borz Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 I wouldn't be surprised if that explorer turns out to be the same thing everyone's favorite ripoff crew is selling for $400+. Prices have gotten absolutely ridiculous lately, a simple three-hand Chinese fake with clone movement costs more than a gen Hamilton. Heck, a modded one with some gen parts often costs more than a used gen, especially for some lower-end models. As for the "but a gen costs 10x, 20x, 30x, etc" argument, it makes no difference whatsoever - you're still getting a Chinese fake that's no better than a cheap Invicta, regardless of the name on the dial. $250 or so for a functional rep is fine, since that's what a fancy-looking Chinese auto invicta or something along those lines would cost, but over $400 is just plain ridiculous. PS: is anyone really naive enough to think our "dealers" buy $50,000 watches and destroy them during replication process? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damir Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 I have ordered a Submariner today, but i think the german customs will intercept the watch...If they do i will search for an uk member here which recive and reship my mail from china. Why a member from here? Cause the most mail forwarding services are to expensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tframo Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 We will see. I used my cc so if it doesn't show up I have some buyer protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 Just some points to remember.... RWG... Seller must use actual pic's of the watch Seller must give buyer QC pic's, Seller must take all customs risk, Seller must accept returns of faulty items Seller most likely has had numerous PP disputes and scams costing a lot of money. Seller must also offer good after sales service. Off site... Give me your money I send a watch...end of story. Ken 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MaMaZunG Posted January 17, 2015 Report Share Posted January 17, 2015 OMG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borz Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 But, are all those alleged services (i.e. questionable QC pics, warranty no one takes advantage of since no one wants to wait 6 months to send the watch to china and back, etc) really worth an extra 200%, assuming the guy above gets the same explorer dealers here have for $300+? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Yes actually they are, if a watch gets seized and dealer reships he has lost his profit already. Mind you I am not saying that some price gorging doesn't exist just that your on board dealers take much larger risks (cost wise) than off site dealers. If you buy off site and your watch is seized and then the 2nd one has issues what are you going to do? Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borz Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Wait a sec, so are you actually admitting that there is in fact a 200-300% markup on the watches sold by the board dealers, and the prices seen on aliexpress are in fact accurate? That's some pretty sweet profit right there - maybe 1 in 20 watches gets grabbed by customs and 1 in 10 is faulty, which the dealer has to make up for, but they are selling every single watch at a 200-300% markup. Not too shabby, if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damir Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 (edited) Just some points to remember.... RWG... Seller must use actual pic's of the watch Seller must give buyer QC pic's, Seller must take all customs risk, Seller must accept returns of faulty items Seller most likely has had numerous PP disputes and scams costing a lot of money. Seller must also offer good after sales service. Off site... Give me your money I send a watch...end of story. Ken Hey Ken, you are right that the service of the Trusted dealers is mutch better. BUT the seller on Aliexpress sen't me too Original Pictures of the Watch with actual Date on it. The Prices there are unbeatable. It must not mean that nobody will buy at TD's but i think the most here want only test the watches there. But i must say borz is right. Edited January 18, 2015 by damir Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 @borz I have no idea what the markup is on watches, I do not sell them what I am saying is that the boards TD's have good reasons to charge more. @damir without a forum to compare pic's how can you possibly tell if the pic's you were given are the actual watch QC pic's (providing it is just a date on a photo it is easily edited) or just the generic pic's they give to everyone who buys the watch? And again to both of you if an Aliexpress watch is seized I doubt he will reship a replacement, so how cheap is it if seized a second time? Please refrain from making off the cuff remarks like 1 in 20 watches is seized 1. It means nothing how many are seized and 2. there is no possibly way you can verify that quote. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opti Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 There is no mention of movements at all (simply that its automatic), I will be interested in the reviews when you receive the watches. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say they are probably 21J's with mineral crystals. If they are sapphire and a clone movement you guys will really be onto a winner! But we wont find out for at least another month if my experience of aliexpress postage tells me anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
importr Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 The price of reps has skyrocketed in the past year or two and with no real justification. Take a look at the latest Zenith rep. No real advance over an iwc 3777 rep but $150 more? For what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Yes the price has gone up a lot on softgoods too but these prices are going up at the point of supply. But like I said above.... Mind you I am not saying that some price gorging doesn't exist just that your on board dealers take much larger risks (cost wise) than off site dealers. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beachcomber Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 In all actuality I think the real question is are we paying too much for our gens? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
