kingkitesurf Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 (edited) As the rep virus strikes I am looking RolexGMT2 Black/Red (next to my sub and Explorer2). I am very happy with ETA movements and they are well worth the money for me. So I need a 2836-2 modified. Now I do not now what to look for exept the hand stack. What are important points in GMT2 reps that distinguishes them as a rep. Job Edited July 7, 2006 by kingkitesurf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panerai153 Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 I will be very interested in the response that you get from ythis request.I to am looking for a goood reliable Rolex GMT Master II rep. I have heard, and this is just from discussions with a couple of members that the CN (China) models are more accurate dial, crown guards are more accurate than the TW (Tiawan) models. I cannot say this is true, because there may be many variations within a country, from different manufacturers. As to the hand stack issue, the 2836 is not accurate, but as BY-Tor stated in his excellent review of the GMT master II, you have to have Eagle eyes to even notice the hand stack. Only when the hour hand and the GMT hand overlap is it apparant that the stack is incorrect. I believe that the basic problem with all the GMT's now is the use of the 2836 movement rather than the 2893-2. The 2836 is a compromise movement which has been adapted to a GMT. I believe that it is a day/date movement in it's correct configuration. I'm sure that there have been some improvements in the reliability of the movement, but they were a source of many problems when they were first introduced a year or two back, I believe in the PAM 063 and 029 GMT models. The best movement is the 2893-2 which is a true GMT movement. It was dropped in favor of the 2836 because of price. The PAM's that were made with the 2893-2 movements were around 600-800 dollars initially, and dropped to the 300-400 dollar range eventually. The dealers cannot sell a 150-250 dollar GMT MASter II with the 2893-2 as the movement costs so much. But, if you are looking for a watch that will be a long term investment as a using watch, one that you can afford to spend some money modding, i believe the 2893-2 would be the way to go. PROBLEM!! none of the dealers are stocking the 2893-2 movements anymore. Everything is 2836. I have been searching for a Rolex GMT Master II w/2893-2 movement for weeks, with no results. no one has them, period. I bought a GMT MasterII (2836) from Paul/Aspire a couple of weeks back, it came in last weekend, very nice watch. comparing it to photos of the genuine, it is pretty darn close. I'm replacing the bezel insert, and having it waterproofed and a little shaping of the crown guards and that's all. Possibly, if the 2836 dies, I will replace the movement witha 2893-2. Time will tell, about the reliability of that particular movement. I hope it works for a long time, but based on experiences of other folks who have had this movement, I remain skeptical. I hope this is a start, I would be most appreciative for any info on a good solid GMT w 22893-2. Regards Arthur Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 As the rep virus strikes I am looking RolexGMT2 Black/Red (next to my sub and Explorer2). I am very happy with ETA movements and they are well worth the money for me. So I need a 2836-2 modified. Now I do not now what to look for exept the hand stack. What are important points in GMT2 reps that distinguishes them as a rep. Job Did you already read this review, as others suggested you... in that other thread you started about the same subject? http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=432 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cskent69 Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 (edited) The big question is - can you swap the movement to a 2893-2? Will it really fit in the 2836 case Edited July 7, 2006 by cskent69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 According to Eddie Lee 2893 has been much more problematic than the 2836-2 powered watches he has sold. Yes, I know the 2893 is a "real" GMT movement and praised by Ziggy for good lubrication, etc. And you can get preowned vintage GENUINE Masters for $1.3K if you sacrifice condition a bit. So does it really make any sense to swap a movement and invest around $600 for a rep... which, even after the movement swap won't function like the Rolex caliber 3185??? I have no idea why people think 2836 is unreliable. Mine has been bullet proof for 12 months. Never heard of any complaints, except in those early ones that had a problem of GMT hand not following properly... and in the new (extremely bad) rep version where the GMT hand is correctly placed over the hour hand. And I'm pretty sure these problems were caused by the hand assembly, not the movement itself. This is what EL said, once again (probably the 10th time I repost this): quote--------------------------------------------------> I offer 2836 and 2893 for the gmt... for the record...it does not matter to me which is which...the price is pretty much fixed by the distributor.... 