Rolexman Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 It's well known I don't deal with the cartel dealers and other China based dealers anymore after some really bad experiences. That's why I bought all my reps from Precious Time (UK) the past 1,5 years or so. Then some months ago Chris from EuroTimez joined the board with his high QC standards. As he is Thailand based I was sceptical at first but after some really nice conversations (we share the same native language). I thought why not, let's give it a go. So I ordered the most expensive SOSF with GEN/ NEW Eta movement. I have been wanting this rep for a long time but due to the several issues (lume/ crown-tube) I never ordered it. I owned the gen SOSF for a while so my standard is really high regarding this particular rep. Even Precious Time couldn't guarantee the lume would be perfect as most of them were crap. So I never pulled the trigger. Were was I? oh right, EuroTimez . But upon receiving the watch from the factory Chris checked the watch and send me some pics. The lume was crap.... he told me this was not the standard he would like to sell me and would try if he could switch dials with the perfect Asian SOSF. This wasn't possible due to different dimensions/ dialfeet so he left me the choice to order a different rep and would 'eat' the SOSF and use it for some of his luming experiments. The factory which produces this particular watch apparently doesn't take watches back. Another rep which always intrigued me was the blue Aquaracer. As I only try to buy super reps this would be a logical choice. Chris also stated he could guarantee the quality of this rep as this factory does take watches back if they didn't passed his QC. There are some excellent reviews of this watch here, here and here. So this is not a review of the watch but rather of it's quality and the QC it underwent. Are all the QC points of EuroTimez checked before the watch got shipped? Is this watch perfect? Yes and no. The only flaw is a scratch/ dent on the blue insert. This happened during shipment as I also saw pics of my watch before shipment where there was no scratch. So this isn't Chris' fault but rather an unlucky incident which was out of his control. Chis already ordered me a new insert so this will be taken care of ASAP. Other than that the watch is perfect. A full QC review (according to EuroTimez standards as can be found in his section) -----> Pictures can be enhanced by clicking on them. First I did a pressure test. It passed the 6 ATM test, check. This is very logical because of the well constructed chrono pushers (more later). Then I opened the case back (and damn was it screwed on tight). Check, it has been opened and marked by his watchmaker Check, grease is detected on the case back Check, hard to see in the pic but grease is detected on the gasket Hard to see in person and even harder in the pic but there is some shine on the gasket. I'm 70% sure the crown is greased so, check. Chrono pusher construction: Notice that there are 2!!! gaskets per pusher In close-up (even with a 10x loupe) it's really hard to see if these gaskets are greased. As it is very time consuming to remove the pushers and replace them I would say they aren't greased but I will give it the benefit of the doubt as there is some light shine on the rubber. The crystal, dial and printing are all clear and crisp, check. Check, all lume is perfectly applied. Hands are nice and clean and without scratches, check. The date and day are aligned. 99% perfect and surely the best I've seen as this is a very well known issue with this particular model, check. Check, pearl is perfect and covered with sapphire(?). The bracelet was a b*tch to size. This is the result.........It took me 5 hours and a lot of sweat to get it to fit. I already read that more members had the same problem with this bracelet. Some branded it as the hardest bracelet to size, I would agree. The pin-sleeve constuction is way too tight for a regular bracelet sizing tool. I had to make my own tool by grinding a jeweller screwdriver so thin it would both fit the hole in the bracelet and would also fit through the sleeve. Chris states he checks the bracelet and screws but as this one has pins it would be very hard and time consuming for him to check the entire bracelet. So in all fairness it has nothing to do with the QC, it's purely a construction fault with the margins set too tight. Backside with the black (incorrect) paint. Notice the absence of the markings on the end links.....nothing to do with the QC maybe the factory changed it (different supplier for the bracelet?). Back side after removing the black paint. Nicely decorated movement and signed rotor (The first batches didn't have a signed rotor) Overall picture Functions/wear, check. No pictures needed here. Everything works like it should. - Proper resetting chrono hands. - Nice long crown thread. - Smooth hand winding. - Good power reserve 41 hours. - Good day and date change (date indeed exactly at 24:00). - Best of all a full regulated movement. It gained +1 seconds over 2(!!) days - Bezel clicks smooth but tight. - Clasp opens and closes like it should, both 'pongs' grip the clasp fold like they should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boutchou69 Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 How did you remove the black paint on the back ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted June 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 How did you remove the black paint on the back ? Use a Q-tip and some paint thinner and rub real hard LOL. Works like a charm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobs1971 Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 Interesting test, Rolexman. Thnx! Makes me even more curious to Eurotimez... