bbell6 Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Last year I sent a watch in trade from the US to another member in Europe, insured at $400. When the watch never arrived at its destination, I filled out all of the paperwork and waited. Today I received a letter from the US Postal Service claiming that there was an indemnity limit of $43.73 regardless of the declared amount. What is even more puzzling is why the check was made out for $52.38. This appears to be fraudulant. How can they sell you insurance for a certain amount, take your money, and then say that based on guidlines published in some manual they have somewhere, that they are not liable? Anyone else ever have this experience? UPDATE: I went to the local post office that sold me the insurance today. I showed them the paperwork and the letter I recieved along with the $52 check. Two of the postal workers and their supervisor reviewed the documents and said that I should send in a written appeal. It was their impression that the person responding to me was basing their decision on a package without insurance. They thought my appeal was a slam dunk. Although I was happy to hear their opinion, I won't be counting on anything unitl I see the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Last year I sent a watch in trade from the US to another member in Europe, insured at $400. When the watch never arrived at its destination, I filled out all of the paperwork and waited. Today I received a letter from the US Postal Service claiming that there was an indemnity limit of $43.73 regardless of the declared amount. What is even more puzzling is why the check was made out for $52.38. This appears to be fraudulant. How can they sell you insurance for a certain amount, take your money, and then say that based on guidlines published in some manual they have somewhere, that they are not liable? Anyone else ever have this experience? What was the basis for the indemnity limit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornerstone Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Did you take out Priority Mail International Insurance? That sounds like the registered mail limit. http://www.usps.com/international/intlspecialservices.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbell6 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 What was the basis for the indemnity limit? In accordance with postal regulations in the International Mail Manual (IMM), under Special Services Registered Mail Section (333.2) Indemnity Limit, regardless of the declared value of a registered item the maximum amount of indemnity payable for loss, damage or rifling in 2007 is $43.73. Please accept our apology for any inconvenience this matter has caused you. You will receive payment under separate cover. You would think they would tell you in advance that you could only insure things up to $43.73 rather than take your money for $400 worth of insurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbell6 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Did you take out Priority Mail International Insurance? That sounds like the registered mail limit. http://www.usps.com/international/intlspecialservices.htm Apparantly just registered mail. Based on what the person selling me the insurance said, I was insured for the $400. Apparantly they didn't know what they were talking about. This was the first time I had mailed anything internationally. I told them I wanted it insured for $400, I assumed they new what they were doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Carl Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Make copies of all of the paperwork and forward it to your Congressperson with a request for resolution. I have been through all of this and I can tell you that US postal insurance is indeed a consumer fraud. They will only pay claims of $50 or less. Carl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbell6 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Make copies of all of the paperwork and forward it to your Congressperson with a request for resolution. I have been through all of this and I can tell you that US postal insurance is indeed a consumer fraud. They will only pay claims of $50 or less. Carl Did you have any luck doing this? Its not even the money, its more the principle at this point. I waited over 6 months, calling about ever month to see what was happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watchmeister Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Welcome to the fabulous U.S. Post Office. There are many loop holes and no postal worker knows them all. I do ship watches and watch parts (both gen and other) and have encountered ridiculous inconsistencies. I can't remember what is what but I sent many packages fully insured through one UPS service until 20 packages later I was informed by a veteran postal employee that watches and a couple of other types of items are not insurable through that particular service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Very interesting and useful info here. International Registered with insurance doesn't pay. It sounds like International Priority is the only way to go if you need insurance, and incidentally the limit is $675 to Canada - perhaps a good reason to ship valuables to The Zigmeister in multiple parcels. