babola

Dr...have a look at DSN's latest 001/004/040 "T-dial". Not bad at all, IMO...if you don't mind a slightly wrong font of the T SWISS T text. DSN is currently the only Luminor historic sausage rep dial maker that got that overhang on number 6 finally sorted, both on his latest iteration on T-dial as well as L-dial. The Luminor and Panerai dial text is great to boot on this dial.

Yup, the bezel had a slightly lover profile as well, it makes me think the xtal could have been also a bit thinner on V2 to compensate for the lower bezel. Basically it was a poor cousin to V1, not even close. The sub dials are also wrong size on V2. But in general the differences between the V1 and V2 Daylights are sometimes hard to confirm and quantify until you see them side by side

Here's a photo that shows both V1 and V2 Daylight chrono cases. The V1 was known as 'EL ultimate', the V2 as 'standard' cartel. IMO, calling a V1 "EL" is incorrect since not only Eddie Lee had it on offer but also the cartel guys like Josh, Andrew and Angus at the time, as well as Honpo, a dealer from Japan. PAM196 V1 on the left and right, V2 in the middle. Check the bezel width and angle between the two. Also the "V2" came with thicker numerals and recessed chrono subdials. PAM196 gen dial is flat, so that is incorrect. Hope this helps a little. cheers!

They're definitely off, mate. Not by much but enough to make a difference between the 7750 and 7753 DWs. Gen 7753 DW comes in just over a millimeter wider diameter than gen 7750. Also, the teeth onto which a date change cog catches are placed differently on 7750 and 7753 DWs, on 7750 they're aligned with the middle of the number, on 7753 they're placed between the two numbers. Due to this difference the date cutout on the 7750 dial isn't only placed more towards the middle of the dial but also a little lower than on the 7753.

A7750 V1 aka 'old-school' with non-working quick-set pusher at 10 o'clock...keep it bud!

Wow, great watch mate! One of the best DSN dials ever to come out of his workshop, for sure! cheers

Psst Mickey, you will awaken the monster BTW, you wouldn't be brave enough to take the CG apart by pushing the pin from the underside to show us a construct of the CG/lever etc, would you? Thanks! cheers!

Sorry mate, doesn't look good. The level of finish in general and rough engraving is only some of the tells. The text embossing on rubber underside is also off, both by thickness and the shape of the font. There's been about 5-6 different Pam rep rubber iterations I've come acros during the last 5-6 years. Some were made harder some softer and more pliable. Sometimes it's really hard to tell rep vs gen rubber strap, the latest one that comes with A7753-Daylights is one example of a great replication almost impossible to tell by the naked eye, but yours is quite off, sorry

Looking good Mickey! Mine is still on its way...enjoy!

True...I'm on a correct numbering side though, as the Kxxxx/1000 belongs to a Daylight with white dial (PAM251), and absence of logo doesn't bother me much

24mm at the lugs to 20mm at the clasp, just as gen :-)

Not trying to hijack this great thread...but I'm just off the IM with one of the dealers who confirmed the factories have currently run out of correct casebacks for PAM236 and will be using Kxxxx/1000 for the time being until the new Kxxx/500 casebacks with sequential numbers will be made. ETA is now about 2 weeks time. The PAM196 also comes with the wrong Hxxx/500 casebacks, and the correct batch (Hxxxx/1500) is already in production, so no sweat...these are also ETA 2 weeks. Also, it is confirmed the correct PAM250 Kxxxx/2800 caseback WILL NOT be produced. However, the rep PAM250 is simply a PAM236 with the leather/rubber strap...so no drama cheers!

