I bought a case.......

[Brightight]

.... from Stormtooper4, and here's what I did with it!

Early James Bond Rolex Submariner

The case is actually a GMT 6452 but I believe is otherwise the same as the 6538 Sub case. It has the period correct 'coin edge' bezel -

The case was aged a little. The dial is a standard no date dial with the depth marking removed, the remaining writing coloured to look gold and the entire dial and markers aged, then sprayed in clear satin lacquer. I couldn't remove the 'Swiss Made' on the dial but I can live with that even if it is not correct. The movement is a 2824 I bought damaged and repaired. The hands are gold ETA fit, again aged. The crown, which will be replaced when I can obtain the correct 'Brevet' crown (if ever!), is a Rolex 'Generic' part from Cousins which of course is not marked. The crystal is a high dome plexi. I obtained a No 19 Tropic plexi but it didn't look right according to the pics I have, so that is kept for a later project. The insert also came from Cousins and was aged a little. The strap, of course, is a black and dark grey striped Nato.

[freddy333]

A valiant effort & your vintagizing efforts have paid off in spades. To the man on the street or average (non-collector/WIS) gen owner, the watch looks like an old watch.

However, I think you started off with the wrong base components for a vintage Sub & the watch contains too many inherent (not easily repairable) flaws to be worthy of such inspired vintagizing work. Although there are numerous variations of early Sub models, the relatively few people who would know about or appreciate a vintage 'Bond' Sub will easily ID this watch as suspect because of its flaws, which you may or may not already be aware of (& decided to live with). These are the most obvious problems -

• the case is too thick for a vintage CG-less Rolex (Sub or GMT)
  
• the bezel & bezel insert/pearl are incorrect for a vintage Sub (but the bezel (not the insert) is correct for a 6542)
  
• the metalized dial is inappropriate for any vintage Rolex (only modern models (mostly with sapphire crystals) have metalized index markers or pearls)
  
• the incorrect crown you already noted
  
• the hands are a bit too short
  

[Brightight]

Thanks for your comments, it's nice to have an expert's view. I was working from http://www.vintagesubmariner.com/gallery.html, the first two pics the 6204 and 5508, both of which appear to have metallized dials, though that may be just the pic, not that I had any real choice unless I heavily modified the dial a lot further which might have been a mod too far. The case and bezel was the closest I could get. I know the insert is incorrect but again, difficult to obtain the correct thing and as most pics of vintage watches show, inserts have been changed in the intervening years, at least that is my justification!

I never expected it would be good enough to fool the experts and of course seeing macro shots or studying with a loupe, the flaws are even clearer. However, considering this was done on a budget, the whole thing cost me less than $150, and was done entirely with rep parts, I can live with the flaws! This is only my second attempt at vintagizing, so I'm still learning big style.

[freddy333]

No, the index markers on these dials do not contain metal surrounds. What you see is dial paint. In the 50s & early 60s, Rolex used to outline the index markers on their dials & some of them can sometimes appear like metal (especially as gilt gains a patina with age), but they are not. You can probably see what I am talking about better in this picture

I got that you were doing this on a budget, which is why I thought you did such a good job on the vintagizing. But I think you are underestimating the obviousness of the inaccuracies of your watch, as these problems can be identified from a good distance away & without the benefit of a loupe or magnifying glass. Of course, only those who know what a vintage Sub is will know. But, then, only those who will know would even care or appreciate a vintage Sub. Sort of a catch-22 situation.

[Guest carlsbadrolex]

Regardless of the errors in the watch, you did an incredible job with the aging. Its honestly one of the best Ive seen.

Congrats and wear it well. And when you have the opportunity to pick up better parts, do another one!

[cyberfox67]

However, considering this was done on a budget, the whole thing cost me less than $150, and was done entirely with rep parts, I can live with the flaws!

My congratulations !!!! While looking at the pictures and reading all the ork you have done and pats you replaced I tought you spent very much more than that !!!! Well I would be mote than pleased to live with those flaws, in my personal opinion you did a great job and a very nice watch. Enjoy it and wear it well,

[StormTooper4]

Very nice indeed, valiant effort and looking very good. Nice to see that it all came out so well

ST4

[TeeJay]

It may not be 'text book perfect', but it's a very nice project in its own right Out of curiosity, how did you remove the depth marking from the dial?

[Ronin]

Considering your budget $150... WoW

Please share more details on your aging/vintagizing. Are you a bleacher, coffee/tea stainer, bezel sander, etc. I love to hear the how behind the pics. Any before pics?

