How to deal with sellers and acceptable expectations if problems arise

[Admin Team]

The team here at RWG has noticed over an extended time now that many new members are struggling to have either good dealings with sellers or a reasonable understanding of a fair process should something go wrong.

We have therefore decided to lay down some guidelines based on the many years of buying and selling experience that can be found in the RWG Admin team.

These guidelines are intended to be broad enough to cover both buying from a trusted dealer and member to member trades.

Therefore this guide will be broken into sections looking at all aspects of buying.

Buying

• It is extremely unlikely that a senior member or trusted dealer will set out to scam you. Yes it can happen, but not by anyone who wants to stay a part of our community. For this reason you should enter into transactions with these sellers with the mindset that you are going to get what you paid for. The number one cause of grief usually comes from the buyer entering into the deal with a suspicious mind. If you look hard enough, dig deep enough you will eventually find something to complain about in any trade. If, on the other hand, a genuine issue does arise and you are both on good terms then sorting that issue will not only be easier but a great deal quicker and more pleasant.
  
• It is the buyer’s responsibility to make sure that they know what they are buying. The seller will list the item with pic’s, price and full disclosure but the buyer should not assume that the item has some feature or function unless they ask the seller directly.
  
• Once the item has been paid for and shipping confirmed the seller’s responsibility ceases until the goods arrive. We often hear complaints how a seller has gone silent once the item has been bought. As long as the item is not long overdue then the seller does not have to keep a running commentary going with you. He sold you goods, not added you to his Christmas card list.
  
• Buyers need to check with the shipper &/or their local post office to see how long shipments take & what each of the entries in their tracking form means.
  
• Buyers need to realize that sellers have lives (outside of RWG), too & may not always be able to respond immediately to every email, PM or phone call made by an over-anxious newbie.
  
• Buyers should learn to be patient & limit communications to no more than 1/week.
  
• Buyers should never inundate a seller with repeated, threatening &/or lengthy diatribes. These rarely produce a positive result.
  
  
  
  

  Selling

  
  
  

  Prices are mandatory for all sales by members or dealers!

  
  

  • RWG is a global community and as such hosts many different languages and customs. Just because the seller knows what he has stated he should not simply assume the buyer understands. For this reason it is crucial for the seller to include as much information as possible, but in clear concise terms, into their sales thread. Dealers should have pinned instructions on how to buy in their sales area, stating any special terms or conditions. Remember it does not matter how long you have done this for, the noob still will not know.
    
  • A seller, both dealers and members, must always remember that things can go wrong and when they do they need to have a policy on how this can be fixed. Yes a private seller may add a clause stating all risks are the buyers but it must be written not simply expected.
    
  • RWG hosts a member policed sales area. This means that members do have the right to point out issues that they may see with a sale.
    
  • A seller has the right to ask any price he wants for his merchandise but he has to expect the members to question that price if they feel it is unrealistic.
    

  When problems arise

  [*]The very best offer you can get is to repair or replace. Once this offer is on the table the buyer should have no further qualms.

  [*]Shipping will always be a contentious issue as the buyer feels he has already paid the price on purchase, however issues are rarely the sellers fault, most in fact come from shipping. The buyer must always be aware of the sellers shipping policy or be willing to negotiate if an item needs to be returned.

  [*]Again senior members and trusted dealers will want to work with you when issues arise as it is their reputation on the line, however it is often the buyer attitude when dealing with issues that can turn the whole thing acrimonious.

  [*]Paypal disputes, often end poorly for both parties, so they should be used only as a last resort ie: when there is a serious problem with the sale and the seller has ceased communications or the seller is conducting a scam (a watch or other item that arrives damaged is NOT a scam!).

  [*]Buyers should only contact Admins in the following situations: 1. After receiving their item and there's a problem & the seller refuses to make it right, 2. If it has been more than 1 week since the last communication with the seller afterf the buyer reported a problem with the item, or 3. To report their being included in a global scam.

  Buyer beware

  One final note: when buying from a member who has very few posts or has just joined, it is advisable to be a little cautious before proceeding. Begin with a PM and ask some simple questions. Ask for a picture of the item with a tag showing the date and members name. Ask the seller if they are a member of any other forum so you can at least get to know them and check their reputation before proceeding with the transaction. If a seller gets defensive about the inquiries then there is every chance you are facing a scam and it is advisable to just walk away.

  The above can be just as true for a buyer so the same precautions should be taken.

  RWG provides you, the member, the safest possible platform for a happy buying/selling experience. However it is not always foolproof and members must always remember caveat emptor...’Let the buyer beware’.

  RWG Admin Team.

[panermaniac]

Very good information and advice... thank you!

[the_rymeister]

Thankyou for taking the time to post this.

[maxman]

This should be a sticky...very well said T

Thanks for taking the time to put this together.

Mike

[HartDoc]

Thanks for the info and thanks for the advise via PM on my issues

[TeeJay]

Fantastic advice all round

[jackagi]

Love this forum. Great information and very useful.

[Judy Lee]

Useful info. Thank you for sharing.

