loaded like the first SS version and gen is. Also, it apears to be a tad smaller than the new gen DD. It looks like a datejust case which is 36mm. They need to make a 1:1 DD case at 38mm like the new gen DD. This is another model I waited for for a long time and have been dissapointed I think the dealers need to pay attention to this and remember that Rolex started this whole replica madness. I remember when all we had was swiss rolex and asian vacheron, piaget, cartier, omega and patek along with a few other obscure names that had limited production. I think the average newb still comes here looking for the best sub, but after looking through the forum and reading all the info here other models far exceed what is avaiable in the Rolex brand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFlash Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Rolex is what first got me started in this hobby of ours. I am currently maxed out on them. Got every model worth having in every color, (except Daytona's --> POS) Not really interested in any more unless they start making better quality reps. The new improved models are not improved enough to me to justify buying another. When they really make significant improvements then I may upgrade. By the way, they only scream fake to less than 0.001% of the watch wearing population. Never had anyone say that my sub has abnormal looking crown guards, my rehaut was't deep enough, or my cyclops was to far lateral. Suspect no one ever will - not unless I run into one of you guys somewhere! Jetmid !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cpt390 Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 @jfreeman420 " It looks like a datejust case which is 36mm. They need to make a 1:1 DD case at 38mm like the new gen DD. This is another model I waited for for a long time and have been dissapointed" I saw that Joshua has a new Daydate in 38mm. I emailed him and asked if he was including the crown in that and he says not.. Link is below 38mm Daydate?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyp1 Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 (edited) Ok well I have to say that the recent GMT MASTER II I received from a UK auction site has dials that are unbelievable. These dials are beautiful!!!!!!!! Edited January 11, 2007 by tonyp1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poopypants Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 (edited) well who here actually thinks a flood of 1:1 rlx models will find their way into the world?!?! i agree that the manufacturers have put a lot of effort into these new "refreshing" models these past months... and i am all about it! but when was the last "major" change to the genuine standard rlx models??????? um yeah, seems like never... so whats the deal? it would definitely put THIS TOPIC to bed if they would just release a decent rep of our favorite models... )sub, sd, exp, gmt-m, dj, dd, etc) lets be honest, the current owners of rlx models have bought almost every model that has come out... those who are saying, they have all the rlx models they need are just full of it... everyone here knows, that if a 1:1-like rep came out... those people would be unloading pieces of their collection just to update... fact! I think like Dane Cook once said, "Its a Vicious Circle"!!! btw, who is the influence of whats new or gets re-done these days?!?! Us? Dealers? Something else? As much as we have beaten this topic to death... IT WILL ALWAYS BE AROUND unless there are 'readily available' rlx models that DO take on the special characteristics of the genuine article... the bad part... due to the physical characteristics of rep vs. gen... is this really possible??? sadly, everyone who breaks these things open say, no! some say the physical characteristics of something as small as where the stem protrudes from the movement is different the from the ETA models to the 3035/3135... hence the reason for the shallow rehaut... However, Why not build new models with genuine characteristics like bezels? bezel inserts? and the ever-hated pearl? why not have a consistent date mag?!?!?! like the vintage reps... why dont ANY "modern" reps allow for genuine parts WITHOUT modification (shaving, sanding, drilling, etc...) i mean manufacturers have the ability to use gen-like tubes, but they continue to use cheap [censored]... anyway, i have beaten this topic to death for the past few years... on rwg1 and trc... its not worth it... nothing has changed... yes the models have improved a little bit... but, am i impressed? not really... i think rlx has taken "back seat"... in the eyes of the members here and the people who make them... sorry for rambling mess of a post i have made on your thread! EDIT: Sorry had to add... claiming "PERFECT" on a model that simply IS NOT perfect... is utterly bad business... sure most people who buy them will be extaticly pleased with what they receive in the mail... but those are far from "PERFECT" Lets just throw out the definition of "PERFECT" : being complete of its kind and without defect or blemish... HAHA, so how many threads have been created regarding the "imperfections" of the PERFECT sub or SD or whatever!?!?! PP Edited January 9, 2007 by poopypants Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Tracy Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I think that the style of Rolex which once stood for stability is now turning stagnant,... If Rolex would take a chance, and come out with something bold, unusual but still Rolex,.. the gears would start to churn again... