watchmark Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Dear All Honorific RWG Member and All Friend My name is Mark. i am Apprentice collectors on RWG. because recently some Member friend ask me about my site HBB movement and price. in my personal viewpoint. i have to write some clarify from my personal suggestion. first. sorry for my very poor english.i am local china seller. second. if my viewpoint is mistake. please forgive me and help me make correction. i am very happy some high knowledgeble Member friend help me improve my very poor watch knowledge. i thank you very much.... this is my first time write so long in RWG... on china HBB market. 1. there have 2 different 7750 movement for HBB in china market. one is 28.8BPH with normal quality movement which i selling 400++USD before on my web site. i guess this kind of movement quality grade maybe like this http://www.timeshops.net/Mont_Blanc_Sport_...0_1116-1296.htm 2. the second kind of HBB 7750 movement which is better than first HBB movement. but it 's also 28.8BPH. this kind of movement watch price i guess some seller selling around 1000USD. the different is that kind of movement where have some lines engraved on the movement ( please advice ). like this: http://www.timeshops.net/Hublot_Big_Bang_B...0__999-3262.htm http://www.timeshops.net/Hublot_Ceramic_Be..._7750__1202.htm why this kind of movement HBB ( 1000USD ) very expensive? a. this kind of movement made by some higher Grade mechanic. i think that mechanic who is someone know how to made swiss quality movement. b. this kind of movement watch rubber strap very fragrance... c. Factory ask very high price. d. this kind of movement more reliable and time exact than the first HBB movement. e. this kind of movement watch casing quality better than first HBB casing. until now i still not sure how to call the first HBB... if i call 28.8GPH is NEW ASIA 7750 for second HBB (775USD). so what name i call for first HBB which also use 7750 28.8GPH movement but price much lower ??? please help....... if you have some different advice. i am very very happy to learn from your. thankyou very much and appreciate! Apprentice collectors Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Thanks very much for the clarification. It is always very helpful to know exactly what you are buying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchmark Posted April 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 I just check with factory today. i think i made a mistake. THE lower grade of HBB use Asian 7750, 21,000bph (low beat) movement. that is why cheaper. sorry about that regards mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Because people pay. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jfreeman420 Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Hello Mark and thank you for your post. Please make clear the size of your HBB. Your site says 42.4 mm but every other dealer has it as 44.4mm Is there a large and a small version of the HBB or is your description a mistake? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
assasi9 Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 someone help this guy list everything right on his site so we can all enjoy the significant discounts he seems to be listing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchmark Posted April 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Hello Mark and thank you for your post. Please make clear the size of your HBB. Your site says 42.4 mm but every other dealer has it as 44.4mm Is there a large and a small version of the HBB or is your description a mistake? dear friend thank you. i will go to measure it again personally tomorrow. i will upload picture here. regards mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Good to see he is trying to correct his site and change his logo etc..... I would really like to see the low beat and high beat HBB's compared. I wonder if there is a big difference aside from the movement? Watchmark you could simply have two Hublot sections. Split the HBB high beat in one section and HBB low beat in another...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchmark Posted April 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Good to see he is trying to correct his site and change his logo etc..... I would really like to see the low beat and high beat HBB's compared. I wonder if there is a big difference aside from the movement? Watchmark you could simply have two Hublot sections. Split the HBB high beat in one section and HBB low beat in another...... thank you. yes. you are right. that is what i am thinking now.... and because our factory have some new hublot coming soon. we are planning now. i will upload to my site after photo ready after few days. thanks anyway regards mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Sounds interesting, new Hublots! I look forward to seeing them soon. Thanks watchmark! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vric Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 (edited) Selling Asian 7750 28.8k for the price of an ETA.. sound logical How about the "lite" version which have the 28.8k and sell for less than $280 a bit everywhere ? Edited April 9, 2008 by vric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cronsell Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 If these do indeed have the low beat 7750, wouldn't they make a great starting point for an ETA swap? The pinion sizes are the same, correct? Just a thought... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Selling Asian 7750 28.8k for the price of an ETA.. sound logical How about the "lite" version which have the 28.8k and sell for less than $280 a bit everywhere ? Still cheaper than our other dealers though.... On other known sites they are over $1100, but people are still buying at that crazy price, why would dealers lower the price if they are selling? Go figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capice Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Thanks for clarifying the 2 different movements Mark. $ 400 for a lowbeat 7750....ouch I am wearing a beautiful Tag Aquaracer with a 7750 28.8Kmovement I bought from you for only $260 Prices are getting skyhigh, Ken said it well, because people pay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pix Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Thanks for trying to explain us where the differences come from. My understanding from an other thread is that there are indeed 2 manufacturers, with 2 different cases, 2 different crown types and 2 different straps (I own both straps, one is normal and the other is indeed fraganced). The other difference surely comes from the movement : one is low beat, the other high beat. And the rotor (one is engraved, the other has stickers) I have bought the lite version from Watchmark when it first appeared. That was the same manufacturer as the "original" rep. You can't notice the difference