[mark44]

Hi friends,

I am new here. I need to know that when I want to purchase a watch from a website, how can I check it is authenticated or not.

[maxman]

Hi friends,

I am new here. I need to know that when I want to purchase a watch from a website, how can I check it is authenticated or not.

Just make sure you stick to the trusted dealers here. If something dosent sound or feel right...bring your concerns to the forums/communities attention.

Welcome.

Mike

[Knackeringham]

Ordered my watch two weeks ago (not disclosing who). Order confirmed but not yet received. I feel confident it will arrive and I haven't asked not even once where my order is. I am such a good NOOB!!

[baadsha88]

i received QC pics today from andrew. amazed at how fast the service is

[Efishant]

just got a Rolex Sea Dweller from Trusty Time. I have bought several watches from him and Silix over the years. Virtually every watch has had some small problem. Sinse I run a watch store I have a watchmaker to deal with all the minor headaches. But this time the watch was bought for a friend that asked me to get him a nice replica. The watch didn't work. Brought it back to me. I had my watchmaker look at it. He took apart the auto winding mechanism and found that a reducing wheel had worn out due to excessive use and lack of oil ! 

Andrew told me the warranty was voided becasue I took it apart!  Now I gotta spend my time and money to fix it.  Not a huge deal but a legit aggravation!  This still begs the question; how did that wheel wear out. Andrew didn't want to address that.  So, I ordered a wheel from Otto Frei and I will fix it myself!  Ultimately though.....ya gotta ask yourself where these movements come from. I've heard all kinds of theories.  I gotta believe this one was pilfered from some service facility in China somewhere. Then they threw it in a Rep without makin sure it was ok! 

Well, I feel sorry for you guys that certainly must have the same problems and have to monkey around with shipping the watches back for service!  Oh, by the way..... the movement in my Planet Ocean is marked RADO!  I bet Rado has a facility in China somewhere too!  Do ya think those movements ended up in a rep factory legally?

[Efishant]

Can't touch this........Can't touch this...........     Ha!

[woof*]

Efishant

The movements used in replicas are often pulls from older watches.

It's not uncommon to get a dry, dirty or worn movement.

Experienced rep buyers will include a service in the buying price and send the watch off to have it serviced when they get their watch.

The dealers overseas are not the manufacturer, but rather middlemen in the deal. Usually they go pick up the watch after you pay. They have no idea of what they are going to get movement wise. They also are not going to tell you the above. Just figure a service when you purchase a rep and you will save yourself frustration and stress.

Welcome to replica world

[Efishant]

So , ya buy a watch ....and expect that it's gonna have problems? Well, I actually bought a few that I didn't have any problems. My Bell&Ross has been great.  However, in the real watch world...I charge a minimun of 350 bucks to do a routine service on a fine vintage piece. I get guys coming into my shop all the time with their reps. I feel bad for them but it doesn't make any sense for me to even open one up when it costs more to fix than what they paid for it.  A guy came in the other day with a Hublot. I told him I'd have to completely dissassemble the watch to find out what was wrong with it and I'd have to charge him at least 200 bucks for my watchmakers time. And that doesn't include the repair. What if a part is broken or the thing needs an entire cleaning. On an Automatic I gotta get 450 bucks! He paid about 380 for it so it doesn't make a lot of sense!  I am lucky I have a full time watch maker to hold my hand. Andrew knew what was wrong with my watch and he must deal with these problems all the time.  He's gotta take responsibility even if he doesn't want to be totally contrite! Bottom line...it is a criminal enterprise. We, all look the other way as long as everything goes well. Any hassle eliminates the deal for me. I am a really busy guy. Time is money baby! When it becomes a hassle and there is only bigger hassle as recourse ( like sending it back ) ....that's where I get off the boat! 

Edited September 6, 2013 by Efishant

[fraggle42]

450 bucks for a service of an automatic?

What?!?!

I can only assume your shop is in Beverly Hills or somewhere mega expensive, cause if you get mugs.... sorry, customers happy to pay that, well, then there's one born every minute!

[Chrononna]

those are great, thanks for posting, much appreciated!!

[Fonz77]

Great info! Thanks

[juliehan]

useful to me！

[Jessej]

What about in the event of package seized by customs?

[torobravo]

The dealer should re-ship or refund

[ticklescrumbum]

I've had a rotor jam on me, sent it back to Andrew, and it was repaired and back on my wrist in just over a month.  Even gen's don't offer that level of service.  My top tip would be simply to be polite.  Good manners will get you a lot further than screaming, shouting and throwing your toys out of the pram

[Truman]

Thanks for information. 

[Gedsta]

I purchased an Omega Planet Ocean Seamaster from Joshua (PC) about 18 months ago. When I first received the watch. The automatic winder screw was missing, so I had to send it back. It was missing on the pics that Joshua sent me, but I didn't notice it. Eventually I received the watch back and all was good initially. However within a few months the Bezel numbers\markers faded considerably and the red writing on the watch face is disappeared and is now silver. This experience has put me off a bit from purchasing another replica watch. Is it typically normal for a replica watch to deteriorate so quickly with less than average usage?