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertk Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Well, Looks like Rolex is going into the dumper..........despite the fact that they are still the best selling luxury watch made.........the reps just suck. Goodbye Rolex! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Every Rolex watch I've wanted I ended up building... DW Daytona with Swiss Valjoux23 transplanted Franken-Daytona (white) Franken-Daytona (black) Franken-16610 Modded MBW's 1665 1680s Others that were built but traded or given away... Franken 16234 Tudor 7928 DWs... Personally, I don't mind the inaccuracies as it alows me to build Half the fun for me is tracking down gen parts The other half is watching a creation take shape... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted January 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 By the way, they only scream fake to less than 0.001% of the watch wearing population. Never had anyone say that my sub has abnormal looking crown guards, my rehaut was't deep enough, or my cyclops was to far lateral. Suspect no one ever will - not unless I run into one of you guys somewhere! Jetmid !!! I agree. But for me rep collecting isn't about what other people think about my watches. Getting more accurate reps is just fun... and part of what's so great about this hobby. I don't even mind wearing complete fantasy watches from obscure brands... but Rolex is different. Probably because the flaws and problems with the reps are so widely discussed... and I find the whole Rolex subject fascinating. Perhaps one factory has a monopoly to Rolex reps (just like Puggy suggested) and the other creators don't want to step on their toes? It'a amazing how little we know about the creators of these watches. I know we can help them to improve the reps, but there has been very little straight interaction with the makers... until now. Thanks all for your thoughts. Yeah, this is like beating a dead horse (which is already in the glue factory). But it has to be asked every now and then. PS Randy: Those are amazing...but they're not reps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flavor flav Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 the only rolexes i want belong to ubi all the rest are boring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmarc Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 the only rolexes i want belong to ubi all the rest are boring. What Flav said... Esmarc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youpmelone Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 Can we do a group buy on UBI's Rolex connenction? By-thor: Your words to the chinese gods ears.. looking for a decent GMT II for months.. still have come up dry.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsons Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I agree with the comments that the recent rlx reps are worse than some of the discontinued models. The best 16610 I've seen by a wide margin was the classic TW. Even with its inaccurate dial, the case was the most accurate produced. One would have thought that manufacturers would build on that platform and improve the darn thing but that was not to be. The case was discontinued and the rest have been downhill, IMO. Without an accurate case, it is just not worth the time, effort and cash to make the new crop look acceptable. Geeez, they can't even get the insert and pearl correct after all these years. The new GMT movement with the idividually adjustable GMT hand looks to be a bag of worms per The Zigmeister's excellent review. I'm not even touching that one. I have enough door stops as is. I'm full on rlx as well untill I see something that is stunning & special, along the lines of the new Tags, Omega chorno and ultimate PO (can't wait for a 42mm version of this). I believe these have set the new bechmark of what should be expected. The rlx just aren't in the same playing field. The impressive quality of these have blown rlx out of the water in terms of accuracy and hence their fall in popularity. Good post, BT! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighDef Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I agree with you By-Tor, the rep factories think Rolex reps are selling anyway, why spend more money on modifieng it to 1:1. As much as I love Rolex reps, no more Rolex for me, I repeat "NO MORE ROLEX FOR ME" this 2007 until I see good improvement. I am settng my sights on new Omegas , Breits and APs this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hank7502 Posted January 9, 2007 Report Share Posted January 9, 2007 I agree with you By-Tor, the rep factories think Rolex reps are selling anyway, why spend more money on modifieng it to 1:1. As much as I love Rolex reps, no more Rolex for me, I repeat "NO MORE ROLEX FOR ME" this 2007 until I see good improvement. I am settng my sights on new Omegas , Breits and APs this year. I used to be a big Rolex fan but the other reps are far superior. I find myself wearing Omegas and Tags most of the time. I had a gen Rolex and people still thought it was a rep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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