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dluddy Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 Nice review. I like the approach. It is good to see our latest dealer getting good reviews Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corgi Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 The date and day are aligned. 99% perfect and surely the best I've seen as this is a very well known issue with this particular model, check. I am confused. How is this supposed to be good alignment? The day is really high and by contrast the date is really low... if they were both either high or low it wouldn't really matter but as it stands they look totally loopy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rolexman Posted June 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 I am confused. How is this supposed to be good alignment? The day is really high and by contrast the date is really low... if they were both either high or low it wouldn't really matter but as it stands they look totally loopy. Well it's really hard to capture on photo. It's probably the angle. The date is centered properly but the day sits slightly higher. This isn't even a millimeter but rather a micrometer issue which is very difficult to detect with the naked eye, even more so because you almost never see the watch in a perfect straight angel. As I said it isn't perfect but I have yet to see a stock Aquaracer with a perfect alignment. ETA day/ date wheels would resolve this issue if one's really anal about it. To me it's well aligned but maybe I'm cockeyed LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capice Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 spoke to Chris several times, easy communication in our native tongue , seems like an okguy Unfortunately he couldn't deliver the watches I was looking for about the QC, that has to prove itself btw I don't think the allignment is that good on this one...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceberg1459 Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 i guess PT got a serious competition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FxrAndy Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 Well it's really hard to capture on photo. It's probably the angle. The date is centered properly but the day sits slightly higher. This isn't even a millimeter but rather a micrometer issue which is very difficult to detect with the naked eye, even more so because you almost never see the watch in a perfect straight angel. As I said it isn't perfect but I have yet to see a stock Aquaracer with a perfect alignment. ETA day/ date wheels would resolve this issue if one's really anal about it. To me it's well aligned but maybe I'm cockeyed LOL. I have seen many gens with far worse alignment than that, and tag are oftern the worst, that wouls be fine for me too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EuroTimez Posted June 6, 2008 Report Share Posted June 6, 2008 (edited) Hi MArk (rolexman) nice review, very good shots. Like to see it when you put the GEN ETA DW in. about the DW allignment let's first of all remember we're talking about fractions of fraction of mm. I think it's exagarated to say it is disalligned. Pictures also appear way bigger then real life watch. Generally in regards to DW: It is very hard to get straight as I don't make the watches, it has sometimes something to do with the printing... we even tried to allign it even better at my watchmaker, but this turned out to be useless and time-consuming which I won't try again (all the hands need to be taken off, dial, then the DW and then reseated, then checked if it is okay etc.. What I think is most important instead of "trying to hold me accountable to interpetations which can be broad in regards to DW" I think it's most important you get a watch that functions the way it should "as a rep" + QC that I do which is reality -no white lie-. Which dealer can offer you this service?! Some dealers don't care if you're DW is Totally off... no control, For all interested please read my policies, what to expect and what NOT on my website www.eurotimez.com / about us.... According to Rolexman the date is alligned, but even if it wasn't (like on a fraction of mm)..... un-alligned datewheels (remember we're talking about fraction of a mm which is zoomed out from a picture) is a commen flaw that I cannot do anything about.... even GENS can have this issue. If it was really like TOTALLY unalligned like it was HALF HALF of the screen then okay you have a legit case--- I wouldn't sell it like that. That is my interpetation. But please think from a dealer perspective, try returning a watch to the factory and tell them the DW was fraction of a fraction of a mm un-alligned, then when after 5-10 replacements (which I won't get from the factory, they will stop selling me any watches if I would be so anal) you discover that all watches have this slight un-allignment because of the "printing" for instance. Then think that I don't sell one watch a week, I sell many watches, and I have many orders going which all need to be ordered, QC, shipped etc, so I cannot spend a week trying to fix a slightly un-alligned DW. If FXRANDY even says some gens have worse allignments, so really it is hard and let's REMEMBER we're talking about REPS at REPS prices, NOT GEN PRICES (lets be realistic)... my QC is really afforable for everybody, I'm not asking 120+ usd for it, generally I'm 20-40 usd more expensive than the top asian cartel dealers (who drop ship, no QC, no nothing) my prices are incl QC + added value + free registered airmail shipping, also can ship from within EU, and currently have low rates on optional EMS / Within EU shipments (as part of the cost we pay from our own pocket). Hope this helps to give some insights of my QC...and services... Edited June 6, 2008 by EuroTimez Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OutSider Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 Imagine that, a dealer that advertises and QC and then actually does it. Thanks for the great review! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capice Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 about missallignment...check Scoobs post on a 3717 at an AD......unbeleavable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobs1971 Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 about missallignment...check Scoobs post on a 3717 at an AD......unbeleavable You mean this? http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=75581&hl= Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EuroTimez Posted June 7, 2008 Report Share Posted June 7, 2008 see Rolexman (TAG) it wasn't that bad after all gud one gud one SCOOBS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 EuroTimez, why not just buy a few ETA day/date wheels and install them upon the buyers request before delivery for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P4GTR Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 Beautiful watch, grats! I am unimpressed with the folding clasp design on this watch on the genuine (and thus, rep) it lacks innovation. I'm personally very tired of that big plate rolex fold-over style. My collector takes very good care of me when all is said and done, but I think I speak for many when I say i'd much rather things be done right the first time. Although, the extra gifts and discounts are hard to give up! Chris, send me that moonwatch I was talking to you about, on the house. If it arrives QC'd and in proper working order on the FIRST shipment, I'll do a pictorial review, make a donation to RWG, and switch all of my personal business and referrals to you! Never hurts to ask guys. I have no shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleJay Posted June 14, 2008 Report Share Posted June 14, 2008 I'm glad to hear this. I actually swore off dealers after my problems with DSN and Joshua, but heard so much of ET that I placed an order. He's waiting on shipment and QC, so I hope to have then soon. ET is the standard ALL "Collectors" should be measured by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 EuroTimez, why not just buy a few ETA day/date wheels and install them upon the buyers request before delivery for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 I'd guess for the reasons EuroTimez mentioned in his post... Yeah I read his post rearding the Asian 7750 replica date wheels being of differing quality from one to the next, but I am talking about installing Swiss ETA date wheels, so the alignment and print quality would be perfect, that was my point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 Yeah I read his post rearding the Asian 7750 replica date wheels being of differing quality from one to the next, but I am talking about installing Swiss ETA date wheels, so the alignment and print quality would be perfect, that was my point I got that that was your point, I just felt that from what EuroTimez said, that re-alligning datewheels was not something he would be undertaking in the future, and, if all the datewheels were to be of the same level of allignment as shown above, that was a level that he (and I suspect most people) would consider to be acceptable, and I suspect, he would view installing new wheels, in the same way as he viewed attempts to re-alligning (which was something he said he would not be doing in the future, given the excellent allignment already shown). If someone's shown a photo of their watch prior to arrival, then obviously they can give a 'yay or nay' before it's sent, but, if they give the go ahead, it was to arrive thus, and they were still to consider the allignment unacceptable (which, in all honesty, given what is known of other watches, even gens, would be an unreasonable expectation and opinion) then it would be up to them to have the mod work done to re-allign or outright replace the wheels, rather than buying the watch 'modded' from EuroTimez. Of course, he may decide to sell 'modded' watches in the future, but from his comments, suspect he will stick to providing an excellent level of QC, and sending watches to clients in the best possible condition, from the factory, rather than getting into the process of part transplants and other mods... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Padge Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 Well I don't tend to make assumptions on behalf of other people, or second guess what they may or may not do/mean...... I read it as posted, he will not waste time trying to re-align the Asian date wheels because in most cases it is not possible, due to the poor quality printing/alignment, instead the watches will simply not pass his QC check, fair play, his QC is more than most other dealers would do Now offering an upgrade, at a price, to ETA Swiss day/date wheels will reduce the QC return rate of watches, and please many potential customers who would like the higher quality, correct font, perfectly aligned day/date wheels Win, win situation in my book, and if the price charged is right, not a loss making one for the dealer either...... All just my opinion of course, but I bet a lot of people would jump at the chance if offered a day/date wheel upgrade direct from a dealer, I would Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 Well I don't tend to make assumptions on behalf of other people, or second guess what they may or may not do/mean...... I wasn't second guessing anything, but going by what EuroTimez specifically said. If I then made an assumption from that, so be it. From what EuroTimez wrote, I feel it was a reasonable one. I read it as posted, he will