mezzanine Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 I'm surprised I haven't yet seen a discussion or review of the 'copy 2824' movement that is much cheaper and supposedly has the same fit and finish as the more expensive rep. Can anyone provide feedback as to whether this movement is likely to be reliable? Or is it simply something like a 21j? Am I safe to buy this watch, or would I be better off ponying up for the 'ETA' version? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fitmic Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 To my knowledge, there hasn't been any review of that movement yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezzanine Posted January 26, 2007 Author Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 To my knowledge, there hasn't been any review of that movement yet. I'm starting to do some more research, and some members have alluded to dealers that sell the Ultimate PO with the 'ETA' *cough* movement for less than what TT/Josh are selling them for. I'm going to try to research that, but almost fell into the pitfall of thinking I could get it from Silix for a killer deal- until I realized it was an earlier version still. I'm sure it's still a good version, but I'm after the good AR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r11co Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 Good luck to you! From the information we have (ie. dealer pictures) the watch has the same case, band, face, hands, bezel with pearl. etc. etc. as the 'ultimate' with ETA. However, we have since established that certain dealer information can be inconsistent with what you actually receive. IF you do receive an 'ultimate' with just a cheaper movement at least you have the insurance that a proper ETA 2824 can be sourced and substituted at a later date. My advice would be source an ETA one from another dealer and negotiate the price. I managed to snag one for only $30 more than TT/Josh are selling their new 'ETA ringer' for.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 Good luck to you! From the information we have (ie. dealer pictures) the watch has the same case, band, face, hands, bezel with pearl. etc. etc. as the 'ultimate' with ETA. However, we have since established that certain dealer information can be inconsistent with what you actually receive. IF you do receive an 'ultimate' with just a cheaper movement at least you have the insurance that a proper ETA 2824 can be sourced and substituted at a later date. My advice would be source an ETA one from another dealer and negotiate the price. I managed to snag one for only $30 more than TT/Josh are selling their new 'ETA ringer' for.... Good advice there No reviews I suspect because they've only just been advertised, never mind received. If you're that concerned or simply want the best PO you can buy then just stretch the extra few quid (or if you have a good relationship with your dealer, just haggle like Rico says) and pony up for the ETA version. However, if you want a watch to play around with, mod, give as a gift (i.e. cheapskate ), or if you want to spend your life regulating the time against an online atomic clock and having sleepless nights/giving yourself an ulcer worrying about if it's going to pack in, then sure go for the cheapo version. But be warned, the Seagull (Venus or Lemania clone) aside, there is not an Asian mechanical movement made yet that even comes close to the reliability or accuracy of a nice swiss ETA (and don't even think about mentioning 'there's no such thing as Swiss all made in Asia' [censored] - loose pack or not the parts' QC is the same, a quick service and voila!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andreww Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 I've got one of these on order. As far as getting from other dealers, forget it. Josh and Andrew had 100 units custom made, so you can only get it there. I have seen so called "ultimate" versions available from other dealers, but included flaws like short hands and oversized logo. Josh & Andrews "Ultimate Lite" is constructed from the same parts as the Ultimate, just with cheaper movement. It wouldn't surprise me if you could drop an eta movement in there if needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 I have the one from silix - its my first PO - i like it alot, i think the AR is pretty impressive. if just a fingerprint gets on the crystal it has to be wiped off because its SO prominent - which is the sign of great AR i don't think its double sided though There is a photo of the watch in Phobands Collection in my sig. I don't think its an earlier version - i think it is a parallel version from the josh/trusty i.e. more better fixes than the 5th generation but not as many fixes as josh trusty. The hands i think are longer than 5th gen but a hair shorter than josh. - I don't know how to judge pearls - the bracelet on it is the best rep bracelet i have ever had. I'm super happy with mine and it has become one of my top 3 in the rotation I had ordered it with a 2824 - but recieved a 2836 - and i tried with some tape to get the back off - but, haven't been able, hopefully someone will have a caseback tool at the official RWG lunch coming up so i can snap a shot of the movement - but, silix has said he will stand behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenacious_b Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 I have the Asian Ultimate Orange, and the Swiss Eta 2006 Dial with black bezel. The watches are identical aesthetically...obvious the exact same casing...no question. The Asian version has a loud rotor and winds smoother. Other than that, same weight, sweep, awesome lume, etc. The ONLY differences I could find visually is that the case on my asian has fewer manufacturing duffs, and has an ever so slightly smaller date font. I love them both, have gotten mad compliments on both, and will likely buy the black and white asian version to round out my po collection. If you can live with the loud rotor, or want to take a chance greasing it as some other members have suggested to kill the noice, it's every bit as fantastic a rep as the swiss version. Bryan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanerich Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 First off, I'm pretty sure it's just a myth that there's any significant difference between the latest ultimate 45mm PO sold by our various trusted dealers. Second, considering there are reliable dealers on the board who will sell you the regular ETA Ultimate PO for $179 or less with shipping included, I personally wouldn't go with the ETA copy just to save $25. On the other hand, if River starts