Why are reps so expensive?

[markcold]

During the past summer i spent 1 month in Beijing and of course I went to visit the well known silk market. At that time I didn't know much about the whole Rep scene and I was just looking into buying just about any watch that looked nice whether it was a good fake or bad. Needless to say I ended up buying some crappy fakes and some better ones. I got a 3 speedmasters, rolex day date and a aqua terra. I paid about 15$ per watch. Although I must say that after looking around this forum and the internet that the speedmasters are weak copies. They have faux chronos.

Anyway I was looking into buying some more reps but 300$ for a rep is quite pricey even if the watch has a fully functional chrono

Either way wish I found this Forum before I went to China LOL

[FxrAndy]

Hi and welcome, I think the main thing that makes reps expensive is what the market is willing to pay. Also bearin mind the quality of some of our reps, once you have a SOSF, BCE Ingy ect you will proberbly agree that they are at least what we pay when compared with the high street and what you get for $300 there.

[KB]

Yes if the punters pay the prices will stay high, that said $300 for a watch (any watch) with working chrono's is not a bad price.

I know I have a pulsar TT quartz that set me back $500

Ken

[hambone]

Welcome, and yes it is all about supply and demand. In China,you are at the source, however the quality range goes from very bad to very good and in Beijing the merchants could mostly care less about quality versus profit, so they buy the very cheapest reps from the makers and sell these for probably keystone. Beijing is not the place to buy reps and when you are in Guanzhou, where the majority of watch assemblies are done, you can get good deals, but then again you must smuggle them back. The best quality reps are available are for the most part what the dealers in our forum offer. If the prices are higher than what you would like to pay, then you are not alone, but that is pretty much the way it is. You can be secure in knowing that, as you have said, finding this forum gives you license to acquire the best reps available for the best price. Happy hunting and Merry Christmas :smile:

[The Mentalist]

Look at it this way, where else can you get Swiss or Swiss-equivalent mechanical movements, water resistance, sapphire crystals, screwdown crowns and other features in something that for all intents and purposes, is 99% similar in styling to a watch 10 times the price? When you compare them to the Rotary, Accurist, Citizen and Seiko's of this world, our reps represent incredible value even if one excludes the counterfeit branding.

Personally, I'd rather our dealers go look for the best products out there than me doing it. The time and stress saved is probably worth the couple of hundred our dealers make per watch.

[DemonSlayer]

Hello and welcome to the forum. The watches you bought for $15 where not even worth that much. They are probably sold for around $5 to a Chinese person living there, but as they recognised you as a westerner, they charged a little more.

The dealers on this forum do mark up their prices relatively high, this can be seen when comparing their prices for watches and dealers on cqout for example for the same watch, you will sometimes find the difference is a significant amount.

However some will argue that the prices the dealers on this board charge are justified because they offer 'exceptional service' such as returns, they take liabilty if the watches are held by customs, communications and so forth.

Personally I don't think this justifies and extra $100+ per watch but as other members have replied on this post, the prices will stay this high as long as there are people willing to pay them. I personally don't buy my watches from any of the dealers on this board, so far I have 2 reps, a Cartier Roadster GMT and a Panerai 111h both in asian movements and made at a reasonably good quality. I estimate that I have saved in total about $210 by not buying from a dealer here, it's not a mind blowing amount but that kind of money may still be a significant amount to people.

[The Mentalist]

Very true, but peace of mind is priceless,especially in this game.

[markcold]

I agree with most of you. I mean some of these reps probably have decent quality movements that will last many years.

However I find that its kind of a rip off if they price a watch for 100$ when its worth no more then 10$

I got the following watch for 15$ exact same thing

http://www.trustytime88.com/index.php?main...products_id=160

So I'm guessing that a watch that costs 250 is really worth less then 100$?

[DemonSlayer]

You guessed right. There was a fascinating post from a member here, when he went to Guangzhou watch market, he really gave us an insight in to the replica world. To me the prices was the most fascinating part of it, he picked up a Cartier Santos in Swiss ETA for about $90. Dealers on this board charge around $250 for it if I'm not mistaken. That Cartier santos would proabably be charged around $50-60 to a Chinese person living in Guangzhou.

