RickFlorida

I wondered about this. All the more reason for my method.... Here is the precision I can achieve with etching metal with the pcbx toner paper and foil. Now please disregard the quality of the finish, as I did not spend time to further varnish the masking. I just want to show you the precision of the etch. Is anyone good with Adobe Illustrator or other programs? If I provide how to etch metal with precision, can someone collaborate with me and help create the vector image? I suck at software.

Does anyone know if I'll have to re-tap as well if I have the newer Josh Cartel 5513 (now with the nice flat caseback) and I want to install an Athaya 702 crown? I like to know the plan so I can get taps or materials. Thanks.

In fact.... I will post a copy of the completed template so all you guys have to do is print it in laser toner on the transfer paper . I use pcbfx.com And then I normally heat the paper on silver or gold to transfer the design, (mask). Of course, in this case, it will be on the stainless case back. Now I normally transfer designs onto thin gauge sheet so it can fit in a laminator which is the best way to heat and press it on. But in this case, we cannot fit the caseback in a laminator so we must iron it on and provide our own brute force. So our friend Ken at Raffles, we would rather buy your Tudor caseback if you can get them in stock again. This is just a last resort. If the depth and cut looks clean enough, then great. If not, we will have to pay for professional engraving. Which there are not a lot of people who would offer it. There are only 2 that I know of so the rates are not competitive at all.

thank you. I will share how to do it with steps so thank you so much. Could you also measure the spacing between words and the height and width of the rolex crown since its different from the letter size.

Hello fellow and ladies if there are those as well. I'm a going to be working on a tudor project and wanted to know if anyone would care to share the approximate size and font of the Tudor caseback (9411-94010). I have etching knowledge from making jewelry and believe that satisfactory results could be achieved. I will share the process once I have done it if it is successful. Both Raffles Time (Ken) and Yuki are out of stock. I will probably still have someone engrave between the lugs as it's a bit harder to etch small things with precision, but the Tudor caseback should be doable. If anyone owns a Yuki or Raffles casebook, or original, a few moments with a caliper would be awesome. In short, I normally use a very inexpensive but great system using laser toner, and a professional foil that covers the masking. I also would use varnish with black ink to further protect the rest of the design. Either Nitric Acid or another formula for the etchant. I am going to be using a case that is the newer 5513's from Josh Cartel. The new ones have a nice flat caseback.

Ahh, yes. It's weird, I did see these but for some reason, they seem to only exist from UK listings. Any American sources to keep from paying shipping? But thank you. This is helpful to know what I'm looking for now.

Ahhh. Thanks. Why is it bad to not remove the rotor first?

I was please wondering if anyone knows where I could purchase a plastic storage container that will hold a 2824-2 movement that is complete? It looks like they are made for shipping new movements but I can't find anywhere that sells them. Thanks for any advice, Rick

I have this 2824-2 with a marathon dial. I want to remove the dial so I can use the movement for a Tudor project. I don't understand how to remove the dial. I heard some 2824-2's use a hinge system as opposed to screws. Can anyone please tell from the photos which this is using and how do I remove the dial? I want to check before I attempt so I don't damage anything. Thank you Thank you! Rick

Where did you get these high quality reps?

Someone paid nearly 8,000 dollars for it. So how fake can it be? Or did someone just overpay for an original movement with an original case and fake dial?

Yes, thank you. That's what I indeed contacted him about already. He is very friendly and quick to respond. It's a bit expensive but he know's what he's doing so I guess it's worth it. I will probably have him engrave between the lugs, but for the case back, I believe the Rafflestime Tudor caseback fits these. Machine shot rates are probably 75 dollars an hour, and so his charge of about 2 hours worth at that rate sounds correct.

OK, great. I will open it up soon. I already did order an Athaya 702 crown and will want to get a better crystal. I'm just surprised that the dial is 26mm. I'm guessing the super dome crystal magnify's the dial so it appears larger than it really is? I will be very happy if I can just buy a better bezel or tighten up this one and add a better insert. I might just be very used to the stiffer ratcheting bezels but I still think it moves very easily. I will do this tonight. Thank you. I think you are right because they laser engraved 1665 between the lugs. I'm going to rub these off, they mispelled "stailess steel" on one side, LOL. Got to love it. So the fixed the crown guards but could not spell stainless steel? Thank you.

I am really confused as to whether this is the JoshCartel 5513 or not. Anyone know from the photos? I just need to be sure because I want to order a 26mm tudor dial for the case. How are dials measured because to me it seems closer to 29mm .

I don't have a picture, but I checked between the lugs. It says "1665 registered design" on one end and "the funny "Stailess Steel" misprint. So it is indeed Cartel but the 1665? Luckily, the misprinted engravings are only laser engraved very lightly. I will remove these in order to build my Tudor Sub. So can I expect the correct tension/washer ring in the bezel to bend and add tension?

