athan Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 DSN is currently selling his New PVD 009 in two versions: Swiss 6497 $420 shipped Asian 6497 $340 shipped My PAM 111H is running smoothly with the Asian 6497 and I wouldn't personally mind going for the cheaper Asian version. Does it worth paying $80 more for the "Swiss"? (With which you could get a nice strap from a fellow strapmaker...) Is his "Swiss" really a Swiss 6497? You know, a gen ETA 6497 actually made in Switzerland? (I personally doubt it) Thanks for your input. I would very much appreciate your help. Athan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bong_H2O Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 DSN is currently selling his New PVD 009 in two versions: Swiss 6497 $420 shipped Asian 6497 $340 shipped My PAM 111H is running smoothly with the Asian 6497 and I wouldn't personally mind going for the cheaper Asian version. Does it worth paying $80 more for the "Swiss"? (With which you could get a nice strap from a fellow strapmaker...) Is his "Swiss" really a Swiss 6497? You know, a gen ETA 6497 actually made in Switzerland? (I personally doubt it) Thanks for your input. I would very much appreciate your help. Athan Hi Athan, I guess what you are asking is if DSN is not being honest in his description of the movements available. In reading the postings on DSN, my own conclusions would be that he is certainly knowledgable enough to know the difference, and his history is not clouded with accusations of blatent lies. Therefore, I would believe what he says. You could ask him the question directly in an email, I doubt he would risk a lie to a RWG member. It would be all over the forum in no time. But the choice is yours, maybe browsing the posts here would help you in your decision DSN As far as swiss vs asian, its my opinion that swiss is always "more bettah" Good Luck !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxman Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Im no expert on movements Athan. If your Asian 6497 serves you well then why spend the extra $80.00? I have heard that the swiss movements (6497) are made where all reps are made, China. This is what I have heard, and it does make sense. Then some believe that they are indeed Swiss made. I dont buy it but thats just me. I will be in the same position soon. I like your Idea of using the extra $$$ for a strap. Good luck with your decision. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pupifale Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 I've just got 3 DSN watches; two Fiddy's and one 44mm. in Titanium. All with "Swiss" motors. I've had my watchmaker doing some mods on them, and he's pretty sure that they are loaded with real "Swiss made" movements... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peepshow Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 DSN's closed case back reps usually come with standard undecorated or "golf ball" decorated, square bridged Swiss ETA 6497s. They are just as Swiss as you'd get from Jules Borel or Ofrei or anywhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l3x Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 I've dealt with DSN. He wouldn't try to swindle you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 I think you have to separate "Swiss" from "ETA". ETA has factories all over the world, including Thailand... Don't think of Swiss but think of the maker of the movement. Same as Honda is not really Japanese if the Honda is made in the USA or Canada?? It's still a Honda. So the question is, does the ETA watch have a real ETA inside. The answer is certainly "Yes". Is it worth the extra $80? Consider that we are talking about a handwind simple movement, if the A7750 - a chrono and automatic with many complications - is a good quality movement, then the simple Asian 6497 handwind has to be good as well... Why not invest the $80 into your Asian movement and have it serviced? You would be much further ahead... RG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peepshow Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 A very valid point, Rob! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R0NiN Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Excellent points here, thanks too for the info about ETA. I've been trying to get in contact with DSN about a 009 and not heard anything so I'm curious how you got a hold of him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athan Posted April 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 First of all, I would like to thank each one of you guys for taking the time to write your comments. It's an honor to me. So, Bong_H2O, I'm not "asking if DSN is not being honest in his description of the movements available". So far, I have never bought anything from DSN. As a matter of fact I'm now very close to place him my first order. He always answered my emails promptly and our communication is great. What I don't like in general is the "unjustifiable" use of the word Swiss by some dealers. I'm not saying that DSN is one of those. Personally I would prefer the terms "Gen ETA" and "ETA copy" with no geographical reference. As The Zigmeister says a Honda is always a Honda regardless where it comes from. 95% of the products I use are from Asia and most of them are OK! Pupifale, it's very good news that your watchmaker is sure that the movements inside your DSN watches are Gen ETAs. Thanks for sharing. Peepshow, Thanks for the reassurance. Finally, I would like to thank Master The Zigmeister for taking the time to share his valuable thoughts, I'm deeply honored. Yes Rob, you're absolutely right about the importance of servicing. (that's why I have booked a service appointment for my MBK1665GW with you in June!!!) Now, what about the parts availability and the serviceability of the Asian 6497 movement? I live in a small town in southern Europe (Athens!) and there are still some good watchsmiths that service ETAs and a lot of ETA parts around. I should also think that a Gen ETA movement would be globally serviced easier than an ETA copy. Is that correct? Would parts availability and serviceability of the Gen ETA justify the extra $80? