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Corgi -- you have been very kind and helpful...i appreciate it...i am fond of these VCs... your post has me looking at them all...i contacted Narikaa and am lined up with him...most of these three watches are available from other dealers - but i know the QC can be spotty... the VC classic chrono is avail at watcheden and they have been good to me...my VC Jubile came from them and it's now my fav...they have the one advertised as "guilloche" for $198 delivered to US...not sure of the price and haven't shopped around much yet... the VC Toledo pix you sent is great...thank you...do you know a source for this besides Narikaa...(i just want to check out pix and price)... i am seriously considering trying to strike a hat-trick and buy all 3...adding in the Retrograd... quick question on the Retrograd...are they all made by the same factory?...do you know?...this watch's caseback opens (i can't recall the name for this)...some dealers don't show it open...for example, watcheden has this one for less than $100usd and doesn't show it open...i will ask them, but like i said, sometimes this becomes a challenge...from the pix, it appears to have the "hinge" so it probably opens... let me know your thoughts...and once again, my sincere thanks... (quiet day here in snowy Syracuse,NY...received a foot of snow yesterday...wife/daughter are baking holiday cookies, my 2 boys are stirring somewhere...and i'm checking out VC's as i clean up my oldest son's laptop of virus/spyware/malware...what a life!)... thanks...R

Hi...i googled what a guilloche dial is - which means i kinda/sorta get it...i am checking out VC white face watches...some of the watches have a nice "textured" design...of the ones that have a "textured" design, some dealers advertise using the term "guilloche" dial...i have seen what appear to be identical watch dials, with one advertised as "guilloche" and one not...so my question is: what makes an dial "guilloche" and another not?...might they be the same dial - and it's a dealer approach... here's an example...I am looking at a VC classic Chronographe... watcheden has 21179 advertised as "guilloche white dial"...lemania movement...attached picture with brown leather strap...watcheden_VC_chrono_lemania_guilloche.bmp watcheden has 11420 advertised as "white dial"...lemania movement...attached picture with black leather strap...watcheden_VC_chrono_lemania.bmp dearwatches has 11333 advertised as "white dial"...asian 21j movement...attached picture with rolex3u watermark...(this watch is approx $100 usd less than lemania movement...worth it?!...hmmm) all 3 of these watches appear to have a "textured" dial...i know if i ask the dealer, this discussion could go round-and-round... so how can you tell?...are they all the same?...do they diff if the watch is made by diff factories?...is there a difference is detail?... thanks...R

Corgi -- re: Toledo 1952...does this watch have a "textured" dial -- it's tough to tell...your picture looks to be of a champagne colored dial with YG...is this a watch you own?...this watch also comes in white dial and YG...what are your thoughts on color combinations?... others that have this watch and are reading this post, please comment, as well... thanks...R

Corgi --- Thank you very much...very much...i really appreciate the information and moreover, i appreciate the advice/recommendations... I really like the VC models...i actually was drawn to the Malte Retrograde first...but then i discovered the 1755 Jubile -- and decided on it...it is amazing and very good looking...very nice size, great detail...unique quality look...i do very much like the simple face of the Chrongraphe, too...very classy and clean...the Malte Retrograde has now taken a backseat to wanting the Chronograph... You are right about the Toledo is was looking at...i have seen the Toledo 1952 many times and will heed your advice...I like this watch in gold...I am not sure if this watch was made in rose gold or just yellow gold (both in genunie and rep)...I am leaning toward a RG version, but am a little concerned that it would REALLY stand-out...and that YG would be more the norm...I welcome your comment/opinion on the preference of gold color... I like the Chronographe and the Malte Retrograde in SS...The Toldeo 1952, to me, would like great in rose or yellow gold... Lastly - not all these come with deployment leather bands - which i prefer...do you know where or if Narikaa can source them... I have been in contact with Narikaa on a watch search...does he have a gallery?...i will email him as to pricing, etc...I assume you recommend him highly and that he gets good quality watches... I have no idea how many factories produce the VC watches -- but i want a good quality versions... Thanks for your help and let's stay connected... R

ummmm... 1) i am wearing a VC 1755 Jubile and it's amazing detail...for less than $100 USD... 2) most of us do not socialize in a circle where anyone has the financial resources or the watch knowledge to know it's not real... 3) my "collection" has both sport, dressy, fun watches...to me - that's what this "hobby" is all about...