A Rolex Submariner in Swiss eta was offered to him for $65. These are the kind of prices for watches there, however we are not there so we can't have access to these kind of prices. I would check out other dealers out there as well, not only the ones mentioned on this board, for better pricing. If cost is not an issue to you then by all means you can buy from dealers on this board.

[Corgi]

I hate to fight on behalf of our dealers... but their jobs are not easy...

The extra funds covers things like returns, replacements, et cetera. I doubt that when we buy a watch that sells in china for $50 for $200, then the $150 goes into the dealer's pocket. Some of it, yes, sometimes maybe even most of it, but there are a lot more financial "loose ends" that need to be tied up with regards to safe distribution and law enforcement.

Also, unless I physically see (using my eyeballs not my mind) an ETA inside the watch, just if some dealer goes "ETA ETA YES YES GOOD GOOD" I won't believe there is an eta inside.. sorry... these street vendors tell you what you want to hear and then run away faster than you can blink.. its like this *blink* and wham they're gone...

[milsub5517]

Some dealers here actually check watches before they are shipped to the customer. We pay them for their time and service. its that simple. you got an extra $1000 and a few days to kill to fly to china and buy some cheap reps yourself???

this is a business and very profitable one for our chinese friends

guys this is funny, we buy reps from them, they buy gens..

[The Mentalist]

these street vendors tell you what you want to hear and then run away faster than you can blink.. its like this *blink* and wham they're gone...

The Chinese sprint team should clean up at the Olympics next year then. They'll be easy to spot. They will be at the top of the podium wearing triple gold wrapped replica Medals.

guys this is funny, we buy reps from them, they buy gens..

Which, with any luck, they will probably end up using to make 1:1 reps to flog us which then funds more Gen's . It's called the karmic circle of the rep world. Eventually some lucky bastard is going to end up in WIS Nirvana surrounded by more Gen's than he can shake a stick at and will probably start dealing soft drugs or make rap records to alleviate the boredom.

Edited December 18, 2007 by The Mentalist

[Victoria]

So I'm guessing that a watch that costs 250 is really worth less then 100$?

Sometimes I hear that, and wonder what's wrong with making a profit. Price gouging during a time of emergency is not cool. Everything else is about supply and demand, as others mentioned.

One thing though: even in reps you can find super cheapies. That Patek Philippe Sky Moon you saw is pretty darned intricate for just $100. There are tonnes of Rolex watches sold by Jay (e.g.) for $50. They're nice.

And since I'm not going to the Far East or Canal St. any time soon, that's one sweet deal.

@Demonslayer below: They're fantastic-looking watches, but movements are the cheapest (none have failed me yet, though, touch wood). Ask Chrgod about his Silix Air-King one day. In fact, here's his Top Ten Bargain Buys post:

http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showto...amp;hl=air-king

They're at Jay's lower-priced (and lower quality) alternate site:

http://www.watchsilix.com/index.asp

Guys here have seen these pics often, but for your comparison pleasure here is my favourite, Rolex DJ RN @ 28 Euro (U$40-50!):

Thing is, with regret I have to say he's got quality control issues. It's pot-luck what you will get. Worth it, if you bulk order 4, as I usually do though.

[DemonSlayer]

Victoria, I was unaware that Silix sold some watches that cheap, are these available to view at their watchsilix website? I think their silix-prime website only shows watches with higher end movements.

I will be taking a look at their asian movement watches, as those prices are definitely good Have you bought any Rolex's from Jay at those kind of prices? How would you describe the quality of these watches, in movement and overall finish of the watch?

[BobM]

And in the final analysis ... its your choice. If you want to buy reps you pay the offered (or negotiated) price. If you don't want to pay the price, you don't have to.

Your choice.

[KB]

I like mangoes, in my supermarket it costs around $2.50 for a mango, in Fiji where I met my wife I can buy a bucket full for 2 bucks but then it costs me about $3,000 every time I go to Fiji.

What's the point in saying that Andrew sells a watch for over $100 which you picked up for $15 because unless you are flying back to China anytime soon you are not going to see those prices again.

In fact if Andrew said to you ok watch cost $15 + $20 for me + $19 to ship so you can have for $54 but you take the risk of customs and no returns for faults, would you buy it? Or would you say to yourself the other $54 represents a good investment to see you get a good working watch?

However when reps start pushing the $1,000 mark that i agree is over the top.

Ken

[ta8088]

Interesting comments by everyone on this one.

