BEST Payment Option - Definitely NOT PAYPAL

[bully]

oh yes and i forgot, theres a crapload of egold trojans out there, which will EMTPY your account (without you noticing it).

and anti-virus software wont even detect them, since they are specifically programmed by someone who then sells them to other ppl.

good to know at least someone around here is smart! even i withdraw the money i have in my PP account everytime someone sends me some, and i'm not doing "big business" with a huge risk of chargebacks!

see it like this: would you walk around with 50.000$ in your wallet? no?

Yes , you need to be careful for trojans, but if you take very basic precautions you will not have your account hacked. I have had my account for years and know many others too with accounts, I do not personally know anyone with a hacked account.

But yes people's accounts are hacked, just as their pp, Bank and Ebay accounts are hacked aswell.

With pp, yes you withdraw the money ASAP, but if there is a chargeback, you have a - balance, so you need a new account, and to keep getting new pp accounts is not straight forward. When you have the pp linked to a Website Shop, you cant watch it 24 hours a day to withdraw the funds as they come in either.

Edited May 3, 2006 by bully

[slay]

It was stupid to link his pp account to a site that sells replica watches in the first place (because we are all well aware, that pp will [censored] at you, if the word watch or rolex or whatsoever is even mentioned in the payment).

and as for the pp and ebay accounts and the egold trojona, theres a huge difference. pp accounts get hacked (most of the time) because ppl have weak passwords or fall for a phishing mail.

the egold trojan on the other hand could be attached to ANY file. even to a jpeg. if you open that jpeg, your virus software wont notice anything, you wont notice anything, because the trojan does it all in the background.

you WILL notice anything when you log into your e gold account and see that theres a ZERO balance!

[Guest TTK]

Sorry.....too much hassle for me......I'll stick with PP.....been with them since the beginning.......just take the necessary steps....and it's OK...good for me...good for my customers...and prospective customers....!

[speedy1]

Egold seems very impracticle for the buyer, as well as only offers protection for the seller (buyer protection is why most of us use PP instead of Western union)

Am I wrong?

[slay]

plus you end up paying DOUBLE fees. because sometimes WU is the only way to pay an egold exchanger... then you pay 10% WU fee and 5% exchager fee and so on...

[Admin]

I'd say that e-gold (at least for me) seems like a very impractical system to use, but I can totally understand the dealers who are looking for alternative payment systems.

@slay

Get your facts right There are extremely few e-gold tojans out there today and most (if not all) are detected with an up to date anti-virus program. These trojans used a vulnerability in OLE and COM that allowed code execution in the object linking and embedding module/COM module. This security flaw only affected users using Internet Explorer and was patched early last year. One of the reasons for this patch was in fact the technique used by the e-gold trojans. On any system today, that has been patched/updated in the last year, it is not possible to start an cloned backgroundIE session via OLE, like it was back then. So even if there excists customized versions, they all used the same vulnerability, that has been patched. Then again....there will always excist unpatched systems....

[Guest eddielee11]

Andrew I feel sorry for you as I have the same issue 3 times.

I have emailed most of the sellers regarding creating a “scammers list” but there are only few sellers who are willing to share and many just ignored my suggestion. By the way, precious time,,I will get you the list…I am still working on it now…

My pp has been frozen 3 times. I rarely use my pp for watch deals as I am not a big time sellers like most of the sellers on board. But in the past 3 years, my account have been screwed in, out , upside down , missionary, doggie…over 5000usd. I only use my pp for work and some buying & selling on ebay now.

pp is easy to use, easy to pay, easy to receive fund and easy to be scammed. I am very disappointed in few of the members who do not listen…some just wrote…rolex , panerai, Daytona, etc on pp payment title…listen folks….dont do that. You are only hurting your sellers and buyers. You, as a seller or a buyer, will be hit soon…it is just a matter of time. Sure…u yank the fund back to your account but you lost your pp usage after you do that. It is the game that you can not lose. You just have to listen to pp. pp in this case is the Perry Mason or Matlock, you know you will lose, no matter what you do. Imagine, you can not pay someone online 7.99$ for a car charger from hk, 19.99$ vw hubcap, or 11.99$ 2006 Sweden swimsuit edition calender…because you lost your pp due to either you yank money back to your credit company or you are on the wanted list of pp …

You can only do money order, or wire transferred…and this sucks big time.

Till this day, most still do not have the answer to alternative pp option. To accept credit cards online is suicidal too as my company also selling medical items online and accept visa payment, and the scamming percentage is even worse than pp.

remember buyers... you are not covered. never covered by pp. pp does not care about the DOA or wrong replica watches your received. Read the fine prints. pp only covers you if u r on their scamming scheme...ebay. Sure you received a DOA rep...and you demanded refund. Most sellers would not issue refund if u r been rude and demanding...Common courtesy or calm or a friendly email will do the wonder. I am sure most sellers will honor the swap or refund.

[cwai02]

Some people are f'in retarded. Do they really need to write a paragraph in the description box?

Maybe the dealers should only accept pp from trusted members.