with the high beat movement, as the small seconds@9 is sweeping smoothly. Even the stopwatch function is smooth, of course not as smooth as the high beat. Which I particularly like in this movement is the (dummy ?) regulator which makes it look more like the real thing. I have absolutely had no issues (bought it last september). Works accurately (I don't think it's worse in time keeping than the high beat one). I (almost) never set up the time (it's in a watchwinder). I am pretty convinced (it's a personnal feeling) that these movements are not the same as the first problematic 7750 which we had 2 years ago. Regarding the lite version, there's one thing still I don't understand : the first versions had a 21.6 k movement and a thick datefont (the one I proudly own) and the following had a 28.8 k movement, with no price difference. An other aspect which could explain the price difference is that there are models with real ceramic bezels, and other with steel bezels which are PVD coated. It's impossible to check with the pictures. The dealer can do it by unscrewing the bezel and look at the color of the thing. Last factor : Watchmark is making less margin And as Ken said, some pay for the high prices, and some dealers "forgot" to decrease their prices... @Vric : as mentionned I bought one of the first lite versions, and it seems that you can't find this anymore except from Silix. I have no information, but feel he has the last pieces. Then it might be that there won't be HBB under 400 dollars anymore soon. I'm going to beat a dead horse but the question is : is the 21.6 k movement really to be considered as unreliable ? Owning 2, I confirm having absolutely no issues. I even tend to think that it might prolong the movement's life as well as the power reserve ? If the case is 44 in both models (which I believe), we may create franken watches. I don't think they are different, as the second manufacturer has probably cloned the first, avoiding buying the real thing to replicate. In any case, I think that our apprentice's step is remarkable and help understand many things : it is not always clear for dealers what the manufacturers strategy is, and we can't always hold them for responsible of certain issues (fake ETA movements, silent changes against what is advertized). The dealer is good for me if he does QC, does not dropship and solves your problems when they occur. I'd love to make a side by side comparison between both models. @Watchmark : BTW, your website is improving day by day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vric Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 (edited) Then it might be that there won't be HBB under 400 dollars anymore soon. Glad I got my BlackMagic for $350 ems shipped/pped with custom strap then : ) I don't want to be an ass, I just say it's completly unjustified that they are asking so much for the """""better"""""" version when you can have one as good with the light version, whith have a $50 AR job missing and in some case a VERY overpriced ceramic bezel. That is still $600 vs $1000 for the same thing. Edited April 9, 2008 by vric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Glad I got my BlackMagic for $350 ems shipped/pped with custom strap then : ) I don't want to be an ass, I just say it's completly unjustified that they are asking so much for the """""better"""""" version when you can have one as good with the light version, whith have a $50 AR job missing and in some case a VERY overpriced ceramic bezel. That is still $600 vs $1000 for the same thing. The point is that there are two factories, the factories control the prices, not the dealers. Dealers have some say on the price, by what mark ups they charge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pix Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Agreed with you Vric, that's why I bought the HBB only when the lite version came out. I was not ready to pay 600 dollars+/- when the ceramic bezel version first came out (that was the price ?) Then I went for some mods : 260 shipped + 75 AR coating + 60 PVD coated bezel = 395 for a close to the ceramic version. Add an other 60-70 dollars for the rotor engraving, and there we have an honest version Dealer have some room in their margin, but indeed if the manufacturer sets a high price, you won't have the rep for 50% of its price, except if it's some dead stock or has some flaws (note that the latest point is not valid with all dealers...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sssurfer Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 In any case, I think that our apprentice's step is remarkable I absolutely agree. How refreshing to see a... collector... willing to echange knowledge with us purchasers/fanatics. Each of us knows things that the other may lack, a mutual exchange is very likely to result to mutual benefit as well. So, thanks to Mark for his clarification, good will, site improvement... and especially for his avatar (please forgive me, I go crazy on Asian chicks). Mark, I humbly suggest you classify your HBBs as 1st version (slow beat, "low" cost) and 2nd version (high beat, high cost). Any insights on the pros & cons of each version from expert members like Pix is highly welcomed. I learnt a lot from these two threads. Really thanks to anyone involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ztech Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Wow, IMHO this is great. An exchange of info/input between the collector and the us, the public. Isn't this what many of us have been asking for? This could be a start of something great. I appluad Mark and his effort to bridge the "gap". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pix Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Great indeed. The experience shows however that often those who dare to face the users will get blames for the absents' faults. I really hope that won't happen with Mark, as he's really a great guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ztech Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Yes, let's hope that it'll be a joining of effort rather than a pointing of fingers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvn Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 i think he should say asia 7750 high beat (288k) and lowbeat (21.6k) and version 1 for HBB from first manufacture (with pull out crown) and verion2 for HBB from 2 manufacture (with screw-down crown). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pix Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 That is simple and efficient. I fully agree with you DVN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 New models being uploaded as we speak http://www.timeshops.net/Big_Bang_St_Morit...)_1135-1061.htm Only $285 with AR, low beat 7750 and engraved rotor..... Probably more to come... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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