dieselpower Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Some of you may be aware that I recently received my DRSD from Joe in the US. I am aware that Joe has been banned from this forum and I thought it might be of interest to our members to hear of my experience so that they might make their own minds up as to weather they want to use his services or not. I shall try to relate the story as accurately as possible. Firstly lets have a look at the piece in question which is photographed here after Joe has performed various modifications. When I first set about having my watch modded I chose Joe as I had read good comments about his work and I contacted him via email and he responded swiftly. I told him that I only wanted to send the watch out once and therefore I wanted a bells and whistles job with as many genuine parts as he could supply. I myself had a Clark T39 superdome which I said I would send out with the watch for him to fit. He explained that he had his own glass supplier and that he found these to be of excellent quality and that he would fit on of them to my watch. I duly agreed and sold my T39 superdome to a friend. joe also mentioned that he had a set of Tudor hands which he could fit and re-lume to match the re-lume job he was going to do on my hour markers. All was music to my ears and I duly sent the watch (on 2nd March this year). I realised the Joe is a very busy man and his time is much better spent actually doing the fine work for which he is paid rather than answering emails so after having confirmed that he had actually received the watch I let things rest and waited. After a couple of months I was getting itchy feet and I dropped him an email which was responded to quickly and he assured me that he would be starting work on the watch soon. Time dragged on and after about 3 months I contacted him again. Again I received apologies and had no choice but to bide my time and wait. After a long bout of waiting I decided again to contact him (we are now about 5 months into the saga) this time, rather worryingly I received no response. I kept emailing, virtually daily, but got nothing. I was now worried, I posted my worries in the VIP section of this forum and was told in no uncertain terms that I had not done my research properly and that my tale was typical of dealings with Joe. Some of the replies were very helpful and I was advised to get in touch with him via RWI. This I duly did and within a couple of days received a response and apologies for not contacting me earlier but was told of IP problems at his end. I confess I was at the end of my tether and had to send a couple of quite stern messages - I asked for my watch to be returned to me immediately regardless of the state it may or may not be in. Joe reassured me all was well and that I would have my watch back as soon as it was finished. Thankfully towards the end of September he sent me some photos of the piece (the photos that you can see in this topic) and I went about the arduous task of sending USD to him from a USD account that I have. This process was confused by my bank and caused a further delay of about 2 weeks. I finally received the watch on the 8th October. I would like to point out that this is the first watch I have had modded and have no previous experience of the process, indeed, this is the main reason for starting this thread, I want it to be of use to others so that they are under no illusions as to what is involved. Now to the watch itself. Overall I am pleased with the work that has been done. The cg shaping is - to my eye - excellent and the finish of both these and the lug holes is beautiful. The watch I am told has been tested to 5 atm and I have bathed and showered in it and would feel very confident to go swimming and snorkelling with it. I also think that the slight yellowing of the markers has been performed with great skill and the hands have been finished to match. The crown and tube have apparently been replaced but I confess I do not know weather they are gen or aftermarket or what. You will notice that the hands are the ones that came with the watch - the Tudor hands never materialised. I have mentioned this and look forward to receiving a reply. My biggest disappointment is the glass. I had offered to send my superdome with the watch for it to be fitted but was assured that the glass he supplied was of high quality. I am not questioning the quality but as you may be able to see, the glass is the flat T39 and not a the superdome shape. I have now sold my Clark superdome so I will have to buy another and get it fitted! In conclusion: As you can see the process is time consuming and that is something anyone considering having their watch modded must take into account. I have now got a watch that I regard as 'work in progress' and I suppose that all reps are exactly that, they day that they are not is when you have a gen on your wrist! Would I go through it again? Abolutely! With the same modder? Not sure. I'll stop banging on now and leave you to draw your own conclusions and to burn me down in flames for any glaring mistakes that I may have made and lack of info that I may have supplied. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Diesel -- If you are happy with the watch, I do not want to criticize it. However, from the photos, it does not look like Joe fit a gen crown. And if that is the case, he probably did not fit a gen crown tube either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieselpower Posted October 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Feel free to criticise. I have a thick skin! I suspected the crown/tube would be gen and to be fair I don't think Joe ever said he would fit gens but I hope that the aftermarket ones used are the same threads as the gen so that if I buy them they will drop straight in. Like I said, work in progress and all advice is much appreciated. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Feel free to criticise. I have a thick skin! I suspected the crown/tube would be gen and to be fair I don't think Joe ever said he would fit gens but I hope that the aftermarket ones used are the same threads as the gen so that if I buy them they will drop straight in. Like I said, work in progress and all advice is much appreciated. Thanks Clark's T39 would have been a better choice than the crystal he used. The crown looks like the original MBW aftermarket part, which will NOT fit a gen crown tube. I would replace the rep riveted bracelet with either a rep hollow center-link Oyster or gen folded link. The bezel insert should be replaced with either a gen or one of these and replace the pearl with one of Ofrei's Illumines Dots. And if you want to go crazy, I would file/sand/buff the case and CGs to reduce the sharp edges a bit and do a working He valve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieselpower Posted October 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Photo of watch with crown unscrewed. Hope there is enough detail! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Photo of watch with crown unscrewed. Hope there is enough detail! It is obvious from the flat dots and width of the crown (too wide) that it is a rep part (probably the original crown that came with the MBW watch), which will only fit a rep crown tube. But the larger picture makes clear the other issues. I actually like the way Joe applied the lume (with more color in the center of the markers than around the edges). If only he had used a more realistic color....... Still, overall, the watch looks quite nice & I would have no problem wearing it (with a different bracelet (those riveted reps look really cheesy to me)). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 not a gen crown.. not even close. Its a replica tube and prob just the MBW one. Do you mind if i ask what he charged you for all these mods? And why did it take him half a year to do 3 days worth of work? I love the watch though.. its very nice.. The 1665 is my favorite watch, it just needs a few more minor mods. I would swap out that bezel insert for one with the proper vintage pearl. Thats an insert from a new style Submariner. The vintage pearl is completely different. The flat crystal isnt completely 'incorrect' but the superdome is SO much nicer and correct for a double red. I dont think the crystal is that bad at all really but I would do a gen crown and tube for sure. Its a great watch the way it is right now. I just hope he didnt charge you much because it doesnt look like he really did all that much work to it. You requested as many gen parts as he could install and the Gen crown would be the most obvious mod and he didnt even do it. This is what a gen crown and tube look like on my DRSD. Notice how thick the tube is. Its almost as thick as the crown itself. It almost looks as though the crown wont screw onto it, but it does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieselpower Posted October 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Total cost for the job was $645 (including postage) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Some of you may be aware that I recently received my DRSD from Joe in the US. I am aware that Joe has been banned from this forum and I thought it might be of interest to our members to hear of my experience so that they might make their own minds up as to weather they want to use his services or not.This rationale for posting this is inappropriate IMO. RBJ has been banned here for very good reasons, as you now know. This decision was not taken lightly but based on a large amount of evidence provided to Admin & Mods. In fact, your own experience isn't too dissimilar in some respects. You yourself missed the warnings about his MO, and yet you post this "so that others can make their minds up about him" . Well I'm sorry but as a community, we have a long time ago, so no need to exhume the corpse, so to speak. If you choose to use Joe, then do so privately or post this on RWI where I'm told he is a mod. But not here. It's not welcome or helpful in any sense. Even if he'd done a sterling job, it would be immaterial. I can see clearly, as others have pointed out, that he hasn't (even the CGs look asymmetric), and I'd be interested to see his exact breakdown of the work provided and exactly how much you paid! Maybe you could provide that info. But regardless, best advice I can give you is to put it down to experience and let sleeping dogs lie. You actually got off lightly so consider yourself lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Total cost for the job was $645 (including postage)Just seen... Please tell me you're joking? If not, you must post a breakdown of 'work' done now, but I warn you, you will not like what you're about to hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piratedzeus Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Wow,what an [censored]. Why not send him a few guys to crush his home once and for all... such an idiot. But in the end, you could have known that he would scam you - he is Joe after all... I will do the same stuff for 10$ - okay? And it includes all his famous great source aftermarket crap. 10$? OKAY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I'll also take advantage of that $10 offer Oli Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Seriously though.....SIX HUNDRED AND FORTY-FIVE DOLLARS?!!!!!!!!! Let me take a wild stab in the dark here.... Gen Tudor hands $0 - didn't actually provide/install them. CG reshaping $50 Crappy lume job $50 Rep tube/rep crown $0 - again no gen parts installed Flat crystal $30 incl. install Crappy aftermarket insert $15 So, that leaves let me see now.... Blowing dust off dial $400? Postage $50 Admin charges $50 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I hope $645 includes the cost of the MBW watch itself????????? WOW thats shocking... if its $645 including the $400 MBW then thats not so bad. For a couple hundred bux you can complete this correctly with some good gen parts (crown, tube, clarks superdome, insert etc). I'll have a look and see if i still have my extra clarks T39 and if so you can have it for free. I'll dig through some parts and PM you and let you know if i can be of any help. I dont see more than a couple hundred $ worth of mods here at most... I personally dont know much about why Joe was banned except that he was ripping people off and taking way to long to complete work. I know members complain about him over on RWI about the same things over and over... I think this is a good reminder for some of the newer members such as myself as to why we should avoid this guy. I understand what Dr.B is saying about letting sleeping dogs lie.. but maybe we need a reminder once in a while. could you post all the details of work done and breakdown of cost? And also what he told you was done and we can tell you if it was done or not. But as docblackrock said... you might not like what you;re gunna hear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I think I will pass on the $10 offer & keep my home-brewed DRSD as is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 wow thats a nice one Freddy. I think ive got about $750 into my MBW DRSD project and that INCLUDES the cost of the watch itself, all the mods, gen crown and tube, gen T39 superdome, the The Zigmeister vintage lumed dial from another member here and the The Zigmeister tear down and rebuild of the movement etc etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I take back what I said about sleeping dogs, this is outrageous. Oli, my guesstimate of Joe's is what I anticipate the breakdown to be...apart from the obvious missing $400-500 of course!