selling it for $119 plus free shipping it would be hard to turn that down. The PO is a damn nice rep, I could use an orange bezel one too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haveblue Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 I have the Asian Ultimate Orange, and the Swiss Eta 2006 Dial with black bezel. The watches are identical aesthetically...obvious the exact same casing...no question. The Asian version has a loud rotor and winds smoother. Other than that, same weight, sweep, awesome lume, etc. The ONLY differences I could find visually is that the case on my asian has fewer manufacturing duffs, and has an ever so slightly smaller date font. I love them both, have gotten mad compliments on both, and will likely buy the black and white asian version to round out my po collection. If you can live with the loud rotor, or want to take a chance greasing it as some other members have suggested to kill the noice, it's every bit as fantastic a rep as the swiss version. Bryan great comparison....thanks! i always thought that my eta PO 45.5 had a small date size.....if the asian is smaller, then that will make for a lot of squinting when wanting to read the date.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotoman Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 First off, I'm pretty sure it's just a myth that there's any significant difference between the latest ultimate 45mm PO sold by our various trusted dealers. Second, considering there are reliable dealers on the board who will sell you the regular ETA Ultimate PO for $179 or less with shipping included, I personally wouldn't go with the ETA copy just to save $25. On the other hand, if River starts selling it for $119 plus free shipping it would be hard to turn that down. The PO is a damn nice rep, I could use an orange bezel one too! No, silix said straight out he couldn't get the one Josh and Trusty are selling. So its not hte same - also on mine the threads for the crown are on the crown tube - not inside the crown on the josh/trusty one which i think people were having issues with. and the one i got was 150+ship for ETA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenacious_b Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 The crown tube threads on both my asian and swiss ult po are on the interior of the tube, and both are smooth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted January 26, 2007 Report Share Posted January 26, 2007 The crown tube threads on both my asian and swiss ult po are on the interior of the tube, and both are smooth. When you say smooth do you mean they screw in smooth or are worn smooth and now non existant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanerich Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 No, silix said straight out he couldn't get the one Josh and Trusty are selling. So its not hte same - also on mine the threads for the crown are on the crown tube - not inside the crown on the josh/trusty one which i think people were having issues with. and the one i got was 150+ship for ETA I'm pretty sure the ones EL and River are selling as "ultimate PO's" are the same as Trusty's. Got mine from EL who assured me it was (the one reviewed by By-Tor) and sure looks good to me, internal threaded crown, good AR, best pearl, best bracelet, everything. River uses identical pics as EL and they usually have the same stuff, so I believe him when he says he has the same watch. Bought the PO as part of a package deal, and it cost less than $179 shipped for the ETA. Anyway, I think we both prove the point that until the price drops or Trusty finally starts offering free shipping, a $154 ETA copy PO is kind of on the borderline in terms of being worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenacious_b Posted January 27, 2007 Report Share Posted January 27, 2007 Screw in very smoothly. When you say smooth do you mean they screw in smooth or are worn smooth and now non existant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2sweetau Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 (edited) the 28,000 bph..... is the asian copy of the 2824 really comparable with the gen eta 2824 in terms of sweep???? i like the idea of this special model. i dont have anythin agaist asian copied movments except for the 7750 (but i think the eta 7750 is a crapy design in the first place). infact my super cheap cartier roadster with an asian 21 jewel is running at 2+ a day even after 2.5 years. the stainless steel plating (yes plating) is fading inside the bracelet, its been smacked around abit too but the watch keeps trucking. to be honest, the frill of buying such watches for me is to experince the lenghts one goes to basically the gen on wrist for as little as possible. Edited February 1, 2007 by 2sweetau Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenacious_b Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 @ 2sweetau, The sweeps are identical, and I just posted how I took both of them in multiple dips back and forth between a cold pool and hot tub, both of which are salt water, and both watches are water tight, keeping time, and looking good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2sweetau Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 @ 2sweetau, The sweeps are identical, and I just posted how I took both of them in multiple dips back and forth between a cold pool and hot tub, both of which are salt water, and both watches are water tight, keeping time, and looking good. SWEET, i mean it sounds really promising. i read that post, and im really excited with regards to your comment about workmanship of the asian eta model. im lucky enough to only have the one watch with manufacturing flaws so i trust my good run with continue with the ultimate "totally" Asia PO 45.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted February 1, 2007 Report Share Posted February 1, 2007 Does anyone know whether you can swap the bezel and insert on the ultimate 45.5 for gen? I know you can't on the 42.5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenacious_b Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 I've read in other threads and other boards that they are manufactured totally differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanerich Posted February 2, 2007 Report Share Posted February 2, 2007 Does anyone know whether you can swap the bezel and insert on the ultimate 45.5 for gen? I know you can't on the 42.5. Try asking docblackrock The oem bezel cannot be swapped out, and the bezel insert can't be removed either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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