JoeyB Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 After a few months of working with Ken at Rafflestime we have an affordable small arrow GMT hand for the 6542 and early 1675. Ken has them listed on his site and on Ebay, and sizes to fit Rolex/ETA 2893-2, DG movements, and the Asian converted 2836/2846 movements. $25 usd. http://www.ebay.com/...=item231f005593 http://www.rafflesti...1675-GMT/Detail 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zeleni kukuruz Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Amazing!!! Great work me J Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woof* Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 When you say Asian Converted, would that mean swapping the stock pinion/cog for another? The hand looks fantastic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zeleni kukuruz Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Freddy333 will say it looks fejk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted June 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 When you say Asian Converted, would that mean swapping the stock pinion/cog for another? The hand looks fantastic "Asian converted" refers to any 2836/2846, Swiss ETA or Asian, that is converted to GMT function. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeeJay Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 "Asian converted" refers to any 2836/2846, Swiss ETA or Asian, that is converted to GMT function. Thanks for the clarification, I might consider one for my 6532-inspired project in the future Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akira Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Sweet! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alligoat Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Cool Joey! Appreciate your efforts, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I hate to be negative & it may just be your pic, but is the bottom of the triangle on your tip perpendicular to the red wand & is the triangle equilateral (all 3 sides the same length)? Compare the shape of the tip to this gen (note, especially, the angle of the bottom of the triangle as it intersects the red hand) There are a number of aftermarket sellers who have been offering small GMT hands for a couple of years now, but the tips are the wrong shape (the gen tip is always equilateral). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted June 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 The arrow base or bottom line width is 1.3mm, the length from the base to the point/tip is 1.5mm. Not equilateral. I looked at many, most were this measurement, but most could have been aftermarket. It is copied off of Classic Watch Parts $65 hand. I found the very tip to be over or past the chapter ring, which I've seen on many genuine 6542s, and took 1500 sandpaper and a few gentle swipes to correct it. I didn't know if it was my dial or the hand. I wanted to get Ken's factory to make them to fit the gen Rolex and ETA 2893-2, 1.8mm, and capable of being broached to 2mm. They couldn't do that. Like most aftermarket parts a little tweak can be expected. And as always, perfection costs more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I hate to say it, but I think you may have copied an aftermarket hand. I am not sure why, but there is some variation as to where the tip resides over the dial (in sales brochures, the tip ends at the chapter ring), but the bottom of the triangle is always perpendicular to the wand of the hand & all 3 sides are an equivalent length. Here are a few more gens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted June 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Quite possible. This is on Ebay right now: There are many more that look the same as those you posted, the same as posted here, and a few that are a solid arrow with no lume or hole for one. And, as stated, some go past the chapter ring while others go up to the chapter ring. So, it could be modeled from an aftermarket or from a genuine hand. As with so many things with 1950s and 1960s Rolex, the factory consistency is non-existent. I think the issue is, is it acceptable. If so the price Ken asks at Rafflestime is quite reasonable and that helps the members here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 If your price is comparable to NDT or CWP, it ought to be fine since both of those are aftermarkets as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted June 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 The price from Rafflestime is $25 usd. It's not comparable, it is less than half. And it is an aftermarket as well. And it is possible, as with the Perspex insert, that Rolex used more than one supplier for the hand. Here's a few from Stefano's website where the arrow head is longer than it is wide. Most of them there are not equal sides of the triangle. freddy, the more I look, the more I think there were variants from Rolex themselves, maybe by year. I think this hand is a good one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zeleni kukuruz Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I think its very hard or impossible to find a gen small thin gmt hand. 9.5 out of 10 i think are aftermarket in the watches sold now days. And i think that there was no variations of this hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 The price from Rafflestime is $25 usd. It's not comparable, it is less than half. And it is an