thank you...where can i get this kind of information...is there a guide or pictorial history "article" somewhere?... any idea of the year this was current in?... looking at this in rose gold...is the rust problem something that was on most of these watches...rose gold, ss, etc?... a sincere thank you...it's always great to learn about these...i appreciate the help... R

I am looking at this watch... http://www.tt88time.com/index.php?ma...roducts_id=657 And would welcome anyone who knows the detail history of whether this is a rep of a real VC watch, year, etc...there's a newer version "toledo" out there, but this one is supposed to be a "vintage" toledo... Also would welcome comments on it...what do you think of it?...the movement, detail, etc?...I think it looks very classy for those formal occasions...and would mate perfectly with my VC 1755 Jubile... Not to completely naive, but the spelling of "automatic" on the watch back casing is spelled "aotomatic"...that has to be a typo, right?!... Thanks -- R

Mr. TT - you're right, my friend...it is supposed to be about fun... a lot of folks have already read this thread, yet no replies - besides yours, that is... certainly we all are connected with this "hobby" b/c it's not ALL about "telling time"?!... so i say, why not celebrate the "fun" aspect from the "serious"... woo hoo!........lol... )and for those serious folks, i do have an sfso and a skyland to project my majestic status in life!...rep, of course... enjoy...as i will.... R-

I am smiling b/c i decided to buy myself a "fun" christmas gift that wouldn't break the bank...A quartz version Super Avenger w/ UTC brushed SS with white dial...has a skyland look bezel; which looks great and obviously not the one the Super authentic comes with...but then again, this isn't authentic...and in brushed SS, skyland bezel, quartz, etc, etc - i'm allowed to live in a fantasy world! I've always wanted a UTC bracelet...ever since I fondled my Holy Grail on a Paris business trip in the early 1994 -- a titanium Aerospace , italics numerals, lume, two-tone with UTC...someday...yeah, right...have 3 kids to get thru college first!... Anyhow -- I stumbled upon an $88 kinda/sorta Super Avenger, 49-50mm, with UTC - quartz at watcheden...i have purchased from watcheden before and recommend them...a Hublot big bang -- and am now waiting on an automatic VC Jubilee 1755 SS...they answer all questions promptly and the watch arrived well-packed, etc...back to the $88 watch...anyhow, a brushed SS Super that has a white face...i'm getting the white face b/c i assume there's no AR on this and it should be less noticeable...lol...yeah, right...like this watch is discreet?!...i find that the Super with polished SS is far too blingy for my tastes - so the brushed SS tones it down a lot...the bezel, however, appears to be a Skyline Avenger version...the pearl and the numbers are definitely Skyland version...the authentic Super only has 15, 30, 45, 60 numbers...and the skyland bezel, as we all know - has numbers in 5 multiples and riders at 15, 30, 45, 60... i found some pictures of an older quartz Super Avenger, white dial w/ UTC - which i am attaching...i am also attaching a couple pix from watcheden...the watch i just bought appears to be an updated version of the older model in the pix with an updated, wrongly placed, but better made, skyland version bezel -- with an "ok" looking pearl (many of the cheaper chrono avengers and super avengers have blobby pearls... when i eventually get the watch, i'll try my hand at some pictures... Thought I'd share this with you all for comments...and seriously, for $88 -- which includes shipping via EMS?! - to the USA, how can you beat it...it's just a fun watch -- a mammoth one!... Enjoy....R sa_18470_3.bmp sa_18470_4.bmp sa_18470_5.bmp sa_18470_7.bmp sa_18470_8.bmp sa_18470_6.bmp