not waste time trying to re-align the Asian date wheels because in most cases it is not possible, due to the poor quality printing/alignment, instead the watches will simply not pass his QC check, fair play, his QC is more than most other dealers would do Precicely so Now offering an upgrade, at a price, to ETA Swiss day/date wheels will reduce the QC return rate of watches, and please many potential customers who would like the higher quality, correct font, perfectly aligned day/date wheels Win, win situation in my book, and if the price charged is right, not a loss making one for the dealer either...... I agree with the point you're making, but, EuroTimez did say that he would not be doing things along those lines, simply because of the time involved and amount of sales he does, which was what made me suspect that he would not offer such a modification. As I said previously, the level of allignment shown is what can reasonably be termed acceptable. It is certainly not unacceptable, and, as I mentioned, I would consider anyone who did think it was unnacceptable to be being unreasonable, and having unreasonably high expectations. Let's not forget, as EuroTimez pointed out, this is something being scrutinized from a blown up picture, not something someone glances at quickly on their wrist. I'd bet that at a glance, on the wrist, it would appear perfectly alligned. That is why I said it (wheel transplants) should not be the responsibility of the dealer, but a modification the buyer could later choose to have done. EuroTimez is sending out excellent product, and taking the precautions to ensure the product is as good as possible, which, as pointed out, dealers who drop-ship simply cannot do, regardless of their claims or willingness to replace goods received as faulty. EuroTimez also pointed out (as I remember someone else once saying in a discussion) that if he was to keep trying to replace the watch with the factories, they will stop selling to him. That would achieve nothing whatsoever, but rob this community of a valuable dealer. Bearing that in mind, as I said, if he were to choose to sell 'modded' watches, then that would obviously be upto him as a dealer. However, from what he said, I personally took his comments to mean that he is prepared to give watches an incredibly thorough examination, and only ship goods which pass that examination, but that he would not be doing wheel realignments (and presumeably things like that) due to time constraints, so the affore mentioned examination, would make sure that something which was seriously misalligned simply would not be shipped out. That is why I said that a buyer would either approve or reject a watch. If they reject it, then they reject it, and another would be sourced. If they accept it, then they accept it 'as is', at which point, something like a datewheel transplant (unless it was a service offered) would be a modification project for them to undertake themselves. :B All just my opinion of course, but I bet a lot of people would jump at the chance if offered a day/date wheel upgrade direct from a dealer, I would Absolutely, but that's not to say that the dealer will, or even wants to, offer that as an option That's all I was trying to point out, as being my understanding of EuroTimez' comment. EuroTimez, if I misunderstood your point, have put words in your mouth or otherwise spoken out of turn, then I apologize, I was simply reading and commenting on your comments as I understood them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EuroTimez Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Hi sorry it took some time for me to respond, I'm traveling in BKK at the moment sourcing some nice reps.... Both are right, @Mickey I not into modding at the moment and I don't have the ETA DW. But I'll consider doing so in the future. @ TeeJay, thanks for the kind words and for the responce I'm very very much in line like what you said. I will consider doing small mods like ETA DW in the future as we have the capability we just don't have the ETA DW in stock, other than that my watchmaker is more than capable to put it inside the watch, that is not much of a problem. The problem however (and this is what Mickey pointed out -- thanks) is that the rep DW is sometimes printed the way it is printed and therefore there is little that I can do to resolve that... So like TeeJay said, if clients have too high of an expectation what can I do?! I don't produce and reseating them would be useless and timeconsuming. I do check and have them in acceptable "state" and I will reseat them if their completely missalligned ---but not if it is like Rolexman 99% perfect state.... Hope this clarifies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 @ TeeJay, thanks for the kind words and for the responce I'm very very much in line like what you said. I will consider doing small mods like ETA DW in the future as we have the capability we just don't have the ETA DW in stock, other than that my watchmaker is more than capable to put it inside the watch, that is not much of a problem. The problem however (and this is what Mickey pointed out -- thanks) is that the rep DW is sometimes printed the way it is printed and therefore there is little that I can do to resolve that... So like TeeJay said, if clients have too high of an expectation what can I do?! I don't produce and reseating them would be useless and timeconsuming. I do check and have them in acceptable "state" and I will reseat them if their completely missalligned ---but not if it is like Rolexman 99% perfect state.... Hope this clarifies... That's awesome to hear about the date wheel mods Thanks for understanding the spirit with which my comments were made Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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