Edited May 3, 2006 by cwai02

[slay]

Get your facts right wink.gif There are extremely few e-gold tojans out there today and most (if not all) are detected with an up to date anti-virus program. These trojans used a vulnerability in OLE and COM that allowed code execution in the object linking and embedding module/COM module. This security flaw only affected users using Internet Explorer and was patched early last year. One of the reasons for this patch was in fact the technique used by the e-gold trojans. On any system today, that has been patched/updated in the last year, it is not possible to start an cloned backgroundIE session via OLE, like it was back then. So even if there excists customized versions, they all used the same vulnerability, that has been patched. Then again....there will always excist unpatched systems....

No, the trojan i'm talking about can be used with any browser. How do i know that? because it was being sold on a forum which was cracked down by the secret service during operation rolling stone! the price was extremly high (5.000US$) and it was confirmed by independet review that it was fully functional. this trojan is undetectable for any anti virus program. sure this thing is not public (and probably good for us!)

[trustywatchguy]

Well..well..

seems like a battle in here while I was napping. *YAWN*

The thing that happened was when I woke up the other day, my pp account was frozen with USD1000+ for a day's transactions. I normally withdraw from pp every 24 hours. You know what? pp even REVERSED the Withdrawal to Bank account for the last time I withdrawn before the account got hit. That's how FXXK pp is. Apologies for the language.

I still take in pp though. I have 3 accounts in pp... =)

Why dealers choose E-GOLD? We have our reasons to do so. We need anonymous dealings as much as we can. We have been around for years. Eddie can vouch for that. He was around for almost the longest time.

Do you trust us? Or you think we will run away with the E-GOLD? Well... although there are incoveniences at the beginning but maybe we can work on it. =)

Andrew

[bully]

No, the trojan i'm talking about can be used with any browser. How do i know that? because it was being sold on a forum which was cracked down by the secret service during operation rolling stone! the price was extremly high (5.000US$) and it was confirmed by independet review that it was fully functional. this trojan is undetectable for any anti virus program. sure this thing is not public (and probably good for us!)

Are you talking about the shadowcrew?

If this did exist, I presume you would still have to download an attachment to your PC ?

IMO Egold is as safe if not safer than pp.

[slay]

its not the running away i fear, its just that e gold is fXXXing inconvenient. worse than WU or whatsoever!

if i'd like to order a watch from you, it would take me at least 2 weeks till i have the bullion in my e gold account. i would have to send scans of my drivers license, talk to them on the phone and so on. its just too much of a hussle for such a thing.

if i wanted to buy drugs or guns over the internet, i'd go through that trobule, but not for a 100$ watch!

[slay]

Are you talking about the shadowcrew?

If this did exist, I presume you would still have to download an attachment to your PC ?

IMO Egold is as safe if not safer than pp.

shadowcrew was busted loooong time ago... but i see you know what you're talkin about... and i knew you would know SC when you said you were using egold for a long time

no, i'm talking about a recent bust (a few weeks ago).

[bully]

its not the running away i fear, its just that e gold is fXXXing inconvenient. worse than WU or whatsoever!

if i'd like to order a watch from you, it would take me at least 2 weeks till i have the bullion in my e gold account. i would have to send scans of my drivers license, talk to them on the phone and so on. its just too much of a hussle for such a thing.

if i wanted to buy drugs or guns over the internet, i'd go through that trobule, but not for a 100$ watch!

I can see that this would appear inconvenient for some, but as I said before, for me it is less hassle than Western Union, I just pay cash in to a bank account and the egold is ready to go a few hours later.

Yes its a lot more hassle than pp though.

[Admin]

@slay

As far as I can remember, Operation Rolling Stone was targeted at criminals using forged ATM cards, Identity stealing, etc...Anyway, it really doesn't matter, I agree that e-gold seems inconvenient.

[cwai02]

Actually, I would rather do WU online instead of e-gold.

E-gold's fee structure is a rip-off imo. It's also very inconvenient to fund/withdraw the account.

[trustywatchguy]

Slay,

there are definitely other ways of getting E-Gold conveniently. I myself is reading alot about it for the past 2 days. You can say it's a USD100+ watch but we are talking about the illegality of it. If it's buying a Seiko watch, I wouldnt care a damn what you use to pay me... =)

Until now, I will still accept almost all modes of payment. But for the site, just to be safe... I will explore first before I lay my chopper down. =P

Andrew

[bully]

shadowcrew was busted loooong time ago... but i see you know what you're talkin about... and i knew you would know SC when you said you were using egold for a long time

no, i'm talking about a recent bust (a few weeks ago).

oh I see, must have missed this one,

Do you any online links about it, would be interested to read up on this.

[Cheese]

Just a note about how to deal with pp. If you afraid of charge backs, you need to open two separate pp accounts. Get paid in one and one the funds are there, immediately transfer them to the other account for withdrawal. See, pp will transfer money between their own accounts immediately, but they will make you wait a few days for the withdrawal. Most sellers get scammed by buyers who do charge backs in the first few days after the transaction, before the seller has a chance to withdraw the funds. By transferring the funds to another account, you insulate your seller’s account from that.