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Doc is right that this post should not be here. There is no judgement issue. You were soundly scammed as others before. That is why he is banned. There are modders who know their limitations (both in terms of timing and skill). This is not the case here. You waited six months to get something which still needs corrective work. Telling you to sell the T-39 seems ridiculous. I do hope $645 includes the watch. Ziggy did mine for a fraction of that. You do have to wait with him but when you are scheduled you are promptly taken care of. RepAustria does excellent work as well when he is available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 @ Diesel. This is an absolute disgrace what taken place, but I am shocked at your response and lack of emotion. You seem to accept the fact that this is totally acceptable. Let me tell you that this is not acceptable, and I can't believe your fine with the whole situation. Relume, aftermarket crystal and CG shaping, for $645 and 6 months of waiting, if I was you, I would be [censored] off as hell...totally unaceptable, and I have to say, an absolute rip off. I am sure that since you sent the watch off in March until to today, you have read and seen enough on these forums to know your were bent over and Joe didn't even use vaseline. There is a good reason Joe was banned from this forum, your detailed analysis and rundown of events, simply goes to confirm it once again... Why in the world would you accept that 6 months and $645 is a reasonable price to pay for your results. Unbelievable. I am shocked at your apparent approval of this whole episode. None of this is normal, or acceptable, anyone who has sent stuff to Joe, given all the insight and truth that has come out on this forum in the past year, gets what they deserve. I just hope new members can see how unaceptable this is, but if they can't, all the more power to Joe, he's laughing all the way to the bank...and then some... RG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Oli does fantastic work, As you can see here: What RBJ did is outrageous! Poor quality rushed work and at what cost!? Man why are we back here? It is like Deja vu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I have to say that I think some of you are being much too hard on Diesel. I do not know what Diesel knew (or did not know) about Joe's history before enlisting his aid, but I have to say that it is virtually impossible for people to separate all of the wheat from all of the chaff when it comes to deciding who to entrust one's watch (and money) to (when the owner does not have the tools & skills necessary to perform the work themselves). Instead of blasting the poor sod for picking the wrong 'expert', why not provide him with positive & constructive recommendations on where to go from here? That makes alot more sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 This is an absolute disgrace what taken place, but I am shocked at your response and lack of emotion. You seem to accept the fact that this is totally acceptable. Let me tell you that this is not acceptable, and I can't believe your fine with the whole situation. Relume, aftermarket crystal and CG shaping, for $645 and 6 months of waiting, if I was you, I would be [censored] off as hell...totally unaceptable, and I have to say, an absolute rip off. Got caught up in my own indignation and couldn't put my finger on it, but The Zigmeister's absolutely right. What's the deal here Dieselpower? Are you really so apathetic that you've been screwed over? I'd go as far as to say it's not a rip-off but fraud. fraud |fr??d| noun wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain : • a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming to have provided services or being credited with accomplishments or qualities : mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 Can you imagine what a REAL modder like The Zigmeister or Oli could have done for that much money??? Now im getting [censored] off too because i know what its like to be ripped off, and i never want to see it happen to anyone else. I wonder if theres anyway to get some sort of a refund out of this idiot joe. How did you pay him? Paypal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docblackrock Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 *cough* chargeback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dizzy Posted October 16, 2007 Report Share Posted October 16, 2007 I totally agree! @Diesel - like i said in a previous post a few min ago, i will see if i can find that crystal for you.. and if you have any questions or need any info please ask or PM one of us and im sure we'll do whatever we can to guide you in the right direction. I can give you some tips on getting the casework a bit better and i think if you bleached the insert for a minute or so and popped out that pearl it would look a lot better and a bit more rugged There is quite a bit you can probably do yourself to improve this a lot Hopefully we arnt jumping the gun here.. after all we dont even have confirmation as to wether the cost of the watch itself is included in that price or not.... Lonnie I have to say that I think some of you are being much too hard on Diesel. I do not know what Diesel knew (or did not know) about Joe's history before enlisting his aid, but I have to say that it is virtually impossible for people to separate all of the wheat from all of the chaff when it comes to deciding who to entrust one's watch (and money) to (when the owner does not have the tools & skills necessary to perform the work themselves). Instead of blasting the poor sod for picking the wrong 'expert', why not provide him with positive & constructive recommendations on where to go from here? That makes alot more sense to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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