borz Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Yes the price has gone up a lot on softgoods too but these prices are going up at the point of supply. But like I said above.... Ken So, would you please be so kind to explains as to why a fake three-hand IWC costs as much, or sometimes more than a similar gen Edox or Hamilton? Cheap Chinese labor, cheap clone movements, cheap materials - sounds like greed to me, plain and simple. Heck, all the APs and Hublots that are in $700 range nowadays (don't tell me they're hard to make, some of the hideous huge invictas or other fashion brands out there are much more intricate, yet they still cost $100) - same price as a gen 7750-based Hamilton or other lower-end brand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicpimp Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Three things to think about. 1. On TD sites there are multiple HQ pics from all angles and details about the watch. On this aliexpress guy, two pics and no real details. It takes money run a website and man hours to take all the pics etc. Aliexpress/ebay/dhgate are free/cheap. 2. My brother runs a few market stalls selling electronics. High street shops gouge us just as much, I've been with him to buy stock from wholesalers. $1 iPhones leads being sold for $15 in shops, he sells them at $5. Even iPad mins etc. he got them brand new in box for about $200, shops sell them at $400 or more. But with the cables/leads/cases there is more than one factory or more than one quality. 3. You usually get what you pay for. There is more than one people making things of the same type, also there are 'off stock'. When I was in Turkey last year I saw many fake watches of many many different qualities. Some of the smaller stands had watches that were a bit 'off' the dial was slightly mis printed, something was rough or misaligned. The factory probably unloads the cheaply to a different supplier than their main guy. If you don't want don't buy, but also buyer beware and shop smart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 @borz I do not need to explain anything, this forum have been here for 8 years for one reason and that is to offer a safe and secure environment to the replica watch fraternity. There has always been those that are willing to risk their money buying from the totally unregulated off board sites, that is your personal choice but if you think you can shame the dealers to drop their prices then you are wasting your time. I have no idea why you think their markup (whatever it may be) is such a crime, normal retail is usually around 400% Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agentsmith350 Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Just looked at that website , The speedmaster shows a gen on all the website pics so I assume the same for all the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tframo Posted January 18, 2015 Report Share Posted January 18, 2015 Guys. My intention for making the test purchase wasn't to bash our td's. I Just wanted to see what $88 gets me out of curiosity. I have serious doubts that the quality will be anywhere near what our td's get us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
damir Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 my watch is shipped today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtguk Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 Guys I'm with tframo, I'd only buy from ali to see what turns up on my doorstep In fact I just received an order from Ryan (intime) this week, my first order with him to try him out too, very pleased with the service btw and got a great couple pieces from him, so I'm not giving up on our TD's @borz, I think your being a bit ott with regards to our dealers, yes pricing has gone through the roof over the last couple years but demand is high too, we want the best of the best reps on our wrist and seemingly we will pay good money to get them, the market dictates pricing imo none the less it's a good point to discuss though and as you know the subject comes up regularly on here and the other sites. I really don't see prices changing that much this year either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenTLe Posted January 23, 2015 Report Share Posted January 23, 2015 About the AliExpress watches, you'd better to give a look to this thread :http://www.rwg.bz/board/index.php?/topic/93772-This-is-what-I-ordered.--What-do-you-think-I-will-actually-get?-UPDATE!!! Probably there is better around but still... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tframo Posted January 23, 2015 Report Share Posted January 23, 2015 I saw that yesterday too. Probably what I'll end up getting but oh well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 24, 2015 Report Share Posted January 24, 2015 $600 for a stock rep is ridiculous in my opinion but for whatever reason I somehow think a TC sub (all rep parts) is reasonably priced. Doesn't make sense, right? However, it still boggles my mind someone wanting to spend $1600 for a 100% rep watch (including modding costs) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddhead Posted January 25, 2015 Report Share Posted January 25, 2015 (edited) Many of you are probably not familiar with me - I am an older member who used to visit here daily up until about 5 or so years ago. Much less so recently, in fact my visits over the past week or so have probably been my first in a number of years. When I first stumbled upon the old site, 12 or so years ago,I thought I hit nirvana. While I am hardly an expert in fine watches, I have always had an intense interest in them so this place was like gold to me. It offered great fellowship, access to real experts and an opportunity to learn a lot about a luxury commodity that has always interested me. Also access to great dealers who offered high quality products at very reasonable prices. I have to say, I am heartened to note that that fellowship and expertise still characterizes this site today. Not so much the great products and reasonable prices thing. My first rep (one I am wearing now in fact) was purchased about 11 or so years ago. It is an Eddie Lee PAM 029 GMT with a ETA 2892 movement. I think the price was in the neighborhood of $600 or so. It remains my best and favorite rep, and in fact one of my favorite watches period (I have since acquired some nice gens as well). In addition to being a beautiful watch, this thing is bullet proof. It keeps great time, and is virtually indestructible. In the years that followed I picked up many similar great pieces. Among my favorites are a 4th gen UPO, a 42 MM Bond UPO, a 2 tone Eddie Lee Sub,a Seadweller, and a BK modded noob LV sub. These pieces all run as well today as they did when I purchased them, and remain in my rotation. The common denominators? Bullet proof ETA movements the at were reasonably priced. Back than you could pick up a quality sub with a 2836 movement for $200-$250, a bit more for the modded pieces. It all went downhill for me when ETA movements became difficult to source. Some of the newer reps really look great but the asian movements are just not cutting it for me- in fact none of my more recently acquired asian clones work today. For instance, my last purchase maybe 5 or so years ago, was a gorgeous v2 Avenger which died maybe 3 months after purchase. I just find that prices are higher and the movements are [censored]. I came to conclude that unless you are a trained watch smith, and have access to quality ETA movements, it just isn't worth it anymore, and the golden age of reps is over. I will say that I am heartened to see that the fine fellowship, expertise, and sharing that always characterized this forum continues to exist today. This always was the best run and friendliest rep watch forum on the net, and my bet is is still is today. Cheers. Edited January 25, 2015 by eddhead 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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