Another thing that pp does not like is transactions without descriptions. They like to know what is being sold. In that case, you can setup you second account to sell “subscriptions”. They seem to not be to concerned with exactly what that is.

[premiumdesigners]

Just a note about how to deal with pp. If you afraid of charge backs, you need to open two separate pp accounts. Get paid in one and one the funds are there, immediately transfer them to the other account for withdrawal. See, pp will transfer money between their own accounts immediately, but they will make you wait a few days for the withdrawal. Most sellers get scammed by buyers who do charge backs in the first few days after the transaction, before the seller has a chance to withdraw the funds. By transferring the funds to another account, you insulate your seller’s account from that.

Another thing that pp does not like is transactions without descriptions. They like to know what is being sold. In that case, you can setup you second account to sell “subscriptions”. They seem to not be to concerned with exactly what that is.

pp keeps track of IP address, they would know it was you that transfered from one account to the other.

[slay]

@slay

As far as I can remember, Operation Rolling Stone was targeted at criminals using forged ATM cards, Identity stealing, etc...Anyway, it really doesn't matter, I agree that e-gold seems inconvenient.

yes i indeed was... but as you might also know criminals come in packages! now what does identity stealing and cc dumps and all the other stuff have in common? right, ripping ppl off it might surprise you, but those boards provided everything to rip someone off. be it fake id's, passports, even registered @DMV id's, dumps, fake mo's, cheques, ss-cards and a lot more!

there are definitely other ways of getting E-Gold conveniently. I myself is reading alot about it for the past 2 days. You can say it's a USD100+ watch but we are talking about the illegality of it. If it's buying a Seiko watch, I wouldnt care a damn what you use to pay me... =)

replica watch might be illegal, but not as illegal as drugs and false passports. if i wanted to buy that, i would not complain, because then i would understand. but someone who puts a valid return address on his packages shouldnt be concerned about his privacy payment wise

Edited May 3, 2006 by slay

[cwai02]

Just a note about how to deal with pp. If you afraid of charge backs, you need to open two separate pp accounts. Get paid in one and one the funds are there, immediately transfer them to the other account for withdrawal. See, pp will transfer money between their own accounts immediately, but they will make you wait a few days for the withdrawal. Most sellers get scammed by buyers who do charge backs in the first few days after the transaction, before the seller has a chance to withdraw the funds. By transferring the funds to another account, you insulate your seller’s account from that.

Another thing that pp does not like is transactions without descriptions. They like to know what is being sold. In that case, you can setup you second account to sell “subscriptions”. They seem to not be to concerned with exactly what that is.

So the seller has to pay the pp fee twice?

Btw, my pp experience is quite positive.

I have received more than 250K through pp, but I am selling legit stuffs like laptops and electronics.

I have never lost anything due to charge-back.

[dachshund]

Eddie, Trusty, etc, etc have all had issues with PP from time to time and I hear the complaint that we stupid customers type anything and everything into the description box at PP and causes them problems.

I'm not trying to tell them how to run their business, but if I kept having this problem repeatedly I would stop accepting payment directly from a PP account, in the alternative I would issue an invoice so that the customer only has to submit payment and can not enter any information at all, customer just responds with a direct payment of said invoice.

I also think Eddie and Josh are on the right track with a blackball list of customers, it should be carried a step further, it should be made public where it protects all members and not just the dealers. Their real name as well as their screen name should be included in case the register again under a different screen name.

Example: Brian Panell=FlawlessTime, SweepinSwiss, Base and God knows what else.

[archibald]

Look, we may all have our own preferences and agendas vis a vis payment services, but at the end of the day the dealers are going to do what's best for their business, which is why Andrew started the thread. As consumers we have the power to vote w/ our feet. Don't like E-Gold? Buy the watch from someone who uses Moneybookers. Don't like Moneybookers? TTK's sticking w/ pp, and I send eddie MO's w/o a second thought.

If a dealer switches to E-Gold and his sales drop, the he's going to get nostalgic about the asshats over @ pp pretty quick. If E-Gold ends up working for the dealers we all better open up E-Gold accounts or stop collecting reps.

Time will decide...

[Richard Tracy]

I'm I wrong in my digestion of this issue...?

That main problem is not pp, but in having an open, unstructured forum where

knowledge and acceptance of certain realities of the rep game, are not being suffeciently

taught, or just plain ignored ?

As of now, all that requires access to our connections, is a free e-mail address,

and a quick posted question or link click.

Anyone with a gripe can take the attitude that we all will go down, as equal compensation

..............to a lost watch.

This is going to make safety concerns propell us towards membership only boards,

where joining will require not only fees but agreements not to hurt the collective, which

includes our dealers, craftsmen, watchmasters and last but not least our board.

If such place existed, no one would have to worry about losing out.. we could have

fund for such a thing,...as we have seen.

When I look down and see how many members have not become what is politely called VIP..

{a better term should be Member,} I feel that we are all seeking something for nothing...

an imbalance that can't roll much longer, too bottom heavy.