I just received my grey dial skyland with rubber strap today!... v3 from Peter...i very politely requested to Peter to ensure that the lume dots be centered and thanked him for being "extra" thorough on QC...he said he would so -- and lo, and behold, the watch is remarkable!... all lume dots centered -- as best i can see...and seriously, the great pix on this site exaggerate the "flaws" due to magnification...to the naked eye, these flaws are almost impossible to see...the AR is great, too... thanks to this post and Lani's gracious and patient pm's with me, along with the many others who have shared pictures and opinions on grey versus black, rubber vs. leather, etc...i have to tell you, i am completely blown away with the contrast and texture of this watch...the grey dial and black rubber...the texture of the rubber "breitling" strap with the brushed and shiny case...the bezel and case...the shiny 15, 30, 45 and pearl points on the brushed bezel...this watch seriously all comes together because of the lush mix of textures...it's like my lexus -- sporty elegance...the texture of it all keeps the blingy case in check... Lani -- personally, thank you...Mahalo nui loa!... to all those deciding on this watch and debating the dial/strap combo -- i am thrilled with the grey/blk rubber... my white dial steelfish sfso with dark brown moo-croc band, is happy to have a mate...although, this grey watch is gonna getta my attention for quite some time... still have figured out the camera thing yet, but when i do, i'll post pix... my qc on Peter's v3: lume dots - great - check!, AR - great - check!, working and keeping time - great - check!, detail/finish - great - check!, microscopic little B engaved on bezel - great - check!, caseback and case finish - great - check!, rubber strap - great - check!, pearl/bezel alignment - great- check!... but just when i thought i would be completely satisfied, "fleed" posted some pix of this watch with bead blast...grey dial and black rubber...if you haven't seen that yet, find his recent post...very sexy and adds to the overall texture thang!... R-

Looks grrrrrreat!... can someone explain the bead blast process?...where can you have it done?...approx cost?...where can you have it done?...i live in the US... R-

teenagers never sleep...

hi all... psyched that i finally pulled the trigger and ordered a GREY dial skyland with black rubber strap from Peter (watchstation)...gotta have two breitlings, at least!... i am wearing my sfso now, with dark brown leather strap - deployment buckle) and loving it....(bought that one from Robert @ T4D)... special thanks to Lani -- for being ever so patient and kind to answer ALL my questions and provide advice on grey versus black dial...as he advised, and i so agree, the grey dial seems to be most versatile -- rubber, leather, bling band, etc... when life settles down a bit on the kid front - with various fall sports (soccer, volleyball) in playoffs - i'll try to test my hand at photos... many thanks to all of you for the comments, help, assistance in this ever growing addiction!... R-

@ mickey --> i actually was doing that when i typed my last response of hand 2 head...but with the usual house noise, it was tough to count them... @ andreww --> thanks for your comment; the orig post pix has a decal on the rotor; mine has no decal and is gold...attached is a picture i found via google of the dg4813...mine looks similar to this one, except the gear in the bottom of this pix is solid on mine and not "spoked/open" like this one...mine is closed and a darkish color...

(holding watch to ear and trying to count).... and assuming that you hav a vision of a newbie with a quizzical, clueless look on his face?!...

this is my virgin automatic...so i have nothing to compare it, too... (and can't splurge on another watch yet...next month) R-

the skyland and the steelfish, like fine women, look sexy in leather!...

hi all... i just received my new asian sfso...it's the one selling between $150-$200 USD: AR, sapphire, same case, etc... i have been trying to get information from the seller (t4d - RWI) on what the movement is... this watch is as gorgeous and well built as the excellent shots/posts that many of you have made...very pleased... i got the white dial and a dark brown moo-croc deployment buckle strap...it's on that one...excellent combo...sporty elegance!... anyhowwwwwww -- this is "advertised" as "asian high beat movement"...and all inquiries on what the movement is and whether it's 28k or 21k have not been answered...i am a definite newbie on automatics (but learning!)...as this is my first one... my asianfish came with a loose back...i opened it and the movement looks exactly like the one in the picture attached... i am curious and have researched this as best i can...to no avail --- yet... somewhere - i'm snowblind from the research (lol) - i saw a youtube video of a eta fish and an asian fish...the afish was running at 21k and the swissfish at 28k...this watch's sweep looks more like the 21k... any insights/info on how to tell or what the enclosed picture is would be appreciated... R