aftermarket as well. And it is possible, as with the Perspex insert, that Rolex used more than one supplier for the hand. Here's a few from Stefano's website where the arrow head is longer than it is wide. Most of them there are not equal sides of the triangle. freddy, the more I look, the more I think there were variants from Rolex themselves, maybe by year. I think this hand is a good one. As usual, I think you did a tremendous job getting the hand made, but, unfortunately, it is not on par with your insert. The tips of the GMT hands in all of those pics look exactly like mine - equilateral triangles with the flat, bottom side exactly perpendicular to the red arm wand. From what I have seen, this appears to be 1 of those areas where Rolex was consistent. You might consider having someone (that is not a member) post a pic of your hand on VRF or TZ to get some additional opinions. Watches like the '42, unlike most other vintage models, are all about the details. I agree with Zeleni that it is difficult to locate gen arms & most of what I see listed on ebay are aftermarket (often from generally reliable sellers). But, unfortunately, in this case, there is not alot of wiggle room, if you know what I mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alligoat Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I borrowed this pic and it looks like an equilateral GMT hand But it's certainly not the kind of detail I'd worry about. The PT GMT hand w/o any lume is worrisome for me though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I notice that every one of these pictures has a chapter ring dial. Is that the only proper fitment for a small-arrow 24h hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Every '42 I have in my gen picture archive (or that I have seen elsewhere) has a chapter ring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanuq Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I notice that every one of these pictures has a chapter ring dial. Is that the only proper fitment for a small-arrow 24h hand? Is a small-arrow 24h hand properly fitted to a non-chapter-ring 1675 gilt dial? Edit: never mind, I just saw Tom Vox's picture of his 1.3M 1675 with the small arrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest zeleni kukuruz Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I notice that every one of these pictures has a chapter ring dial. Is that the only proper fitment for a small-arrow 24h hand? Is a small-arrow 24h hand properly fitted to a non-chapter-ring 1675 gilt dial? yes it is. i have a pic somwhere! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Is a small-arrow 24h hand properly fitted to a non-chapter-ring 1675 gilt dial? Just for added redundancy, in the case of the 1675, yes This is only a guess on my part, but the varying lengths of small GMT hands may be due to their being made to fit 2 dials - 6542 (OCC) vs 1675 (SCOC). Also remember that, although you can swap crystals between a 6542 & 1675, the date will be off-center in the cyclops because of the differing dial sizes. If you also swap GMT hands, that would explain why some terminate at the chapter ring & others cross it. And with all the musical chairs parts swapping that goes on either in the hands of owners & collectors or nonchalant watchmakers, it should not surprise anyone to see varying arm lengths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeyB Posted June 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 The pics I posted from Stefano's site don't look equilateral to my eye. I think the base or bottom line is perpendicular, and might be a camera angle issue. I may have confused things, the hand is not 'mine'. Like the 6mm Brevet + crown, it is Ken at Rafflestime's. I only provided the request for both, pictures, nagging, measurements, nagging, advice, nagging, and a bit of nagging. And in all honesty I think the hand on par with Classic Watch Parts and NDT's hands, and at less than 1/3 of their price. And again, like the crown, a little tweaking might be in order. The last two 'genuine' small arrow GMT hands on Ebay sold for $875 usd, and a set for $1275 usd. The last genuine 6mm Brevet + crown sold for $300 usd. At $25 for the hand, and $31 for the + crown, and a bit of 1500 sandpaper, I think Ken accomplishes what many of us need, an affordable alternative to gen parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimster Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 As usual, I think you did a tremendous job getting the hand made, but, unfortunately, it is not on par with your insert. The tips of the GMT hands in all of those pics look exactly like mine - equilateral triangles with the flat, bottom side exactly perpendicular to the red arm wand. From what I have seen, this appears to be 1 of those areas where Rolex was consistent. You might consider having someone (that is not a member) post a pic of your hand on VRF or TZ to get some additional opinions. Watches like the '42, unlike most other vintage models, are all about the details. I agree with Zeleni that it is difficult to locate gen arms & most of what I see listed on ebay are aftermarket (often from generally reliable sellers). But, unfortunately, in this case, there is not alot of wiggle room, if you know what I mean. I just took a look at two of mine which came from Rolex and they are equal lateral. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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