Devedander

I would think cleaning the gold parts after each wear would help... Also wrap your wrist in saran wrap so sweat cannot get to the watch.

You can try asking dealers for things you like too... I know ken has sourced some good things for buyers in the past...

Send it over my way and I assure you she will never know.

I thought the B&R thing was already gone over with movement pictures and such... is that a different version you are talking about?

Good to see you got on here and good to hear what you say... this and putting your money where your mouth is in your other post goes to show a lot of good things about Silix in particular, but what is possible from dealers in general.

Have you read the last few pages?

Thanks for the advice and I fully expect it to be cheap... I am one of those people that despite knowing you get what you pay for, always has to be burned by a cheapo first... I think it's actually better... you don't appreciate fillet until you gnaw on some shoulder steak For now it stores my watches (I really need some space cuz my 12 watch box was overflowing) and does ok... when it starts crapping out I will start tinkering with it... I do a lot of tinkering and digging around in guts (if you saw a picture of my workbench... well you would be scared to say the least ) so I am ready for what comes and happy now!

Will do... overall the quality feels pretty cheap (the "glass" is plastic... eventhough the shipping box said "Fragile Glass" ) I am watching to see if either of them fail or get really noisy over time... I won't be surprised if they do... As for bigger bands I could easily see that being a problem... I have 6.5 inch wrists so it's a pretty good fit for mine, but much longer and I can easily see how they would sort of dangle out. Also the pillows are a bit odd... I am thinking in the future I will look for one with the "squarish" pillows rather than these "pillow shaped" (for lack of a better term) pillows... That all said I think it's decent for the price and if it holds up decently well I will be happy until I get a better one someday. My buddy bought a dual winder from this guy, motor died in 2 days, the guy sent him a new motor so let's see where this road leads

Picked one of these up on the bay... decent for just under $100 I guess but not super nice... pretty quiet with the lid closed though. Anyhow, some crappy shots but I thought I would put them out there just for the heck of it

I would take off the stickers for fear they will fall into the movement... that would be the major suckage...

Nice!! I like the hands... something about that style (is that art nevou?) always makes me just stare... Does it keep good time?

Now question is can you spot if they are reps or not Get a camera with zoom and see what you can pull off

Let's not forget Silix chimed in and put their money where their mouth is...

TJ the only part I was referring to as noob bashing was the part you discredit him due to low post count and assumed lack of knowledge of the subject... the irony being you yourself did not know about the B&R fiasco that has appeared in this thread (and others) in the form of a huge picture of a really ugly cheap movement. 1:1... if we were doing drafting then I would say ok, it's just size. But outside any other limiting standard, I think it's pretty safe to say most people think of 1:1 as measureably equal in all (non explicity excluded) ways. I personally don't own any watches I know to be glass instead of saphire, that will have to be up to someone else to clarify. That said I don't know that none of mine aren't glass... why? Because I don't have a diamond tester and the fact they MIGHT be glass scares me from doing the screwdriver test... the irony I was sure I was paying extra to not have to fear that sort of thing. As good as it gets? I don't doubt that... but it sure would be nice if it stayed that way and kept moving in that direction wouldn't it? I think this type of post is an important step in ensuring that it does just that. As for dealers lying and not labling their reps as reps... well to be fair that is a sticky point as I can see how doing so might bring a lot of heat on them. Is it reasonable to expect they tell us a movement is an ugly asian copy? Yes. Is it reasonable for them to put a big sign on their forehead that says "come get me I am selling fakes"? Not so much so... Basically I do look at it from both sides, and I see where they have their hands tied on certain subjects or reasonably don't want to risk it... but when it comes to labeling parts of a watch things they are not, things which you could charge a premium for (and then do charge that premium) that aren't in any way related to a necessity of doing business then that's getting bad. I do believe Silix when they say they do not misslead and they are still around. And people please, stop bringing up the language thing... if this was river or king or something, ok, but several of our dealers have proven they have VERY GOOD English skills and I don't think any of the things being referred to could really be counted as nuances of the language... they are in the rep watch business... they know their stuff... it's silly to say "could you say it in Chinese"? If it was my business to sell watches to Chinese people and I had demonstrated strong Chinese skills in areas like answering emails and responding to posts on forums... I would think I could. I don't want a lynch mob either... I TRULY appreciate the luxury we have of being able to send our money to these guys with the expectation of not being ripped off. But I suspect it's very much the same as pug... the water is getting pretty deep. I honestly hope the movement issue is a good sign... a sign that factories will be cranking out ETA copies after ETA stops selling to the general market... and if these early and somewhat crappy looking movements are the first few steps in a long journey... well then that would be a silver lining. But that's a big if and it still does suck for some people now...

