ZainoDetail Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 All of this AR interest lately...and it's never even been something that was on my Radar until I started to read all of these threads. However now that I've been to an AD and seen some in person I can clearly see how it adds benefit to the watch to where you can really see details as opposed to reflections. However if I'm correct most of the Panerai models have single AR only...so is it more of a tell to have Double AR or no AR at all? The "synthetic" saphire that came on my 005 has a light coating of something that resembles AR...but sure doesn't do it's job and my 212 has none. I'm thinking of having both watches done but I"m wondering if it'll make them stand out in a bad way from having too good of an AR coating. Z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alt.watch.obsessive Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 Current consensus seems to be that no AR is closest to gen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 All of this AR interest lately...and it's never even been something that was on my Radar until I started to read all of these threads. However now that I've been to an AD and seen some in person I can clearly see how it adds benefit to the watch to where you can really see details as opposed to reflections. However if I'm correct most of the Panerai models have single AR only...so is it more of a tell to have Double AR or no AR at all? The "synthetic" saphire that came on my 005 has a light coating of something that resembles AR...but sure doesn't do it's job and my 212 has none. I'm thinking of having both watches done but I"m wondering if it'll make them stand out in a bad way from having too good of an AR coating. Z First of all, single AR is very subtle. For the most part, you don't even know it's there because you still have all the usual reflections off the exterior crystal surface. I coated my 196 with single sided AR. It does reduce reflections off the dial and make the dial look a *little* crisper. And you do see some blue/purple highlights under some lighting - but not too often. So, if I were the judge, I'd say that no AR is closer to genuine for PAMs than double AR. On the otherhand if I owned a gen PAM I'd strongly consider recoating its crystal with double AR, unless of course it was a rare vintage model or something. But, reps aren't the only watches modded... If you ever browse Paneristi you'll see people who do all sorts of things to their genuine PAMs. I saw a gen 177H that was bead blasted and it looked really nice. So, putting double AR on a PAM is relatively benign IMO. On the otherhand, on other forums, you'll see people discussing how to remove the outer AR coating from their gen watches because they don't like it. So, really, I'd say it's up to you. I happen to like double AR a lot, even on a PAM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dluddy Posted January 3, 2008 Report Share Posted January 3, 2008 I believe the general rule of thumb is that anything "D" series onward has single AR. I did my 188 and 172 with Chief's single AR and the results are fantastic. Someday I will get rid of that purple AR on my 036 and do the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swdivad Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I love the effect of double AR as was on my Sinn U1, but the crystal picked up fingerprints faster than free glasses of beer at a pub, so I prefer the single sided AR.... it just stays cleaner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce79 Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Getting the DAR done on my 112h in this run and can't wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subzero1 Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Double AR all the way. Gens have single AR, but like Rolex, they "ought to" have double AR, IMO. It just make a huge difference in sharpness and crispness and clarity of the dial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cskent69 Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I am dreaming of there being enough interest for another Single AR run for PAM's. I have two crystals that I would like to have done in Single AR but there never seems to be enough interest in the board to reach 20 crystals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce79 Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I am dreaming of there being enough interest for another Single AR run for PAM's. I have two crystals that I would like to have done in Single AR but there never seems to be enough interest in the board to reach 20 crystals. You could get the double and then remove the outer layer...see if you like the double first though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 You could get the double and then remove the outer layer...see if you like the double first though... Yep.... We can always do it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mezzanine Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 My vote is for double-AR. As has been mentioned, this is a mod that I would want done to my watch anyways- at some point it's more about your own personal preference. Gen owners get that- and considering that double-AR is an 'objective' improvement by many standards, I feel that as time goes on, the level of acceptance of AR on watches that might not have them originally is going to become greater. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
babola Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Just a note...Panerai started progresivelly using single (underside) AR from 2000 in their C-series, as reported by number of 'Risti on the gen site. Also, Panerai never ever used double-sided AR on their xtals. cheers, babola Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Yes, the Officine use single side AR on all models up from C/D series onward (plexi exluded ). They do so because on the external side of the crystal they want to preserve the original sapphire scratch-resistance, that is even higher than the excellent resistance of high-temperature (double-side, to keep it short) AR coating. And they do so essentially because the PAMs have to keep their fame of hard watches, watches that you may undergo heavy work without they getting damage from it. Naturally this is not the most common case nowadays, still OP want to honour their historical inheritance. Im my opinion, anyone who think he's not going to subject his PAM to heavy work and exposure to scratches would make well in having it double AR coated. He is going to gain on good look and easiness of reading much more than what he is going to loose on scratch resistance. Inaccuracy is not an issue here, because -- as chieftang already pointed out -- also genuines get relumes, AR coatings, all sort of changes/improvements. It's bad dial, bad lume, inaccurate CG, loose lever, etc,, that make rep tells, not relume or double AR coat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moxxey Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 However if I'm correct most of the Panerai models have single AR only...so is it more of a tell to have Double AR or no AR at all? Yes, it's a definitely giveaway. I have a fully modded PAM 127 'fiddy' and the only giveaway is the darned double AR coating. It even has a proper PAM 127 cashmere strap! Was over in London recently and a Panerai enthusiast was startled that I had a genuine fiddy and was convinced....until he noticed the AR overkill and that set off the alarm bells and he realised it was a fake It confuses me. It's almost as if the replica manufacturers think to themselves that they added a proper cannon pin, the best correct lume and lettering....but it's now so good, we need to make it different from the gen, so they add a bizarre amount of additional AR. There is no need. It's not as if we all live in Dubai and it's so sunny that reflections stop us from reading the time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAMman Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I have 2 gens, a 'G' series 'long arrow' 005 and a 'F' series 116. On the tobacco dial Ti 116 the single internal AR is just noticable as a faint blue/purple hue but the 005 appears not to have any visible trace at all. I don't have any interest in the later sandwich dial watches, preferring the older Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZainoDetail Posted January 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Gents, I appreciate all of the comments and feedback. Much good discussion in this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugwash Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 No contest, Double AR looks good. It makes it less likely to be called out as a rep, even if it makes it less accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yaron Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Hi Pug, I don't like Panerai in general, but your watch and picture are stunning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Was over in London recently and a Panerai enthusiast was startled that I had a genuine fiddy and was convinced....until he noticed the AR overkill and that set off the alarm bells and he realised it was a fake Too shy to tell him that you had it double AR coated as you preferred it that way rather than the way OP are selling it? It confuses me. It's almost as if the replica manufacturers... so they add a bizarre amount of additional AR. ?!?!?!? Replica manufacturers don't add any additional AR! Actually, we can take us fortunate when they just add a barely decent single-side AR (I am speaking about true AR, not the "light" AR coating, which is just a blueish tint, a fake AR). So far, the only way to get double AR on PAM is by making it ourselves, thanks to chieftang and k2222...* That makes me wonder... did you have your Fiddy double AR coated? Or may be that that guy called you out because of the BAD/FAKE AR coat, not double AR? There is no need. It's not as if we all live in Dubai and it's so sunny that reflections stop us from reading the time! Speak about you. *EDIT: I just saw the new PAMs by Trusty. Yes, he claims them double AR coated. This is a very recent development, nothing like them until very recent times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subzero1 Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I live in Denver, over 300 days per year of sunshine. Soon I'll have double AR shots to show on my PAM 111H, 082, 113, 183, 029, and FER011. I'll be sure to post them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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