?gen? Dial what do you think?

[Gorilladame]

Hi guys!

As you might remember a really close friend of mine spent a real bunch of money to go for a gen 1680 and came across a nice offer for a meter first red sub.

so today he received the watch and now it is my turn to verify his dial, as he (as always) got the money and I got a bit of skills.

So I went to the local official rolex watchdealer to hear his opinion.

There I talked to the one watchsmith specialized in vintage sport rolex (he was wearing a vintage GMT, what was making me trust him a bit ;-) )

He looked at the outside and at the dial(from the outside) and told me that he is suspices about the dial, because the red writing was printed over a white printing.

So I told him that red-over-white is quite normal for a mark I or II dial. then he told me that the lume is to low, so I told him that the tritium shouldn´t lume at all after 40 years.

And as you can guess I toke the watch back after that and decided to ask people who really KNOW vintage watches and this is when you get to play with me!

So things I know about the watch:

1. non hacking movement: OK

2. Open 9 and 6 on the datewheel: OK

3. the bezel can be turned in both directions (I am not sure if this is OK)

4. came with two receipts of rolex revision in 1989 and 1998 with matching serial: OK

5. serial falls into 67-69: OK

6. trilock crown: OK if exchanged during service

7. structure on the index at six( see pic#3): I don´t like...

8. jumping date: I think that´s OK , not sure

9. font on the insert: I have no idea

But I can´t say anything about the dial. For me it is nearly too perfect with matching hands and pearl.

So please, please, please with sugar toppings, tell me what you think about that dial.

Sorry for my crappy pics, but I am just too stupid to take nice ones...

and the case:

[ubiquitous]

Plenty of gen, meters first reds have had the red printed over white...

e.g.

[Gorilladame]

Plenty of gen, meters first reds have had the red printed over white...

That´s what I told him! and that´s also what disqualified his whole opinion on the watch ;-)

[FxrAndy]

looks like a m first thin font red over white, or at least the experts at double red seadweller call it something like that

Their pic

so it looks gen to me apart from the lume, it looks like i relumed it

[Gorilladame]

yes compared to the pic it really looks good. one-o-one only the lume on the index at 2 looks crap.

So can you clarify those things:

3. the bezel can be turned in both directions

8. jumping date: I think that´s OK , not sure

9. font on the insert: I have no idea

Next thing is that I read somewhere is that rolex normally note on a repear receipt that the dial was with red writing.

on my friends reciept is written:

- HAU ROP Chron.Sub.

- Dial # 53 black-lume

Does anyone know what HAU ROP could mean?

[FxrAndy]

yes compared to the pic it really looks good. one-o-one only the lume on the index at 2 looks crap.

So can you clarify those things:

3. the bezel can be turned in both directions Yes correct

8. jumping date: I think that

[ubiquitous]

Bi-directional bezel is correct. The vintage 1680/5512/5513/1665, etc. all had bi-directional bezels (no ratchets, clicks, etc).

Date should be slow set; i.e. you have to go two full revolutions of the dial with the hands to get the date to change over to set it (no quick set like the ETAs, etc).

Insert looks correct to me. In fact, it looks a lot like my gen fat font:

[Gorilladame]

Date should be slow set; i.e. you have to go two full revolutions of the dial with the hands to get the date to change over to set it (no quick set like the ETAs, etc).

Right! I can´t set the date by turning the crown, I have to turn a whole day forward.

But then it jumps right at 12 p.m.

I always thought quickset ment that the date jumps at 12 p.m. instead of going slow in the time between 11:50 and 12:10

[FxrAndy]

quick set refers to the ability to set the date via the crown

[deltatahoe]

there is a great thread here about red subs, which is VERY informative about all the different versions, including details on how the f in feet should look for the various versions (it is different for different versions).

one other thing to look at for these subs would be to see if the caseback is engraved with a date inside -- both the the quarter (i-iv) and the year (69) consistent with the serial number. i can't remember exactly when they stopped engraving the casebacks, but i'm almost 100% positive that a meters first red sub is from an era that should have an engraved caseback.

hope this helps

deltatahoe

[Gorilladame]

there is a great thread here about red subs, which is VERY informative about all the different versions, including details on how the f in feet should look for the various versions (it is different for different versions).

one other thing to look at for these subs would be to see if the caseback is engraved with a date inside -- both the the quarter (i-iv) and the year (69) consistent with the serial number. i can't remember exactly when they stopped engraving the casebacks, but i'm almost 100% positive that a meters first red sub is from an era that should have an engraved caseback.

hope this helps

deltatahoe

Thanks for the hints, I tried to open the caseback with my non-original caseback opener but this caseback is really hard to open, so I will let the watchsmith make it for me...I don

[alligoat]

The bezel insert looks fine, it is a later lumi service insert. A vintage tritium insert would be more appropriate, but it's a minor deal. Also, a tritium insert would have probably turned brown by now- the pearl that is.

I'm fine with the dial myself, looks good to me.

[Gorilladame]

Thanks guys, so I will tell that this one is a keeper, but not a wearer ;-)

[alligoat]

Heck, I'd wear it- for light duty that is! Cocktail parties and other more gentlemanly pursuits. No dishes, swimming, yard work, or construction projects around the house.

[FxrAndy]

God have you seen the state of the lume on this and the coment on the post was

Here a red directly that has been service by Rolex NY and got a extreme relume ;- )

I would say a shit relume

[Gorilladame]

I saw the lume but I don't like the mountains of lume on the dial. So I would prefer to go with less lume and the original heights of the dots...

[ubiquitous]

The bezel insert looks fine, it is a later lumi service insert.

That's not a lumi service insert. Service inserts have thin fonts and markings.

The insert on the left is a lumi...

[FxrAndy]

I saw the lume but I don't like the mountains of lume on the dial. So I would prefer to go with less lume and the original heights of the dots...

it is not just the mole hills of lume, but the unevenness of it all, my GW has slight mounds now but nothing like that,

I just showed my 11 year old daughter (who has a bit of watch making experience) and she thinks that she could do better than that on the first try! At least she can paint within the lines since she was 5.

[freddy333]

Not sure about the insert (probably gen), but the rest of the watch looks gen to me.

[Gorilladame]

btw: HAU means: Herren Armbamd Uhr (mens wrist watch)

and ROP : Rolex Oyster Precision

;-)

[flex]

The watch looks perfect!

very nice..

Flex

[mjmj]

Its a beautiful watch. It has the right amount of the aged look.