Loose Diamonds

[bruce79]

I'm in the process of obtaining a semi mount or an engagement ring but need to get a center stone. The diamonds & prices at the jeweler I'm working with seem to be over priced plus I don't like their selection. Does anyone have any suggestions for where to look for loose stones. A trusted dealer??? I'm in SoCal. Thanks

[Linder]

As an alternative, moissanite is wonderful. Wifey loves hers and sleeps well knowing her stone doesn't have the association of the blood diamonds.

[robertrinaustin]

Shot me a pm if you want me to price some stuff for you. I am in the business and can give you an idea of prices.

[cornerstone]

Shot me a pm if you want me to price some stuff for you. I am in the business and can give you an idea of prices.

Obviously take this up, but just to add to the mix there are some reputable diamond wholesalers out there. Unfortunately I can't remember the names, which isn't much use. Maybe they will come to me later!

It's a much better idea the way you are doing it rather than buying retail (obviously you have already determined this - just supporting the idea!). More than saving money you will end up with a much better diamond (by spending the amount you would in a store). I was quite surprised that places like Tiffanys can sell some yellow lower grade diamonds, and as for other stores some of the diamonds were down at brown. The thing that irks me is that as carats, colour and clarity improve, the retailers also mark up the ring - even though it's the same ring, same amount of work, same overheads. You can see comparing the 'wholesale' (i.e. not high street retail) prices for various carats and comparing them to their Tiffany equivalent finished rings.

Best of luck!

[cornerstone]

Here we go - this is not a bad place to start Excel Diamonds

Might give you a good guide to prices you can get out of the stores. Presumably robertinaustin knows more (prepared to share the knowledge?! )

[cornerstone]

Seems I haven't drunk all the brain cells away quite yet - it's coming back to me slowly!

Blue Nile diamonds

Also look around for some of the diamond forums: diamond.info seems to have a decent one.

Cheers!

[robertrinaustin]

I sent Bruce a long email, but I'll summarize here.

Cut is a personal preference. What shape does she like? Carat is similar. Does you girlfriend prefer size or brilliance, assuming you have a budget?

I prefer color over clarity and would be willing to drop to an SI1 to get better color. The color is what makes a diamond "pop" when comparing the same cuts. An SI1 should look good to the naked eye with no visible flaws.

For pricing, always ask for quotes in reference to the Rap Report. The Rapaport Report is the price sheet wholesalers use to negotiate diamond prices. Most diamonds are priced at less than Rap, but the Rap sheet doesn't account for cut quality, grade and proportions. If you are looking for a perfect cut, you may pay Rap or better. Everything else should trade at a discount from Rap. I would shoot for 30% discount from Rap. You may not get it that cheap, but it gives you an idea. Ask the dealer to show you the Rap price for the stone you are buying.

Good Luck!

Edited June 25, 2006 by robertrinaustin

[cornerstone]

I sent Bruce a long email, but I'll summarize here.

Cut is a personal preference. What shape does she like? Carat is similar. Does you girlfriend prefer size or brilliance, assuming you have a budget?

I prefer color over clarity and would be willing to drop to an SI1 to get better color. The color is what makes a diamond "pop" when comparing the same cuts. An SI1 should look good to the naked eye with no visible flaws.

For pricing, always ask for quotes in reference to the Rap Report. The Rapaport Report is the price sheet wholesalers use to negotiate diamond prices. Most diamonds are priced at less than Rap, but the Rap sheet doesn't account for cut quality, grade and proportions. If you are looking for a perfect cut, you may pay Rap or better. Everything else should trade at a discount from Rap. I would shoot for 30% discount from Rap. You may not get it that cheap, but it gives you an idea. Ask the dealer to show you the Rap price for the stone you are buying.

Good Luck!

Thanks for sharing that - it's greatly appreciated!!

EDIT: forgot to say that the diamond.info website seems to have an excellent search engine for diamonds from different dealers (presumably they get some kind of affiliate commission, but still, it seems quite good)

Edited September 5, 2007 by cornerstone

[bruce79]

Thanks for all of the leads.

[Willith]

I bought my loose diamond in the San Diego area when I lived down there. There was a local shop that gave me a nice price and helped me out a lot with how to choose a diamond. If you are in that area I can get the receipt out of the safe and give you the name of that store. I ended up getting a nice certified (GIA or EGL, don't remember which right now) mapped, .74 very symmetrical princess cut VS1 D diamond for ~$3000. I was happy with the deal at the time and the platinum setting with smaller side stones cost me nearly as much (different store) as the diamond. Good luck with the search and also with the engagement. Let us know when it's "official" and also what you got for her.