Lani -- thank you for taking the time for creating a great post... anyone in the market for a skyland -- especially the black or grey -- will certainly benefit from this comparision... you have definitely helped me with my decision..... ............going with the grey...for all the same reasons you (and others) have stated - especially the versatility and it being less "common" as TT states below... well done!... R-

Gonna buy a Flat 6 in quartz 2nite...Figuring i'll wear it for casual occassions...General at home and/or casual work... I am strongly leaning toward the gray dial, but am definitely drawn to the red one...The red one is louder, but then again, this watch is meant to draw attention...There are many white, black and gray faced watches -- but red seems to be more unique...Not sure what other "sport" watches look this good in red... The gray looks great with the black center subdials...i like the combo of the black strap, gray dial, black subdials...and the numbers seem to jump out more than on the black face... So - for those porsche flat 6 owners/fans; pls feel free to weigh in on color dial preference and why?...btw - the black is nice too...but i think if i don't go for the red - it's definitely gray...black is third in my preferences...but only because i'm open to the sharp red... Gray, red, black...and why?... Especially looking for those that have thoughts on the red face and what "competition" is out there in the sports watch world...my just get the red because there's not a lot out there... Anyone with a red one and having pix, pls include... thanks and enjoy...R

Greg -- I've been stalking yours and am readying to pull the trigger on the white one...but before i did so, i thought i'd ask about a RG version...i seriously read up on your comments/pix - along with others...very nice watch... thanks...R

Does anyone know if they make or who carries this watch in RG rose gold?... I am ready to purchase this in white SS case, from josh, but before i do so, i thought i'd inquiry on this in RG... Thanks...R

i just posted same over in chieftang's forum: Chieftang, et al -- I am a newbie and have recently received my first two watches...a hbb lite and a navi chrono avenger - brushed ss - 43mm case...the chrono avenger was purchased with a utc bracelet...yes - i know this is a flawed rep (been learning/reading and pm'ing andreww, etc), but i always liked the looks of this watch so i figured it was a good kick-around one to wear... here's my question...it obviously has no AR on the crystal...the crystal is slightly domed -- which results in slight distortion (or whatever it's called) when you look at the watch from a steep side angle...so here's my question: i know the AR will cut down on glare/reflection/etc but the distortion still has to be there, right?...so would i be better off to just replace the crystal with a new flat one with AR versus having the current domed one AR'd?... i love chieftang's work and wouldn't hesitate to send him the crystals (main and utc)...but i'm just not sure if i will get the effect i want with this domed crystal...(even while typing this and looking at the watch i see distortion b/c of the dome...(typing on a laptop)...anyhow, the question is what to do with this domed crystal... if a crystal replacement is something to consider, is there someone that any of you recommend?...i live in new york, USA... thanks...R

nice....i'm excited to receive it...i got mine with the UTC band...can't wait!...thanks for excellent wrist pix!... thanks for the excel

i just ordered a chrono avenger ss, grey dial with UTC bracelet...it should be here (upstate, ny, usa) late next week...i'll let you know how i feel about it then...the spec says it's a mineral crystal...it's brushed SS... got it at watcheden.com i've always liked the look of this watch and the utc bracelet - so i went with quartz simply for cost...i know it's not accurately built...and for $108USD... i also ordered an hbb "lite" here that someone else purchased and it's very close...very... and for those purists out there, i did go the route of a SFSO, white dial, SS and a dark brown leather band via T4D - who has a newer version with AR and sapphire...at a great price... not a bad week -- ordered my first 3 watches...and learning oneheckuva lot from all of you...great hobby...definitely addictive!... R-