JSebWC Posted August 25, 2018 Report Share Posted August 25, 2018 Recent pic up from another forum. Early 1016 or 5604 if you will. JMB VER 1 case aged with bubble back case back Brevet + crownRaffles chapter ring Swiss dial and hands - aged GS crystal Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrister71 Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 With the bubbleback is would be a 6610. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 6, 2018 Report Share Posted September 6, 2018 Such beauties! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSebWC Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 With the bubbleback is would be a 6610. Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkYes the case back and crown wouldn’t be exactly accurate but I believe it is meant to represent a later 5504 Explorer. Where those parts would be used. Yes didn’t build this piece. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 If y'all look at the profile shot above you'll see why I have to "relocate" the lug holes on the newer modified case. If I were to re-machine the lugs and drop the thru-holes in the same spot as the original dimples they would break out into the top of the lugs big time. I have had a couple folks wonder why I did this and it's always said that "a picture is worth a thousand words" so this looked like a good opportunity to 'splain it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 (edited) 3 hours ago, JSebWC said: Yes the case back and crown wouldn’t be exactly accurate but I believe it is meant to represent a later 5504 Explorer. Where those parts would be used. Yes didn’t build this piece. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Not sure either as the 5504 basically is a ‘poor-man’s’ 1016 with no COSC certification. Both models have different dials - and hands in the case of the Air King - but they share the same case construction and in some cases the same (1530) movement. As such 5504 models are not bubble backs but will rather sport the same flat caseback as their 1016 cousins. A couple of pics of my gen 5504 to illustrate the point: Edited September 8, 2018 by Lo' pix 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 Can't see pics... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 4 minutes ago, jmb said: Can't see pics... There you go J. As you'd have it a picture is better than many words to 'splain oneself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted September 8, 2018 Report Share Posted September 8, 2018 You betcha! Looks nice, I kinda miss mine... 😕 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 17 minutes ago, jmb said: You betcha! Looks nice, I kinda miss mine... 😕 I hear you! I would never part from mine especially now that the quotations of such pieces has gone through the roof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSebWC Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 Cool watch @Lo' I can see the differences. I was just basing it off the swiss SCOC dial. yeah I am not what the original owner was going for on my piece. I know the explorer based 5504 have the precision dials but I've seen Amsterdam Watch company and Ming Quy listing the with a SCOC dial So it would be to assume it was a service dial ? This one was sold on ebay for $21000 USD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 9, 2018 Report Share Posted September 9, 2018 Yup! The main difference between 5504 and 1016 regards dial and hands. 5504s did not come with COSC certification therefore, even the ‘3 6 9’ dialed version would bear ‘Super Precision’ markings instead of ‘SCOC’. At the time some ADs would offer replacement dials to their customers (since anyway the 1530 movement in those watches could be regulated to COSC specs exactly as their 1016 counterparts bearing the same mechanism); as such there certainly are 5504s (as the one in the picture you posted), bearing original SCOC Dials which, nonetheless are not the correct ones for that model. Just another ‘glitch’ in the vast murky world of variations on Rolex models making those ‘original-not-originals’ more palatable to collectors of one-off pieces. Now go figure which one got a replacement dial upon being acquired and which one just got fitted with a service dial later on.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spannerhead Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 (edited) My hybrid. Gen 14270 case , 1570 , ebay dial and I think gen hand set . Gen crown and super dome. 5504 also gen case and movement , dial and hand set from Phong, I'm having trouble getting the stem to line up , the dial seems to be too thick ! Sorry for poor pic . Another difference between 1016 and 5504 is size , the 5504 is a 35mm case , or 35.5 . Edited September 12, 2018 by spannerhead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 My hybrid. Gen 14270 case , 1570 , ebay dial and I think gen hand set . Gen crown and super dome. 5504 also gen case and movement , dial and hand set from Phong, I'm having trouble getting the stem to line up , the dial seems to be too thick ! Sorry for poor pic . Another difference between 1016 and 5504 is size , the 5504 is a 35mm case , or 35.5 .Nice pieces you’ve got there, thanks for contributing to this interesting thread with your knowledge.5504 Air Kings (such as mine) and 1016 both are 36mm watches. You perhaps meant the 5500 which diameter is 35mm and is usually fitted with ‘Precision’-marked dials (1520), as opposed to the ‘Super Precision’ (1530) marking on 5504s. Of course there where variations since the 1520 and 1530 movements would fit on both 35 and 36mm cases and, both watches can be found sporting ‘3 6 9’ dials (even with SCOC markings in place of the above mentioned ‘Precision’ and ‘Super Precision’)but, generally speaking, the above holds true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted September 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 The only out of the ordinary AK I have is a 34mm 5501 tutone made III 62 (cal 1530) with a poorly refinished dial. I got a Yuki explorer dial with goldtone letters and hand set for it but nave not put it together yet. Bought the Yuki dial because a genuine AK dial with gold markers is expensive and hard to find in today's market. Can not recall seeing a 5504 for sale at watch shows. Saw quite a few 1018 models, some had been converted to look like a 1016. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madasboot Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 I am more and more tempted to move into a 1016 project and all the info on this thread is highly insightful and useful. thank you (all) so much for sharing. best, M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 The only out of the ordinary AK I have is a 34mm 5501 tutone made III 62 (cal 1530) with a poorly refinished dial. I got a Yuki explorer dial with goldtone letters and hand set for it but nave not put it together yet. Bought the Yuki dial because a genuine AK dial with gold markers is expensive and hard to find in today's market. Can not recall seeing a 5504 for sale at watch shows. Saw quite a few 1018 models, some had been converted to look like a 1016.Hi Auto! You might want to try Chrono24. There are quite a few 5504 for sale in there right now, including a “refinished” dial from Min Quy I am more and more tempted to move into a 1016 project and all the info on this thread is highly insightful and useful. thank you (all) so much for sharing. best, M.Welcome to the club! I, as some others in this nice forum, have “1016 projects” which have been ongoing for the last 4-5 years. Once this kind of bug bites you there’s no way out, except that of going gen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madasboot Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Lo' said: Welcome to the club! I, as some others in this nice forum, have “1016 projects” which have been ongoing for the last 4-5 years. Once this kind of bug bites you there’s no way out, except that of going gen. Thank you Lo' My first vintage projects lasted more than 8 years before I could consider them done. The 1016 bug bite should have happened to me 12 years ago and half planet away... Any help or advice will be most welcomed! saluti! M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 12, 2018 Report Share Posted September 12, 2018 You’re more than welcome! As for the help, you will want to read all that other members, much more informed than yours truly, have been writing on the topic in this forum. You will find a whole lot of insight and knowledge. As I have suggested elsewhere you could use the search function and read all that LHOOQ, BLUE and ROLOJACK shared on their quest for the perfect 1016. You should also refer to the awesome JMB, a true Southern Gentleman and all-around great guy, upon which crafts most of the 101x builds around the galaxy are based (but please act swiftly because he’s been announcing his imminent retirement for the last 10 years ). Anything else, just ask. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
automatico Posted September 13, 2018 Author Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 "Hi Auto! You might want to try Chrono24. There are quite a few 5504 for sale in there right now, including a “refinished” dial from Min Quy." Thanks! I just now looked at them. They sure are high $$ imho. I'm a low $$ knave so I guess I'll have to stay with do-it-yourself projects. Chrono 24 is rolex ebay for Kings and Queens. Ha! I've been wearing the JMB project '1016' mentioned above for a few days after changing the 'Mary' folded bracelet back to the hollow mid link model because the later bracelet goes better with the flat top crystal. All that is needed now is to find a 7 hole clasp or find a 6 hole clasp in my parts with enough open space to drill another set of holes. Obscure details like this do not matter much at all but they are easy to do. I have another JMB '1016' project in parts with a dial, mvt etc but can not find it. I put it up somewhere so I would not lose it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madasboot Posted September 13, 2018 Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 11 hours ago, Lo' said: You’re more than welcome! As for the help, you will want to read all that other members, much more informed than yours truly, have been writing on the topic in this forum. You will find a whole lot of insight and knowledge. As I have suggested elsewhere you could use the search function and read all that LHOOQ, BLUE and ROLOJACK shared on their quest for the perfect 1016. You should also refer to the awesome JMB, a true Southern Gentleman and all-around great guy, upon which crafts most of the 101x builds around the galaxy are based (but please act swiftly because he’s been announcing his imminent retirement for the last 10 years ). Anything else, just ask. Thank you so much Lo’. Will surely do! best, M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 13, 2018 Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 "Hi Auto! You might want to try Chrono24. There are quite a few 5504 for sale in there right now, including a “refinished” dial from Min Quy." Thanks! I just now looked at them. They sure are high $$ imho. I'm a low $$ knave so I guess I'll have to stay with do-it-yourself projects. Chrono 24 is rolex ebay for Kings and Queens. Ha! I've been wearing the JMB project '1016' mentioned above for a few days after changing the 'Mary' folded bracelet back to the hollow mid link model because the later bracelet goes better with the flat top crystal. All that is needed now is to find a 7 hole clasp or find a 6 hole clasp in my parts with enough open space to drill another set of holes. Obscure details like this do not matter much at all but they are easy to do. I have another JMB '1016' project in parts with a dial, mvt etc but can not find it. I put it up somewhere so I would not lose it. You’re absolutely right in preferring low-budget diy projects to overpriced-mass-produced stuff. But imho what makes Rolex special is the infinite variety between one model and the next one, and also between individual pieces of the same model; all the more if you consider that this is the main asset on which the Rolex collectors market has been thriving for decades.As such, while I understand and respect your point, I always advise my friends against doing what I do (build Frankens that is), and rather go gen especially on lesser-desired references since these can often be had for relatively low sums, but might gain traction on the market thus acquiring worth. Back in 2009 (or 08, can’t remember), I paid approx $ 1.200 for a ‘67 7928. Nowadays that specific reference and build is over the roof and worth 5 times that amount. You just need to be patient and be able to put your ear to the ground to listen and learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmb Posted September 13, 2018 Report Share Posted September 13, 2018 On 9/12/2018 at 11:35 AM, Lo' said: ...(but please act swiftly because he’s been announcing his imminent retirement for the last 10 years ). One of these days y'all are gonna let me before I get too old to ENJOY being fully retired! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lo' Posted September 14, 2018 Report Share Posted September 14, 2018 12 hours ago, jmb said: One of these days y'all are gonna let me before I get too old to ENJOY being fully retired! J. You KNOW you're too much a valuable asset in this community to be let go anytime soon. You KNOW you're one of those persons we'd all feel glad and proud to be able to call a friend. You KNOW your cases and bezels are instrumental to any credible 1016 build. You KNOW that before your work the only option to a gen 1016 case was a gen 102xx or 101xx which would need (a lot of) reshaping. Therefore no! You can't go. Sorry not sorry. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sogeha Posted September 14, 2018 Report Share Posted September 14, 2018 16 hours ago, jmb said: One of these days y'all are gonna let me before I get too old to ENJOY being fully retired! Messing about with rep watches is a lovely retirement hobby😂 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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