[txjeweler]

Bruce,

I have been in the diamond biz for over 12 yrs. If you have any questions just pm me. I can get you great prices and answer any questions you might have. I have a slight differing opinion to Robert about cut. Shape is not cut(in my opinion). Cut is proportion and placement of facets. Less than 1% of gem quality stones are ever cut to ideal or exacting specifications. Proper proportions can effect the price of a stone 60-75%.

http://jewelry.about.com/cs/thefourcs/a/diamond_cut.htm

[robertrinaustin]

Bruce,

I have been in the diamond biz for over 12 yrs. If you have any questions just pm me. I can get you great prices and answer any questions you might have. I have a slight differing opinion to Robert about cut. Shape is not cut(in my opinion). Cut is proportion and placement of facets. Less than 1% of gem quality stones are ever cut to ideal or exacting specifications. Proper proportions can effect the price of a stone 60-75%.

http://jewelry.about.com/cs/thefourcs/a/diamond_cut.htm

I agree with you and I am by no means an expert, actually a gemstone newb. I've been in the biz for less than a year and though I work for a fairly large jewelry company, I actually have nothing to do with jewelry.

However, I am fortunate to work with a group that has some great stone experts and spends about $20 million a year on diamonds. I'm always trying to learn more, though it's a challenge because my office is in NY, I live in Texas and our stone buyers are mostly in India. Then there is the problem of language, I don't speak Hindi.

I did ask about prices and I can get the diamond for 35% off Rap, plus a 5% charge for handling (the company gets the 5% not me). Obviously, this is not for a perfect or ideal cut, but I can price that as well if you are interested.

Cheers,

Robert

[bruce79]

Thanks for all of your great responses. I wanted to know some opinions on Jewelry Stores in malls vs. jewelry districts? I found this great semi mounting in a family owned jewelry store here in San Diego but it's in a mall. What do you think about buying loose stones at a mall jewelry store vs jewelry district jewelry store. Any suggestions? Thanks

[cornerstone]

Thanks for all of your great responses. I wanted to know some opinions on Jewelry Stores in malls vs. jewelry districts? I found this great semi mounting in a family owned jewelry store here in San Diego but it's in a mall. What do you think about buying loose stones at a mall jewelry store vs jewelry district jewelry store. Any suggestions? Thanks

Ultimately a good deal is a good deal. Compare with places like Bluenile to get an idea of the online price of the diamond and the ring - being able to see it and try it before you buy is worth a mark-up: question is how much!

And don't forget....diamonds really are forever!

[Blindman]

I've been in jewelry since 1992 and can tell you - stay out of the malls. Most here in the midwest are controlled by Sterling. Imagine the same company owning five different chain stores and having a price war? Guess who's the casualty. Also sounds like your getting tripple keyed, that's where you take the price of the material x 3 to get the final cost. It's an industry standard though most do 2.5 x material. The funny part is the bench jeweler who's putting it together certainly isn't making more. Most industry bench jewelers average between $7 to $20 an hour - who's getting the profit? Get a nice independant and you'll get a better piece and price. Ask to see thier other pieces or their portfollio. I get most of my gems from a trusted broker in New York and for alot less than you think. All a haggle and a handshake. Also be sure to get your gem GIA certified - it really helps should you ever need to identify it or file an insurance claim.

As to the four C's, well thats a prelude to a jewelers arguement. Get what you can afford and what looks good on her finger. Never, never, never, finance through the jewelry store - it's a rip off. If you have to finance to buy it, you're already starting your off marraige wrong; in debt. If the salesman leans over the counter and says "isn't she worth it?" Blow up, get loud, demand to see the manager, it'll probably get you a 1/3 off. I'm tellin ya, most are worse than used can salesman.

[bruce79]

Looks like I'm back to the drawing board. I saw this semi-mount about 6 months ago and really liked it so I went back to the store to pursue it about a month ago and they didn't have it in the store so they ordered it for me. When it finally came in, the mount was in 18k white gold instead of yellow and the price nearly doubled on the ring (in both white and yellow gold). They claimed the price of gold went up since I first saw the ring 6 months ago.

[Linder]

They are partially correct. You can get an idea of the fluctuations here:

http://www.kitco.com/charts/historicalgold.html

[Blindman]

The price of precious metals has skyrocketed, the whole jewelry trade is feeling it. Sterling has already doubled from last year. Platinum - ouch!

[alt.watch.obsessive]

I must brag. My wife had a 1.75ct ring from her family, so I knew I was screwed. I bought a 1.75ct on eBay for $1000 from the guy in Beverly Hills who sells rolies since he seemed trustworthy (Beckertime I believe). Another $500 locally for a mount with two small diamonds on either side. Perfect color but heavy on the inclusions. However, they are all white so other than a slight loss of brilliance it looks exceptional to the naked eye. The gals go nuts over this thing, much to my satisfaction.