2893...as most know is $$$ movt,...and once it is not in sync,,,hard to fix and $$$ to fix. i have shipped many 2893 ,,,,many....and i also have lots of issue with 2893..and when these come back to me,,,these 2893 just go back to distributor and return back to maker right away as instructed by maker. As once it is reassembled or retouch the movt,,,it has become unstable, exteemely unstable. and so far, i have quite a few return on the 2893...over 20 pcs....even these have been checked prior shipping out...i am sure many in the forum who have the 2893 may discover that gmt hand may slack in time or not sync with time...and fallen into the twilight zone..... but in 2836...i only have 1 issue with not sync with the time. This is what i know,,,and this is the info that i get,,and this is the feedback i have ...and this is the stat. and number does not lie. Regardless of what the eta movt says...or swatch group say....basically i do only believe what my qc lady and my repair mate inform me...and i have no doubt about their capabilities and judgement. I love to sell 2893 more than 2836....but 2836 is a simpler movt... and easier to fix...and from my point of view....on my service side...2836 better for me.... not many will know how to fix 2893 and 2892.,...and what if the local watchsmith screws the movt up...this mean the movt is gone...but 2836 is the work horse of the swatch group and many watchsmiths know this movt inside and out....like a the hook mechanism of victoria secret bras...2893 is the french corset....nice and sexy...but in my opinion has rather dim record.... I do not know much about movt...but i do one thing for sure....i knwo the stat...and i know the record...and i know the detail. If u were to ask me which is better.....benz or toyota....i will tell you ,,,if u have the cash sure...benz is better....but if u dont want to bet for return of service...toyota is one u may want to go with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingkitesurf Posted July 7, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 Did you already read this review, as others suggested you... in that other thread you started about the same subject? http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=432 OOps forgot I started the subject a day ago... Sorry bout that. Your article description and pictures are excellent but where did you get that specific version... forget about the hand stack.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 I'm working on building my own vintage GMT (1675). No worries about the hand stack on the oldies as they are the same as the 2836 (GMT Hand>Hour Hand?Minute Hand>Seconds Hand). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
By-Tor Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 OOps forgot I started the subject a day ago... Sorry bout that. Your article description and pictures are excellent but where did you get that specific version... forget about the hand stack.... Joshua, Precious Time, Homer, King, etc. They all sell the same watch. With a little bit of research and some picture comparison in their sales galleries you'll find out what you have to order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 The most accurate Rolex GMT Master II 16710 (Black/Red bezel) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chronus Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 I believe that the basic problem with all the GMT's now is the use of the 2836 movement rather than the 2893-2. The 2836 is a compromise movement which has been adapted to a GMT. I believe that it is a day/date movement in it's correct configuration. I'm sure that there have been some improvements in the reliability of the movement, but they were a source of many problems when they were first introduced a year or two back, I believe in the PAM 063 and 029 GMT models. The best movement is the 2893-2 which is a true GMT movement. In my opinion the ETA 2893-2 movement is not a true GMT movement as is used in the genuine Rolex GMT Master II's and Omega Seamaster GMTs. The ETA 2893-2 movement functions differently to the movements in these watches as regards to GMT functionality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck88 Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 My 2893 (from my EL 063) stopped working after a couple of weeks... but since they aren't made anymore I didn't want to ship it back. So, The Zigmeister worked on it recently (it's being delivered today) and discovered it had almost no oil... so so much for the 2893 being a well oiled movement Well, before The Zigmeister's touch that is... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddhead Posted July 7, 2006 Report Share Posted July 7, 2006 (edited) My 2893 (from my EL 063) stopped working after a couple of weeks... but since they aren't made anymore I didn't want to ship it back. So, The Zigmeister worked on it recently (it's being delivered today) and discovered it had almost no oil... so so much for the 2893 being a well oiled movement Well, before The Zigmeister's touch that is... I received a PAM 029 with a 2893 movement from Eddie Lee in early May. It could not be more reliable or accurate.. has not lost more than a minute since the time of purchase, just incredible. I even shower and have swam with it... not harm... . just my two measly cents Edited July 7, 2006 by eddhead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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