A rare peek into factory of counterfeit watches

[luisik]

... So the question becomes, why are journalists so insistent in advancing this "terrorism" angle, in almost all the serious articles I've read on the matter, in journals of record (like the NYT, WaPo)?

Because this is the best marketing they can do trying to make up people's minds in a way they are not buying reps.

70% of all manufactured reps (of any market: clothes, toys, watches, mechanical and electronic devices, motor spares... etc) are sold in the USA and, since September 11, there is no better way to make an american to repudiate something than crowning it with a "terrorism" adjective.

[Victoria]

Because this is the best marketing they can do trying to make up people's minds in a way they are not buying reps.

70% of all manufactured reps (of any market: clothes, toys, watches, mechanical and electronic devices, motor spares... etc) are sold in the USA and, since September 11, there is no better way to make an american to repudiate something than crowning it with a "terrorism" adjective.

No, Luisik. As I said, long before I bought any reps, I've been hearing of the terrorism angle. That's pre-2001.

My mother told me she heard something similar in the late '80s, and that was in South America when we lived there, when counterfeiting was then at an all-time high.

This terrorism angle isn't necessarily American-centric, 9/11-centric, US-government centric, though the world's perspectives will never be the same afterwards.

I think journalists in the newspapers I quoted you, including the ones at the IHT, would be shocked to hear that they were carrying this administration's water, in this or in any other matter. On the contrary, they would set out to repudiate these claims, whenever possible.

So why don't they?

Another inherent question in your "marketing" angle, is that this presupposes all journalists are against counterfeiting, as a moral stance and their editors only want them to publish articles which are negative in scope.

I doubt that. Even for the advertising revenue.

[hambone]

This was posted earlier actually..

http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showto...mp;#entry371825

Poor woman with very bad Hublot reps. The Timezone crowd took much glee in this news item. Vicious

bastards.

[chris5264]

I have no idea why it would bring anyone "happiness" to see this.....(in reference to post on other forum). This would be the equal to arresting some small time local drug dealer and thinking you made progress on the "war against drugs". Of course,,,I still can't figure out why some people get some emotional over replicas to the point they are actually happy when they see something like this,,,,strange.

[freddy333]

I have no idea why it would bring anyone "happiness" to see this.....(in reference to post on other forum). This would be the equal to arresting some small time local drug dealer and thinking you made progress on the "war against drugs". Of course,,,I still can't figure out why some people get some emotional over replicas to the point they are actually happy when they see something like this,,,,strange.

I think it is just part of the team or pack mentality. Everyone wants to show how they are part of the gen team by proving how much more sanguine they can appear to be when something bad happens to reps or the people that deal in them.

And the first time I heard anything in the media about a terrorism connection with reps was a year or so after 9/11. However, for the previous 20 or so years (since I have been buying them), I have seen plenty of newspaper articles & tv news features about organized crime's involvement.

[Corgi]

I personally doubt any significant punishment will be inflicted upon the hello kitty lady... lots of pictures, lots of cops for the media blitz to satisfy hublot and then a quick deal and shes back making watches in (most likely) the same disorganized apartment block...

[chris5264]

I think it is just part of the team or pack mentality. Everyone wants to show how they are part of the gen team by proving how much more sanguine they can be than the next guy when something bad happens to reps or the people that deal in them.

could be it,,,,the same type of thing I can imagine happening at the Heritage club......maybe they just are not current with 80's movies...

"Fifty bucks? No, no, no. This is a Rouchefoucauld. The thinnest water-resistant watch in the world. Singularly unique, sculptured in design, hand-crafted in Switzerland, and water resistant to three atmospheres. This is *the* sports watch of the '80s. Six thousand, nine hundred and fifty five dollars retail! "

[Victoria]

I personally doubt any significant punishment will be inflicted upon the hello kitty lady... lots of pictures, lots of cops for the media blitz to satisfy hublot and then a quick deal and shes back making watches in (most likely) the same disorganized apartment block...

A part of me, hopes so too...

China has a shaming culture, like most Asian cultures, right? Check this out:

This is what happened to sex workers (good to see men are turning tricks in China too...), who were caught, and paraded in the same streets of Shenzen last year.

Article which states there has been a two-month long crack down on "vice" in the booming town of Shenzen, around this time last year: http://shanghaiist.com/2006/12/08/shenzhens_prost.php

Perhaps that's what the Hello Kitty lady turned to, after.

@Chris5264: I guess the people at gen forums have compassion issues, or never rooted for Robin Hood when Errol Flynn was on screen.

But also, though the Hello Kitty lady is tokenism at its worst, and won't affect rep watches proliferating, the Chinese are damned if they do, or if they don't. Do they try to make an effort? Or just turn a blind eye AGAIN and AGAIN?

If we in the West didn't make some people into examples, crime, corruption, and abuses would be like in developing countries. I'd rather some cop pull me over for doing something wrong, even though I'm a careful driver, than not. And I like that if I offered him a bribe, chances are pretty good down here, he'd throw the cuffs on me immediately.

EDIT: One more link, before I shut RWG down for the night:

hxxp://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5693207

Chinese Crackdown Fails to Stem Counterfeit Goods (August 23, 2006)

""I personally call counterfeiting, piracy, the cancer of the century," says Jack Chang, a lawyer who heads the intellectual property committee of the American Chamber of Commerce in Shanghai. "We need to cut it as soon as possible." [...]"