TJ I hate to say it but pretty much your whole post was based on some shaky logic... Noob bash? Low post count? That's a bad way to judge someone as often as it is good... I am not saying I don't think his post was a bit out of line, but it's no excuse to lower your own standards. I have never believed you have to actually be screwed by someone to demand they shape up. I mean, would you suggest that he, now knowing the truth about the B&R, go ahead and buy one so he has a "right" to talk about the issues? Have you ever been murdered? Well then better not speak out against violent crime. Ever been raped? Better not speak out against a rapist unless you were actually his victim. Would you stand up against a man who beats his kids even if he has never beat you? see how that doesn't work? Sythetic saphires IS saphire... it's the same stuff, same chemicals, same parts... just minus naturally occuring flaws. Glass is NOT in anyway saphire and the slope has to be pretty slippery to get those two terms anywhere near each other. You know what, $1 is really close to $.99 and that is really close to $.98 and that is really close to $.97... so tell you what, you give me $1 and I will give you nothing and in the end they are both pretty close so we can call it a wash. Slippery slopes are very much the core of why this post finally came along. First off, it doesn't matter who else does what where, we are talking about certain specific people here and now. That's along the same lines as saying "well our dealers aren't screwing us like goreplica does". It's true, but it's nether here nor there. If you tell a cop "hey, those guys over there are speeding more" do you think he will say "well gosh... then I won't give you a ticket afterall"? Exactly. Because one does not bear on the validity of the other. As for what 1:1 means, it means that for every 1 over here, there is an equal 1 over there. Unless it is specified (ie TTK does use it specifically in one section of his description like case size) it means any and everything must have a 1:1 ratio: 1:1 case size means everything pertaining to the case and it's size are equal. 1:1 crown means everything pertaining to the crown is the same as the other. 1:1 Timex Watch means for every part of the timex watch, whatever it is being compared to has one that is measureably the same. I don't know how anyone can see wiggle room in something so exact as 1:1... it's about the most exacting statement I can think of... As for what ANY of the dealers are sitting back and wondering... what's going on is the damn finally burst... there are not enough fingers to plug the dyke and now a lot of people who have been biting their tongue have stopped biting. Look at the dealer review section... it's not human to be that perfect... something was amiss... you can't honestly be surprised that eventually something like this comes along... for those who have done their best to keep there noses clean, I think they aren't wondering or worrying too much at all... It happens in all aspects of life... camels, backs and straws... we see it every day... I don't see why it's at all surprising to see it here.

I have never been sad because I thought my $300 watch was going to be as good as a $10,000 watch... What does make me sad is when my $300 rep is really only as good as a $100 rep...

Quite...

As per my post http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?s=&amp...st&p=174887 and it may have been updated since this document but I haven't been able to find evidence of it nor reason for it... http://www.ftc.gov/opp/jointvent/madeusa/ftp/usa/047.txt

http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?s=&amp...st&p=143596

Hmmm... you are a more gracious man than I... I would be [censored] if I paid $888 for a $250 watch as long as I was certain I did... can't you go back over your math and add it all up to find out how much you really paid? Also did you try contacting WU to see if they can give you info on how much you sent by using the MTCN number? One would think they could... I mean they have to be able to find out how much to pay out the guy on the other end using just that number...

Just to follow up on TVTs statement, to be deemed "Swiss Made" the movement must have 50% of it's value manufactured in switzerland. Thus on a $50 movement, replacing one screw with a $25 Swiss manufactured screw is enough to make it "Swiss Made". Not saying that's how it necessarily is, but it's possible.

As far as I am concerned "My dealer told me so" is passing the buck... selling oregano for weed and saying "well the guy I bought it from said it was weed" still gets your ass kicked. I mean once or twice or something I can see... like PT (I think it's PT) when he found out his "solid gold" stuff wasn't really solid gold he came clean and fixed it. But dealers who know, (and there is no excuse that they don't after it's all over the forums and The Zigmeister gives the low down) and keep going on using the same "hmm... well I was told..." by the same guy who told you wrong before... a dozen times... This whole "don't blame the dealer, pass it along down the line" thing is silly... especially when you consider many of our dealers are about as close to the factory as you can get (I am not convinced some of them don't partially or wholely own the factories that they get their watches from). In the world of adults and business "he told me so" doesn't cut it in my book. It's certainly better than intentionally lying, but it's a long way from good. As for dealers not speaking English well... some of them defintiely don't, but some of them definitely do. And again, if it doesn't matter what makes it go around, then sell em all at asian 21j prices... and heck, trade me the movement from a gen LV sub for a 28k beat asian eta copy from River... it will go around and tell you what time it is, and it will look exactly like the gen since the case will still be gen. No deal? Hmmm... why not? It's all the same right? You think a dealer would care if I ordered a watch with an ETA movement and sent it back for exchange but I dropped an asian 21j in there before shipping it? I mean, it still goes around, still looks the same... no problem right? @The Zigmeister thanks for the info on basics in spottig an ETA... for those of us who aren't The Zigmeisters I think this is going to be hugely beneficial.

I am not a WIS and I doubt this is a watch anyone is likely to be getting for their collection (even the Smithsonian displays a rep), so I hope I am not speaking out of line here but as far as a watch I would want for more than aesthetic value, I would love to have one of these As much as I agree with the whole "soul" of a mechanical watch, there is something to be said about the first consumer level stab at the heart of the mechanical world... And one that IS attainable (kind of) that I think would be a nice addition to any collection is also a Seiko Almost a full circle, a meeting of the realms of the quartz and mechanical worlds...

Yup... same with firepay and neteller (which I use to fund my actual gambling)... Cash Advance fees (becuase in all fairness you really can cash out cash from these places, so Visa doens't want you cirucmventing their rediculous cash advance fees this way) if you are lucky enough to have them let it happen at all. Many banks (mine noteably) will not let you fund gambling sites at all. It comes from people racking up thousands in losses, then claiming lost or stolen cards to avoid paying their debts. I too an screwed on MB, which is a shame since it's a decent fee to load and some dealers offer a nice discount for using it. Googlecheckout would be a sweet way to pay for reps, especially considering they are offering $10 off $30 at lots of stores lately

Does anyone else think the guy selling this is the boss from "The Office"?