Good job,

-Ronin

[Brightight]

Thanks to all who have viewed and commented.

Freddy, thanks for the pic, that makes it very clear. However I cannot see it will be easy to pick up a rep dial with that level of detail!! Incidentally the main purpose for embarking on this project was to experiment further with vintagizing methods and to provide myself with a daily beater (I'll post pics of my first attempt, a beat up DRSD in a new thread) so the inaccuracies are really of little consequence. In additon the chances of running into someone who recognises the inaccuracies of this watch at a distance are remote to say the least. There would be more likelihood of this happening with a standard rep. It is great to have your feedback though, I have learned some new things and will hopefully be able to able to utilise this knowledge to make the next project a little better.

Tee-Jay, the depth marking was polished out of the dial using T-Cut (car polishing product, slightly abrasive). It required careful use of masks and even more careful rubbing!

RoninQ, sorry I have no before pics but the pic below shows a watch with the same dial I obtained (with feet to suit ETA) -

As for vintagizing, I have for a number of years had a small guitar business concentrating mainly on restoring vintage guitars, so am quite used to vintagizing techniques, albeit on a larger level, and have a stock of chemicals, stains, etc. For this watch I used light fast metallic dyes/stains, and the insert was bleached. The dial, after work completion was sprayed wth a satin finih clear acrylic lacquer.

[TeeJay]

Tee-Jay, the depth marking was polished out of the dial using T-Cut (car polishing product, slightly abrasive). It required careful use of masks and even more careful rubbing!

Ahh, thanks for the tip I've previously used toothpaste to buff up an acrylic crystal, would you say T-Cut was more abrasive than toothpaste, or might that also work as a rubbing compound for removing dial print? Or, if toothpaste was less abrasive, might that even be a more forgiving medium to work with?

[chubbchubb]

I think you really did a great job on this watch. Most first attempts at modding end in ruined watches.

[Toadtorrent]

Great job. It looks excellent. Thanks Freddy for the comments so we know the differences. Remember folks...Freddy is one of the most outstanding vintage Rolex experts around...so his knowledge and comments are to provide guidance if accuracy is your goal.

If you're going for the right feel, and an amazing budget. KA-CHING!! You win!

[Brightight]

Ahh, thanks for the tip I've previously used toothpaste to buff up an acrylic crystal, would you say T-Cut was more abrasive than toothpaste, or might that also work as a rubbing compound for removing dial print? Or, if toothpaste was less abrasive, might that even be a more forgiving medium to work with?

That's a question I don't know the answer to. All I can say is I use T Cut and an electric buffer to put the final polish on guitars finished in nitrocellulose lacquer, and that's after going up to about 8000 grit with Micromesh (which is used for polishing aircraft acrylic window panels) so it is fairly gentle. And you have to ask yourself - will a dial with a nice white smile be convincing................. And you can get T Cut in Halfords, a bottle will last years and years (as long as you don't use it on your car!) You can also use Brasso but that is even more gentle than T Cut. Probably very good on acrylic crystals as a final polish.

Thanks all for your comments, all I will say is thank goodness the world is not full of Freddies, I wouldn't dare go outside the house wearing this watch if so, but thank goodness there is one on this forum, that level of knowledge is incredble!!

[TeeJay]

That's a question I don't know the answer to. All I can say is I use T Cut and an electric buffer to put the final polish on guitars finished in nitrocellulose lacquer, and that's after going up to about 8000 grit with Micromesh (which is used for polishing aircraft acrylic window panels) so it is fairly gentle. And you have to ask yourself - will a dial with a nice white smile be convincing................. And you can get T Cut in Halfords, a bottle will last years and years (as long as you don't use it on your car!) You can also use Brasso but that is even more gentle than T Cut. Probably very good on acrylic crystals as a final polish.

Thanks all for your comments, all I will say is thank goodness the world is not full of Freddies, I wouldn't dare go outside the house wearing this watch if so, but thank goodness there is one on this forum, that level of knowledge is incredble!!

I guess I'll just have to give it a try, and, if it doesn't work, move up to T-Cut

Text book perfect or not, it's still an awesome project build If anything, it's things like this which I find interesting, as it's an historical anomaly (aka an aged item from the future ) I would absolutely love a watch thus vintagized, the only thing which I wonder about though, is how strong the lume would remain... I need a watch to have good lume so I can see it at night, and I have a feeling a vintaged watch might not meet that criteria

[freddy333]

I think toothpaste may be too coarse, but any final polishing compound made for plastic or high gloss automobile finishes will also work

As long as you follow up with a satin overcoat (which hides your 'work')