PunkJr Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 (edited) replica that isn't made out of 316 stainless? it will never look like the real thing. does anyone know of any available in 904L ss? Edited July 11, 2006 by PunkJr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crystalcranium Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 that isn't made out of 316 stainless? it will never look like the real thing. does anyone know of any available? The MBW subs are "supposedly" made from 440 stainless but I haven't heard enough solicited confirmation of this to say for sure. I almost bought one several weeks ago but I stopped just short when an insider told me that dispite feeling better than the typical submariner copies, they still do not have the silky heavy feel of a genuine. I guess the fact that submariners are the Ford F-150 of replicas and are produced in vast numbers to satisfy the market, producing a high end quality one is not an economic priority for the replica manufacturers. If we're going to buy up tens of thousands of 316 grade stainless ones, who needs to make a 440 grade one? Surprisingly, I have found much better intrinsic quality in the Omega and Breitling replicas than in the Rollies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonton2000 Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 that isn't made out of 316 stainless? it will never look like the real thing. does anyone know of any available in 904L ss? Yeah, but only from rolex im afraid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PunkJr Posted July 11, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 The MBW subs are "supposedly" made from 440 stainless but I haven't heard enough solicited confirmation of this to say for sure. I almost bought one several weeks ago but I stopped just short when an insider told me that dispite feeling better than the typical submariner copies, they still do not have the silky heavy feel of a genuine. I guess the fact that submariners are the Ford F-150 of replicas and are produced in vast numbers to satisfy the market, producing a high end quality one is not an economic priority for the replica manufacturers. If we're going to buy up tens of thousands of 316 grade stainless ones, who needs to make a 440 grade one? Surprisingly, I have found much better intrinsic quality in the Omega and Breitling replicas than in the Rollies. was that 440 or 940? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 that isn't made out of 316 stainless? it will never look like the real thing. For one... There is very little difference between 316 and 904L visually/aesthetically. Yes, genuine Rolex stainless steel has the appearance of being a little bit brighter, but it is my belief that it's mostly due to the finishing of the metal, and nothing to do with the actual differences in the steel itself. Comparing the genuine 78390 bracelet from my Franken-Daytona to a rep bracelet, there is very little difference in actual color; finish, however is a bit smoother and the brushing is better on the genuine (no surprise there). It always cracks me up when people on the gen RLX forums (Timezone, etc) claim to be able to see a difference between 316 and 904L. I think it's all in their heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linder Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 was that 440 or 940? MBW's claim 440 stainless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linder Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 For one... There is very little difference between 316 and 904L visually/aesthetically. Yes, genuine Rolex stainless steel has the appearance of being a little bit brighter, but it is my belief that it's mostly due to the finishing of the metal, and nothing to do with the actual differences in the steel itself. Comparing the genuine 78390 bracelet from my Franken-Daytona to a rep bracelet, there is very little difference in actual color; finish, however is a bit smoother and the brushing is better on the genuine (no surprise there). It always cracks me up when people on the gen RLX forums (Timezone, etc) claim to be able to see a difference between 316 and 904L. I think it's all in their heads. I think there is probably a polishing difference in the "typical" 316 rep versus the "typical" 904 genuine. The genuine does have approximately twice the nickel composition, ~20% versus 10% in 316. I imagine this would help the genuine to maintain its shine longer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 I'm not sure if the finish is more durable on the 904L or not. Rolex uses the 904L for it's higher nickel content as it's more resistant to corrosion; one of the reasons why they switched over to 904L in the mid-80's (they used 316 prior for their cases and bracelets). The genuine's finish is simply better because Rolex takes more time to finish it whereas rep factories don't. If you were to spend a little bit of time to polish and re-finish a rep Rolex (especially the bracelet), it would better match that of a genuine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craytonic Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 Nothing a little elbow grease can't fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Category 5 Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 440 is not really readily available...especially inexpensively. I would be very surprised if ANY rep was made from anything better than 316L. In fact, Rolex aside, that's what most SS gens are made of. 316L is the Caddilac of stainless steel. I'd bet our reps (which claim 316) aren't even using that high of a grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shasta Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 I doubt MBW is 440. 440 SS can only be CNC milled as part of an annealing process and requires a whole different setup than standard CNC equipment offers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Linder Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 This is a good discussion for me as I am very allergic to nickel. Is there some sort of a test that could be done on an MBW? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinitime Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 440 is not really readily available...especially inexpensively. I would be very surprised if ANY rep was made from anything better than 316L. In fact, Rolex aside, that's what most SS gens are made of. 316L is the Caddilac of stainless steel. I'd bet our reps (which claim 316) aren't even using that high of a grade. I would say that 316L is more the Chevrolet of stainless steel... given that it is of decent quality and used in many many applications. Given that genuine Seiko 5 watches using 316L for its case can be purchased new for about $35US on Ebay, I don't think the cost of production is particularly high. Further, due to swelling of Chinese steel production over the last couple of years, there has been a drop in the price of steel in general, so I would not be surprised that all the reps are using 316L. I agree though, that it is highly unlikely that any of the rep makers would have access to the machinery for milling 914L grade steel, which is considerably harder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinitime Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 This is a good discussion for me as I am very allergic to nickel. Is there some sort of a test that could be done on an MBW? Is there any truth to the suggestion that MBW cases are in fact, sourced from the same manufacturer of genuine Rolex cases? I understand that the MBW readily accepts genuine parts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingkitesurf Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 I posted a reading subject in the Knowledge database on Stainless Steal with all specifications. In short 904 is three times as expensive as 316. It has better corrosion resistence. I have an overpriced Sub that has certainly been build of 440. The 316 (of which I have a few) have a yellowish shine while my 440 has a carbonish glow. They were all brushed the same way. I have not yet had the chance to hold a 904 next to the 316 and the 440. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinitime Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 I posted a reading subject in the Knowledge database on Stainless Steal with all specifications. In short 904 is three times as expensive as 316. It has better corrosion resistence. I have an overpriced Sub that has certainly been build of 440. The 316 (of which I have a few) have a yellowish shine while my 440 has a carbonish glow. They were all brushed the same way. I have not yet had the chance to hold a 904 next to the 316 and the 440. Interesting...but why 440? To the best of my recollection, none of the genuine Rolexes use 440, as all contempoary steel Rolexes use 904L, while vintage (pre-1985) models use 316L.... Actually, this was one of the reasons why I think the vintage rolex reps feel more true to the gen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PunkJr Posted July 11, 2006 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 Interesting...but why 440? To the best of my recollection, none of the genuine Rolexes use 440, as all contempoary steel Rolexes use 904L, while vintage (pre-1985) models use 316L.... Actually, this was one of the reasons why I think the vintage rolex reps feel more true to the gen. 316L is the Caddilac of stainless steel what's a caddilac? Is there any truth to the suggestion that MBW cases are in fact, sourced from the same manufacturer of genuine Rolex cases? rolex make thier own cases and are one of the very few watches that are made in house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yt74 Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 This is a good discussion for me as I am very allergic to nickel. Is there some sort of a test that could be done on an MBW? Put one on and see if you get a rash... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted July 11, 2006 Report Share Posted July 11, 2006 LMAO! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechWatch Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 This is a good discussion for me as I am very allergic to nickel. Is there some sort of a test that could be done on an MBW? 440 is magnetic, while 316 is not. Just use a magnet to check if you think the MBW is 440. 440 has no nicket while 316 has 11-14% nickel. I doubt 440 is used because it is magnetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 440 is magnetic, while 316 is not. Just use a magnet to check if you think the MBW is 440. 440 has no nicket while 316 has 11-14% nickel. I doubt 440 is used because it is magnetic. Very interesting! Learn something new every day... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechWatch Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 Very interesting! Learn something new every day... That's why I love this place. I learn so much here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archibald Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 That's why I love this place. I learn so much here. I love the pronouncement: "it will never look like a genuine." Probably, there are 16 other things that will forever make your rep not look like a gen, things that will be noticed long before the nuances of the steel's composition. Relax and enjoy your rep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonton2000 Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 I love the pronouncement: "it will never look like a genuine." Probably, there are 16 other things that will forever make your rep not look like a gen, things that will be noticed long before the nuances of the steel's composition. Relax and enjoy your rep. Amen to that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimside11 Posted July 12, 2006 Report Share Posted July 12, 2006 As you are testing the magnetism of the bracelet, be sure to use the most powerful magnet you can find. You can just put it right there next to your watch. You can also use a magnet to test the magnetic properties of the hairspring. If the watch stops working you know that you have a genuine automatic movement. Sorry, in a bit of a sardonic mood today. Thanks for your indulgence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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