[kenmasters]

I disagree mostly because when I try haggling with the dealers.. (don't you guys haggle!!??) they always say that their margins are getting smaller and smaller... if the average watch, even the most expensive reps >$300 cost the dealers $100, man, that's a huge margin !! How often does customs take the watch ?? ever happen to you?? come on.. the dealers are making lots on this.. and we're the suckers who pay for it because we have no other option other than fly to China ourselves.. Just remember that when you buy your next rep from a dealer here !

Edited December 19, 2007 by kenmasters

[KB]

and we're the suckers who pay for it because we have no other option other than fly to China ourselves.

Which of course is my whole point above. :smile:

Ken

[SBOB]

if they are making SOOO much and its SOOO easy, why not become a dealer yourself

make a killing, as they must be...

[Guest HaloArchive]

Well..to become a dealer yourself..you have to be in China or wherever these things are being produced. So..you have to be close to the production plant to get the darn things. I doubt people will be hauling ass from China to the USA or from China to UK everyday by jet to pickup their clients orders. To become a dealer...you have to live there and be working here as a full time job. And..i doubt that many people here are willing to do that to make meanial wages.

[DemonSlayer]

I disagree mostly because when I try haggling with the dealers.. (don't you guys haggle!!??) they always say that their margins are getting smaller and smaller... if the average watch, even the most expensive reps >$300 cost the dealers $100, man, that's a huge margin !! How often does customs take the watch ?? ever happen to you?? come on.. the dealers are making lots on this.. and we're the suckers who pay for it because we have no other option other than fly to China ourselves.. Just remember that when you buy your next rep from a dealer here !

I agree with this completely. The only reason why we are paying these prices is because not many of us can afford to visit China just to source reps from there! This is what the dealers are completely using to their advantage. If you take a look closely at the salaries of employed persons in China in a variety of different fields, you will see that many of them won't be able to afford the watches at prices that Josh and Andrew are charging for example.

In fact I highly doubt that they are selling to any people in their native countries at all, because they know that if they did they wouldn't be making no where near as enough profit as they are doing when they are selling outside their countries. They would have to sell a Submariner in an ETA movement for around $30 !! Now to us they charge around $210? Clearly enough incentive to export.

Their business is a pure export business, as this is where they can make most of their money at crazy margins, and they have learnt our requirements for reps by reading posts on various forums, and have managed to source factories who can make reps at these quality levels.

Now, I don't know about any of you guys, but I personally don't believe that dealers should be charging around $150 so that you are in peace of mind that they will re-send in case customs seize the watch. As kenmasters said how often does this happen? I realise that different countries have different levels of strictness in customs, but I am sure that 9/10 customs don't seize the watches, and thats an extra $150 going into the dealers pockets everytime the watches are not seized. Everyone is free to buy their reps from whatever dealer they choose, but I will say that for various reasons including the ones outlined above, I won't be buying reps from the so-called trustworthy dealers mentioned on these boards.

[narikaa]

Yeah exactly...thieving ba s tards!!!

I mean everything else that I buy from the other side of the planet we get at cost

'Designer' clothes made in Asian sweat shops......readily on sale in western high streets for a buck or two tops

Exotic fruits....cheap as chips

Phones, cars, hi fis ....all at cost

Ooops of course the 'illegal' factor

Doesnt matter .......cocaine can readily be had on western streets for exactly the same price as paid by Columbian crop pickers.

.

[The Mentalist]

Ferengi rule of acquisition #141: Only fools pay retail.

I need me some bigger lobes.

[TWP]

if they are making SOOO much and its SOOO easy, why not become a dealer yourself

make a killing, as they must be...

It is not as lucrative as you think. You have to remember we are dealing with reps that are built in factories that have no quality standerds. Probably the same factories that spray lead on our childrens toys, and make the pet food that kills pets.

These watches do not even go through the quality control as the cheapo Orient watches. Out of every five watches i order from GZ , 1 has a problem. Order 50 a week and then you have a lot of extra captial tied up in bad watches. Extra shipping charges. Unhappy customers.

The road is not as golden as it appears

To mention the cost on prices. If everyone is patient, that is do not buy watches right when they come out then you will see a huge price decrease. For instance the Big Bang was $428 in March. Now i sell the exact same watch for $335.

I have a million more things i could say, but due to time i cannot.