Unfortunately, not quite. The old-school (V1) case built for Asian pseudo-7753 (made by simply transfering the threecompax gears) had a 10 o'clock pusher mounted in the wrong place. It was also non-functional one as well, i.e. it wouldn't function even if you had a quick-set date lever sitting behind it, ETA7753 or A7750. It is unlikely even with these new modified A7753 that the pusher would be in the right place. However, good modders and watchmakers found their way around this issue, although not as straighforward as it seems. Zigmaister could add his 2 cents worth to this discussion here, as I believe he has done at least few of these conversions in the past. cheers, b

R, it basically comes down to a difference in old-school cases between the one built for ETA7753 and another for A7750. It will work if you have the former, and won't on the latter. IMO, the old-school A7750 cases have not much value if you're looking for a transplant. The ones built to house ETA7753 mov't are gold. As far as the 196 dials go, IMO these latest ones based on A7753 are the best and closest to gen, bar the incorrect DW cutout placing. Old school 196 dials had many smaller issues now rectified on this latest batch, like incorrect and thin txt font, chrono subdial markings (10, 20, 30) in wrong places, too long lume marker at 6 o'clock etc. We need a good review of the new 196 dial to confirm this but what I've seen so far these new 196 dials are the bees knees, IMO cheers, b

Thanks mate, yeah...Vacuum promised us few days ago he's onto taking one apart and doing a comparo with a gen ETA7753, so I guess we're all ears cheers!

R, do you believe they used A7750 mov't as a base, or started with all new ebauche for this latest A7753? How complicated would it be to transfer the date change from the set lever operated by the crown to the quick-set at 10 o'clock on a A7750 instead of starting anew? I mean, they already transferred the gears for tricompax on A7750 to create a pseudo-A7753 in the past, all they needed was to rejig the date change mechanism. Or is this all one big brain fart on my side?

Very nice work, asimplefarmer! So it appears this time they replicated the bracelet as close to 1:1 as possible, so the bracelet is 24/20mm? Major improvement over the older rep bracelet that was available only in 24/24mm. thanks!

+1 While the products from the workshop of Guido Panerai and sons from that era are considered cool today, what Decima Flottiglia MAS represent, isn't. Then again, it's your ankle mate after all, not mine...

Don't believe so mate, as the old-school A7750 196 had a non functional pusher at 10 o'clock, as well as its position was slightly off. Not without some serious case re-work, sorry

Wow - kudos to you and your watchmaker especially...that plexi looks like it was meant to be for that Egi! And the dial is also one of a kind...love the whole watch! cheers, b

That thought also crossed my mind, however his dial is matte black instead of jet black with many other small issues, so much so that I will most likely keep the original EL dial on my 196. I have an ETA7753 already, thanks The new cartel 196 had it been made to fit the 'true' 7753 would have made a perfect choice for EL's ETA 196 mod, almost impossible to tell from the gen. Oh well... I am still planning to get one of these new 196, wrong DW placement or not. The only thing to fix on them would probably be just the lever...and I'm sure that mod would be a doddle for most of us.

True, there are few of us however that were planning a dial swap between the new 196 with the older EL-type we currently have which are powered by ETA7753. That's unlikely to happen now...that's all, really. EL/Honpo dial that came with ETA7753 188/196 is good but the new one is slightly better. I agree about these new Daylights being the best executed ones so far bar old-school Honpo/EL. The case-set cut and finish is unmatched, the dial finish and print also, and I'm sure the CG lever will be just a matter of shortening the crown stem a tad to lessen the pressure on a PVC/rubber lever insert and give the lever a little bit more 'breathing' space. cheers, b

M, IMO this one is by far the closest of them all rep Daylights, as nice and as 1:1 as the latest 236/250. DSN's latest was so close had it not been for slightly off dial numerals (4 and 8 in particular) and skinny Luminor Panerai text. So far I am unable to fault the new 196 dial, wouldn't mind hearing from others on this, though. However, the fact remains, none of the dials and DWs on these new Daylights could be swapped with the genuine ones or installed on a gen ETA7753 mov't. By my rough estimates and some preliminary measurements (from macro photo shots mainly) these dials will fit the older rep Daylights with A7750 perfectly. Vac said he's just about to take one of those new "A7753" apart and report back to the boards...awaiting in anticipation and wish he'll prove my theory wrong. cheers, b

Can't blame you mate...I totally share your sentiments. I wish if someone who has received one of these new Daylights takes the CG apart and show us the construct of that dodgy lever.

Mov't origin and quality is still open for discussion, jury's out on that one. In the meantime: http://www.1-pc8838.com/0000pn19601-196h-daylight-chrono-ssle-black-asian-7753-p-9232.html cheers, b