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peepshow Posted April 1, 2009 Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 Well the ETA movements in question are "Swiss" enough, by the letter of Switzerland law, to be labled/sold as "Swiss". Who's to say the "Swiss" ETA movements used by Hamilton, Tissot, et al are any more "Swiss"? There are no such laws surrounding "Honda" or any other name brand. If these movements aren't "Swiss" enough with you, take it up with the Swiss courts and have them change the legal requirements for what can and can't be labeled "Swiss". That responsibility doesn't fall to the dealers, IMO. Hell, we can't even get some dealers to stop calling mineral crystals "synthetic sapphire"! The point is that these are genuine ETA movements. As such, spare parts are available and will fit/work. Is that worth the $80 premium? Only you can answer that question for YOU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athan Posted April 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2009 absolutely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bong_H2O Posted April 2, 2009 Report Share Posted April 2, 2009 This is one of those threads that churns up some really great perpective by RWG members. Thanks for starting the thread athan. I think you understand my interpreting your question the way I did. After all, when you say you "personally doubt" what someone claims, it strongly implies that you dont believe they are telling you the truth. Where I come from, if you dont believe someone is telling the truth, you consider them to be dishonest. I am just saying, don't flame my response when you are the one who phrased the question. Thanks again for starting the thread, and I hope you enjoy your new watch, asian or swiss !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWG Technical Posted April 2, 2009 Report Share Posted April 2, 2009 Now, what about the parts availability and the serviceability of the Asian 6497 movement? Would parts availability and serviceability of the Gen ETA justify the extra $80? Only a few of the ETA 6497 parts will interchange with the Asian 6497. So from a purely practical sense, if it was me, I would buy the ETA, because I know I will be able to have it serviced, and any parts needed will always be available. $80 does justify the cost if you consider replacement parts, and if your Asian breaks and you have no parts, you have a paperweight not a timepiece. RG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athan Posted April 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2009 Only a few of the ETA 6497 parts will interchange with the Asian 6497. So from a purely practical sense, if it was me, I would buy the ETA, because I know I will be able to have it serviced, and any parts needed will always be available. $80 does justify the cost if you consider replacement parts, and if your Asian breaks and you have no parts, you have a paperweight not a timepiece. RG Anybody else wants do add any more comments? :-) Many thanks to all and RWG (the Real Watch Group) ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishgodeep Posted April 2, 2009 Report Share Posted April 2, 2009 A good member on this board told me his rule of thumb when buying replica watches - "Buy the Asian version and if in time you decide want to keep it ...upgrade it to a Swiss movement. If it's not a keeper you've got less outlay and easier to sell on in the trading forums" Good luck FGD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prince458 Posted April 2, 2009 Report Share Posted April 2, 2009 (edited) I think you have to separate "Swiss" from "ETA". ETA has factories all over the world, including Thailand... Don't think of Swiss but think of the maker of the movement. Same as Honda is not really Japanese if the Honda is made in the USA or Canada?? It's still a Honda. So the question is, does the ETA watch have a real ETA inside. The answer is certainly "Yes". Is it worth the extra $80? Consider that we are talking about a handwind simple movement, if the A7750 - a chrono and automatic with many complications - is a good quality movement, then the simple Asian 6497 handwind has to be good as well... Why not invest the $80 into your Asian movement and have it serviced? You would be much further ahead... RG DSN has a reputation for "best out of the box PAM" on the market. the simple 6497 movement will be just fine and the 7750 works will for chrono movet watches. i am thinking of getting his PAM29 GMT A good member on this board told me his rule of thumb when buying replica watches - "Buy the Asian version and if in time you decide want to keep it ...upgrade it to a Swiss movement. If it's not a keeper you've got less outlay and easier to sell on in the trading forums" Good luck FGD like the thought process - good simple advice Edited April 2, 2009 by prince458 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photon Posted April 4, 2009 Report Share Posted April 4, 2009 (edited) When I asked DSN if his Swiss version is really Swiss, he told me '100% Swiss'. I knew this was inaccurate as all the bridges must have been made somewhere in southern China. But, anyway I got his Swiss version and found it's real as it's a 18000 BPH version (you can count the beat by the ticking sound). I could be wrong but, most of the Asian Unitas movements beat at a higher 21600 PH. One may still think that the Asian version can be detuned to a lower beat but, I don't think DSN's business is that slack. Edited April 4, 2009 by photon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athan Posted April 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2009 Guess what??? The watch (Swiss version) has been ordered from DSN! He already sent me pictures, of the actual(?) watch that I will be receiving! OK, I have to admit that the pictures are very low res and the watch is actually looking like a piece of turd! (a glowing piece of turd if I may) I'll keep you posted with updates. I'm sooooo aaaaanxious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grilly Posted April 7, 2009 Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 Thanks for the great thread. I'm about to send DSN $430 for an ultimate 111h and this thread was exactly what I was looking for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
athan Posted April 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 7, 2009 If you want to be informed about my order and how it turned out just click below: http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?s=&...st&p=644066 Thanks, Athan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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