"When you buy counterfeit goods, you'll actually be viewed as a supporter of child labor and violent crimes. Do you still buy it?" Chang says."

[KB]

A token hit on a very small operation, nothing more.

If this makes Hublot happy then they don't aim very high.

Ken

[The Mentalist]

A token hit on a very small operation, nothing more.

If this makes Hublot happy then they don't aim very high.

Ken

Agreed.

Counterfeiting is so ingrained in the Chinese commercial psyche that the authorities will turn a blind eye unless leaned on by outside parties and even then, they only pay lip service. The concept of intellectual property is virtually meanlingless to the average Chinese. This raid was merely a 'be seen to be doing something' publicity stunt. Our rep factories are safe and I doubt Miss Hello Kitty would get much more than a fine and slap on the wrist (and possibly advice on not getting caught next time)

[coolfire]

Um, I can't think of this girl being able to set hands any well, to set crystals well etc... There actually are a lot of replicas I have seen that are of superior build quality. With nothing falling out and a certain precision from assembly.

I concur...

[Corgi]

""I personally call counterfeiting, piracy, the cancer of the century," says Jack Chang, a lawyer who heads the intellectual property committee of the American Chamber of Commerce in Shanghai. "We need to cut it as soon as possible." [...]"

While counterfeiting is bad for the majority of legitimate manufacturies, I think this gentleman's quote is a little extreme. Millions of starvation-related deaths in third world countries and no humanitarian relief in view of the future? Perhaps a better choice... or terrorism and september 11 attacks... fake LV bags and watches? Hmmm..............

[Victoria]

While counterfeiting is bad for the majority of legitimate manufacturies, I think this gentleman's quote is a little extreme.

Honestly, Corgi, even if I were a Rolex or Louis Vuitton exec, I'd think it was extreme.

I read it, and I thought, WEB DuBois said the main problem of the Twentieth Century was the colour line (the question of race, IOW). Some thought THAT was hyperbole, but at least it certainly was UP THERE.

Intellectual property theft being the main cancer of the Twenty-First Century? If only we were so lucky...

Millions of starvation-related deaths in third world countries and no humanitarian relief in view of the future? Perhaps a better choice... or terrorism and september 11 attacks... fake LV bags and watches? Hmmm..............

It's lawyer-talk. No one takes it seriously.

[Rxus]

The pictures are great..Still unfortunate for those involved. But as already mentioned this is merely a representation of the really cheap stuff you get in any large city by visiting a dark alley in the downtown area.

Wake up people Our reps are made in dust free well lit air conditioned white rooms, by men and women in full nylon suit and gloves as to prevent any direct contact with your watch and it's many parts.

Have a nice day! :ohmy:

[archibald]

Organized crime, probably (they are into just about everything). But terrorists? All I can say is that if the government has convinced you that Marijuana is physically addictive, there were WMDs in Iraq in 2003 & God made little green apples, then you can help save the free world from terrorism by not buying reps.

But keep filling up those SUV's folks!!

A Corgi: Ever had a mechanic form a major dealership f up a repair? Ever had an awful meal cooked by a well respected chef? Ever bought a gen luxury item that was seriously flawed? Me too. If high end reps are in fact built by professionals, I bet their error rate is definitely higher because of the differences in training, conditions, etc. But we pay $400 for their work, not $8000. I bet the major difference is in final QC and not the skill of the workmanship. My prediction is that the swiss reject several times more pieces at every stage of the process than the Chinese do, but that all of the things you mentioned, even the pubic hair, have been discovered by Swiss QC insopectors at every swiss factory ever built.

[The Mentalist]

How the hell does pubic hair get into a watch? Are they polishing the crystals on their crotches or something? Is there some arcane watchmaker's technique that nobody speaks about?

Thinking about it, I am really shuddering to think about the type of 'sticky balls' they are using to tighten those casebacks.

Edited December 17, 2007 by The Mentalist

[Corgi]

A Corgi: Ever had a mechanic form a major dealership f up a repair? Ever had an awful meal cooked by a well respected chef? Ever bought a gen luxury item that was seriously flawed? Me too. If high end reps are in fact built by professionals, I bet their error rate is definitely higher because of the differences in training, conditions, etc. But we pay $400 for their work, not $8000. I bet the major difference is in final QC and not the skill of the workmanship. My prediction is that the swiss reject several times more pieces at every stage of the process than the Chinese do, but that all of the things you mentioned, even the pubic hair, have been discovered by Swiss QC insopectors at every swiss factory ever built.

Yes I have.

But not 85% of the products/services I purchase have a glaring and obvious quality control-related fault.

More than 85% of my rep watches do.

[magagne]

The same professionals who forgot to remove three giant pieces of dust from the inside of my pam? The ones who sent my a broken Rolex yacht master with gold that was peeling and non-working movement? Wait... you mean the folks whose every single submariner loses its bezel ring? Or is the ones who leave pubes inside their watches? Or those who somehow manage to send us destroyed watches on an almost weekly basis?

'cuz I doubt the fancy "factories" look any more professional and sterile than this despite the word "factory" eliciting feelings of many workers sitting behind tidy desks in white robes in giant white rooms ensuring precision in construction.

The big rep-making factories are probably just taller/larger apartment buildings with more (in both meanings of the word here) disgruntled employees...

Ho, man, you killed me on this one Corgi ... ... I can't say more than what is already said here...