sssurfer

I doubt it, unfortunately. Apart from the fact that I do not feel that my (or Lello's) watchsmith is so skilled to recognize what type a DW is by just looking at it, even a difference so small to be undetectable at the eye would compromise everything... (thanks for your offer, J.!)

That is not true. (btw, I would suggest to open new threads for topic changes of this kind)

They are fantasy with vintage-style hands to give them a look vaguely 6152-1 type. As for the differences, just check them side by side, they are easy to spot (hint: text).

If you check that thread on RWI you will see that, as a matter of fact, noone talked of mineral glass but vdubpower, who wrongly assumed that his crystal was mineral just because it exploded (he actually even got angry with the dealer who had assured it was sapphire ). It's a common mistake to believe that sapphire, being more scratch-resistant than glass, is also more crash-resistant. In reality, sapphire is less resistant than glass to crashes, cracks or so. This makes sense as sapphire's structure is that of a crystal, while glass is amorphous. So, while sapphire surface is harder vs scratches, its whole structure is less able to bear with tensions and deformations. Glass has some ability to accomodate slight deformations, while sapphire responds in an all-or-nothing manner, and it suddenly explodes. Apologies to vbarrett for this thread hijacking. I come back to the topic by assuring her that she can be confident that his mini fiddy's crystal is less likely to explode being it mineral than if it was sapphire.

Wear the 127 on your left arm and the 217 on the right... at the same time.

Thanks lanikai, sure it helps. So what we have here is a Chinese copy of a Chinese movement... oh well... If you can find more info about it, kudos to you. A definite step forward would be finding the datewheel specs, so we can find whether there are interchangeable datewheels to buy as spares and have them reprinted, so to prevent the members from the need to send Lello their datewheels.

lanikai, yes I confirm that the models with PR at 6 (027 and 028) come either with the Asian 21J or the ETA 2892-A2. Obviously the Asian 21J is in the cheaper models (80-120 USD), while the ETA is in the high-end models (580-650 USD). But the models with PR at 5 (090, 124 and 222, the 171 not being repped as far as I know) come with that other movement that we are talking about, that is way better than the Asian 21J, and that should be the Seagull TY-2530. I repeat that when the dealers say 'Asian 21J' they are just meaning 'some kind of Asian auto movement that we cannot qualify as a high-end copy of an ETA movement'. This includes chinese and japanese copies of the Miyota 8215 (90%), several other different Seagull movements (5%), and some others (5%). That is not a mala fide lie, as it would be in their interest to let the customers know that some models have better movements than the Miyota copy. But they just don't care, or don't know, or don't want to make the thing complicated, or what. On the contrary, there actually are sellers of genuine watches with the TY-2530 inside that look quite delighted by specifying the movement. Please have a look at this ebay post (pointed out by omega1) before it goes away. Compare the positions of the hands and PR gauge with your 090. The seller proudly specifies: '-- Movement -- Automatic TY-2530 movement w/ 35 jewels'. Those considerations are exactly the ones that made Lello (and me) willing to improve the datewheel on the 090 and similar models. We feel that that movement is so good that it is worth the improvement. If you feel bold enough to remove the caseback from a couple of your watches, open your 090 and another of your supposed Asian 21J watches. You will easily see that they are different movements. Granted.

I was forgetting the most important: here.

lanikai, I've spent days on researching what movement is the 090's and I may assure you it is not 'the' Asian 21J (Miyota copy). I removed from their cases several Asian 21J and my 090's movement (Lello did the same), and I could verify it with my own eyes. When the dealers say it is Asian 21J, they are simply wrong. Not even a little white lie, as the 090 movement is much better than the Asian 21J. Maybe they just don't want to make customers confused with different types of Asian auto movements. The movement that you have in your 090 is almost surely that 35J, that is likely to be the Seagull ST-2530. Please have a look here, here, and try googleing for "ST 2530", "TY 2530", "seagull 2530", and so. If your 090 has a display back, you can also check whether the back of your movement is resembling that in my picture. BTW, just today I received a 124, and it has that same movement -- as expected. That movement is the ubiquitary one of the 44mm PR PAMs with the PR gauge @5 o'clock. Contrarily from those with the PR gauge @6 o'clock, i.e. the 027 and 028. These come with either the 'true' Asian 21J, or the ETA 2892-A2 (I have two Asian 21J 027s, and one ETA 028, and I opened all them).