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest carlsbadrolex Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 HAHAHAHA, I didnt know the USPS does this also. A couple years ago I sold a genuine 16613 via Ebay. I took the watch to the local Fedex office, asked for a box, asked for a label to fill out. I had already packed the watch in its box along with the paperwork. I then put the Rolex box in the Fedex box and sealed the package. I filled out the form stating it was a Rolex watch and the value was $4500 (what had been paid for the watch). I took the watch to the counter, and paid for the shipping along with insurance for $4500. The woman even said " WOW, a Rolex watch..." Two days later I get a call from the buyer stating he had received a call from his local Fedex office that they received a package for him. BUT that the package had been ripped open and ALL contents were gone. I immediately went to my Fedex office and found the same woman who had taken the package from me. She remember the Rolex watch and assured me that the package had been properly sealed by me when she took it. We filed a claim with Fedex... A week later I get a check in the mail for $121. They have a limit of $100 liability on ALL jewelery regardless of how much insurance is paid for. I came real close to telling the buyer that he was out of luck and that I was NOT going to refund his money. He had specifically requested Fedex delivery and I felt I had done everything I could to get the package to him. He seemed like a really nice guy who had been saving for years to buy his first Rolex, so I sourced another 16613 from a dealer I know, bought it for $4200 and shipped it to him via USPS Registered Mail with insurance for $7500 (the cost of a new 16613 at that time). The fact that I lost over $4000 on the deal caused me to swear to NEVER use Fedex again. I must have softened in my old age, because my monthly Fedex bill is now somewhere in the are of $5k... Good luck, but I doubt you have ANY recourse. What is written in the postal manual is strictly adhered to when the USPS screws up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce79 Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 I've shipped countless watches through the USPS and I swear every person I talk to there tells me something different. Whether it's about insurance, delivery confirmation, shipping times. It's really a crap shoot. Though after reading this, anything I ship international will be Priority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magagne Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 HAHAHAHA, I didnt know the USPS does this also. A couple years ago I sold a genuine 16613 via Ebay. I took the watch to the local Fedex office, asked for a box, asked for a label to fill out. I had already packed the watch in its box along with the paperwork. I then put the Rolex box in the Fedex box and sealed the package. I filled out the form stating it was a Rolex watch and the value was $4500 (what had been paid for the watch). I took the watch to the counter, and paid for the shipping along with insurance for $4500. The woman even said " WOW, a Rolex watch..." Two days later I get a call from the buyer stating he had received a call from his local Fedex office that they received a package for him. BUT that the package had been ripped open and ALL contents were gone. I immediately went to my Fedex office and found the same woman who had taken the package from me. She remember the Rolex watch and assured me that the package had been properly sealed by me when she took it. We filed a claim with Fedex... A week later I get a check in the mail for $121. They have a limit of $100 liability on ALL jewelery regardless of how much insurance is paid for. I came real close to telling the buyer that he was out of luck and that I was NOT going to refund his money. He had specifically requested Fedex delivery and I felt I had done everything I could to get the package to him. He seemed like a really nice guy who had been saving for years to buy his first Rolex, so I sourced another 16613 from a dealer I know, bought it for $4200 and shipped it to him via USPS Registered Mail with insurance for $7500 (the cost of a new 16613 at that time). The fact that I lost over $4000 on the deal caused me to swear to NEVER use Fedex again. I must have softened in my old age, because my monthly Fedex bill is now somewhere in the are of $5k... Good luck, but I doubt you have ANY recourse. What is written in the postal manual is strictly adhered to when the USPS screws up. What a sad story and frustrated things... the fact that you did everything to be bulletproof from stolen possibility. And even that... what a %^&* post company are these... I use Fedex ONE time to ship a watch, a Sinn, I was scared, I remember I know that my FedEx local outlet in Montr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbell6 Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Good luck, but I doubt you have ANY recourse. What is written in the postal manual is strictly adhered to when the USPS screws up. @ carlsbadrolex I guess I should just be happy that my lesson only cost me $350 I may have to stick with UPS in the future. At least with UPS I have some leverage. My employer does close to $40,000 a month in business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 As a side note, whenever I hear that the government should run the health care system, I feel compelled to ask whether we really want our doctor's offices operating just like our post offices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Carl Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Did you have any luck doing this? Its not even the money, its more the principle at this point. I waited over 6 months, calling about ever month to see what was happening. No, it didn't work at all. The point is this: it went to Portugal (it was a collectors camera and not a watch). It was held up in customs there for MONTHS. I finally on my own responsibility sent the buyer a full refund of cash in registered mail. Portugal does not accept postal money orders. At the same time, and also after a couple of months, customs in Portugal decided to release the shipment to my customer. This was after he had asked them several times about the shipment and they had no idea about the package. My customer, being an honest person like myself, reposted the cash back to me in registered mail. And that is how it ended no thanks to the insurance offered by the USPS. I never received a reply to any of the requests I submitted in writing to the USPS. That is why I suggest that you contact your Congressperson as there is no other hope. USPS insurance for more than $50 is a fraud. Keep all of this in mind when shipping expensive collectibles around the world. Escrow could be good but it is just another opportunity for fraud. Carl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KB Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 One thing that gets me here is that tampering with the mail is a Federal offense and there cannot be too many hands touch the package between sender and receiver......was any attempt made to actually find the goods? I know I have had a few items go astray that were shipping out of China and each time they managed to catch the person who lifted the goods. Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbell6 Posted February 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 One thing that gets me here is that tampering with the mail is a Federal offense and there cannot be too many hands touch the package between sender and receiver......was any attempt made to actually find the goods? I know I have had a few items go astray that were shipping out of China and each time they managed to catch the person who lifted the goods. Ken They apparantly did some kind of search. Lazarini (the watch was sent to him) sent me an e-mail letting me know that they contacted him to make sure he didn't receive it. Other than that, I don't know how thoroughly they searched. Based on the payout, I'm guessing they didn't waste a whole lot of time looking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wannab Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 If I were you I would use UPS. IF you want to insure it I believe its a dollar extra per 100. The package would be considered a high value which gets handled differently than a regular package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Maybe I am missing something here, but I wonder why Rolex will only accept watches sent in for service via USPS Registered Mail? I cannot imagine they would require owners to use USPS Registered Mail if the USPS did not honor insurance claims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Maybe I am missing something here, but I wonder why Rolex will only accept watches sent in for service via USPS Registered Mail? I cannot imagine they would require owners to use USPS Registered Mail if the USPS did not honor insurance claims. Rolex has major service centers in the US. These shipments would not be subject to the international indemnity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Rolex has major service centers in the US. These shipments would not be subject to the international indemnity. I would think they would if you are a Canadian shipping to the RSC in NYC or a Mexican shipping to the RSC in CA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarini Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 They apparantly did some kind of search. Lazarini (the watch was sent to him) sent me an e-mail letting me know that they contacted him to make sure he didn't receive it. Other than that, I don't know how thoroughly they searched. Based on the payout, I'm guessing they didn't waste a whole lot of time looking. hey B . just saw this sad story man , yep i received a note to come personally to the post office ... it was like 3 months latter if i remember now ... on first thought i was thinkin maybe the package has surfaced ... so i come there to the office written on the invitation and a older lady slipped me a form saying that the sender has filed for a reimbursement and i need to sign the form that i did not receive package in order for him to be refunded . i did so and i informed B about that ... now this really sad to hear that , pls do not hesitate to contact me via PM if u need any assistance . regards Laz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HauteHippie Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 I would think they would if you are a Canadian shipping to the RSC in NYC or a Mexican shipping to the RSC in CA. How would a Canadian or Mexican ship via USPS? They'd ship via Canada Post and/or whatever Mexico has, which would be subject to their own rules and regulations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllergyDoc Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 me='chieftang' date='Feb 17 2008, 02:31 PM' post='403501']As a side note, whenever I hear that the government should run the health care system, I feel compelled to ask whether we really want our doctor's offices operating just like our post offices. No, we do not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbell6 Posted February 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 hey B . just saw this sad story man , yep i received a note to come personally to the post office ... it was like 3 months latter if i remember now ... on first thought i was thinkin maybe the package has surfaced ... so i come there to the office written on the invitation and a older lady slipped me a form saying that the sender has filed for a reimbursement and i need to sign the form that i did not receive package in order for him to be refunded . i did so and i informed B about that ... now this really sad to hear that , pls do not hesitate to contact me via PM if u need any assistance . regards Laz Hi Laz, Good to here from you. I think you did all that could be done, and I appreciate your effort. I think this is nothing more than the post office using some loop hole to keep from paying up. No big deal, just annoying. I hope this post helps educate everyone. It is better to learn from one elses mistake rather than your own - its at least cheaper (LOL). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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