As far as I heard, that is an issue of sapphire crystals only.

@kruzer: Yes, I forgot to mention that that movement is the same one that is supposed to engine all the 44mm PR rep models with PR gauge @5: 090, 124, (171), 222. Thanks for pointing it out! In any case, everyone is recommended to check what movement is in his watch. It should look like this: 3-4 weeks should be no problem. Lello already checked out with his previous datewheel, and unfortunately they all were no fit. @lanikai: Thanks you too for pointing out that passage where I have been unclear. It was because of my poor English. Now I hope I fixed it. Unfortunately, the movement in the 090 is all but an Asian 21J. It is a sophisticate and good quality Asian 35J that is supposed to be the Seagull TY-2530 (formerly ST-2530). Actually, "Asian 21J" is a take-all name including some different models, most often a copy of the Miyota 8215. Lello and I are currently talking about making improved datewheels for that movement too, but we are doubtful as it is a movement especially mounted on inexpensive reps, so we wonder whether anyone who paid 120-150$ for a watch would be willing to spend 50 more dollars for the sake of providing it with a new datewheel. @archibald: Thanks for the advice! Just one thing: I don't feel it will surely be necessary to remove the small lens. I mounted the improved Finepics' datewheel on my 028 without removing it, and the font looks good. I could be wrong, naturally.

PAM fans 090-124-171-222 owners, pls have a look here.

As you know, the date magnification of the 090 is quite good, the problem being essentially the date font. Lello is currently considering to reprint 090 datewheels with the correct panerai font. Everyone should have his watch disassembled locally, then send Lello the datewheel only. (This is because Lello and I have been unable to find which kind of available datewheel, if any, may be interchangeable with the 090's one -- should anyone have any hints about it, always welcome). Anyone interested in this opportunity please show your interest here. (Members in different forums please post once only)

Not a problem as long as the lume coat you are going to apply is thick enough. I use chemical means (acetone) rather than physical means to remove the old lume from sandwich dials. Much faster, effortless, and safer.

Wow! An artwork more than a watch.

You are welcome. (I simply couldn't resist a 32yrs lady whose name is Victoria and who loves watches... )

Or the 190 (Radiomir 8 days SS, 45mm). This is very similar to the mini fiddy you originally choosed, but no fantasy. http://www.pam111.com/product_info.php?cPa...products_id=802

I would say: go for the mini fiddy, it would look gorgeous on a chick's wrist. But, if you want quite an accurate model @ 119 bucks... excluding all 40mm models... uhm, I hate to add even more choices, but you might consider the 140 (the golden 104).

No doubt. I just hope his work is professional diving...

Yes, any pics, Flav? Not to hijack the thread, but I am definitely interested in this! Do they perform the beadblasting too? I would participate with three cases and some more buckles / clasps.

Not a big issue, really. Just because on a less specific section, with a larger public, you might get answers more quickly. This section is quite specific and therefore mainly attended by modding enthusiasts and people in need for help. Changing the strap being not usually meant as an upgrade, your question well qualified for the Panerai section, if not even the General section as the relation between wrist size and strap length might be regarded as one of quite general interest. Just a suggestion in case of a next occasion.

Poor man. That DJ and the depicted piece... I am unsure I would survive.

The 177 is 44mm and it therefore needs a 24mm strap. You may choose a 24/24 or 24/22. As for the length, 115/75 or 120/80. No more than that. BTW, unsure this belongs to the Repair & Upgrade Section...

I'm giving up with hope to make this enter into people's heads.

An update about gen PVD look. I just received one of those genuine crowns from the Kruzer's group buy, a PVD crown. As you know, these crowns are supposed to be genuine crowns from the earlier years of the Vendome OP era, so we may assume they provide with quite a good insight about the genuine OP PVD look of those years. Well it is quite light, almost a dark gray with matte silver reflections. Much more like the 028 in chieftang's pic than mine.