Here you go. Sorry for the blown out white balance. I was in a hurry. So is this the right kind of Josh/Cartel? I bought it directly from Sead1999 (Sandro Lica?) I like it. Maybe I'm just too OCD and use to the newer clicking bezels, but I swear mine is way too loose. If it's Gen. Like construction, I would even be willing to buy a different bezel and maybe with the new crystal it will all be tighter.

Yes, I would like that very much so I'll post a photo tonight. There is a lot of confusion so I'd like to know what it is too. For example, some of them come with 2836/46 clones. But some have DG2813 which are very different. I bought the cheaper one because all I wanted was the case. I'll try to post later tonight.

Ah thank you. I have much to learn. Luckily, I'm a very fast learner and somewhat mechanical. May I ask you then, how can I adjust the tension? It's way too loose. It has almost no friction.

Hello gents and ladies, I just got a Josh/Cartel 5513 Rep, (the one that comes with 21J/DG2813) and I'm impressed with the fit and finish but the bezel spins very freely. Do they not use any flat tension spring at all or is there one in there I can adjust? Have people used gen. replacement type tension spring washers? I'd rather do that then make one. The funny thing is, I only need the midcase and would not have cared if anything else was broken or not working. I bought it for a build I'm wanting to do. Such is my luck. thanks for any advice, Rick

Agreed, which is why I can't wait to hear from the German fellow who thinks it's so easy to do this. I won't be rushing this build, thanks to you guys pointing out the important challenges that can arrive. Maybe what I have left out of the story is just how well my 2824-2 has been serving me. I currently have it where it was born which is in a EPOS dive style watch with a Marathon tritium dial. The movement has been incredibly accurate for it's 8 or 9 years I've had it. I trust it and just don't want to buy a different movement unless I have to. If it proves difficult, then even if I purchase a second Josh/Cartel 5513 but next time with the 2836/46 clone.... I still would have only spent 300 something dollars. I could sell my swiss ETA 2824-2 and purchase the 2846 ETA if I really have to. I'd still save hundreds of dollars over buying a 1000 dollar yuki case. I would really love to be able to see just the mid case of the Cartel 5513 that ships with the 21J (2813) and the 200 dollar 5513 mid case that has the other movement and see if the they are really different.

Thanks for the great advice. I just read that at least for the 702 Athaya, the threads in the Cartel case are identical. As for my budget, I want to do the best I can with the Cartel Case. I just simply don't see the logic in spending 1000 bucks on a case to make a rep. Unless I'm incorrect, don't we have only 2 choices? Cartel/Josh cases for 100 bucks, or 800 to 1000 dollar phongs or Yukis? And if that is true, why is no one else tooling up some nice gen. spec cases ans selling them for 200 or 250? From what I have read, if you get a better case back, (flatter than Cartel), and better insert with quality pearl, then fix the cg's as best you can, replace the horrid crown.... it's not a bad case, especially for 100 bucks. I've heard the bezel ring is near gen. But I think you are correct that a gen. spec case on the inside would make it easier to then get a ETA conversion ring/dial from Yuki if that's what you mean. I was considering trying to get the case/watch from the mysterious storefront in Thailand I see you guys talking about. But it seems you have to know someone who flies to the country. (and people are hoarding the cases in their drawers, LOL) But according to this German fellow, he's saying it's easy to drop my swiss movement into a 21J version (2813) Cartel. I PM'd this guy and am hoping he can tell me just how easy it is..... We shall see!

I don't know whether to get a 702 crown or a 703 crown from Athaya. What is the difference? Or which one is better if I want to build an old Tudor from the Josh/Cartel 5513? Thanks for any info. I will hopefully be able to post pictures soon of my project.

Hmm, interesting. Than I need to ask the German fellow I saw who posted on another forum who said it was very easy to fit a 2824-2 in a 2813 5513 case. His definition of easy may be different from ours. I'll have to see what he meant then. That's interesting that they would bother to make two different cases, unless they are originally from two different makers entirely. Guess I will find out soon enough, I will report more information once I get the parts in hand. Thanks again.

Update thanks to all you fine Gents, Firstly, Admins or moderators, can you please edit my thread title? I should have mentioned I'm building a Tudor Sub with Josh/Cartel 5513 Tomhorn is correct about the confusion I caused. I'm not building a 5513, I just am starting with that for the case. Thank you. So I think I figured out a few things that may help others. First, thank you Tomhorn for getting me to look into the differences of what you may get with the 5513. I believe I understand enough now to sum it all up: Let me know if I'm wrong but I think I figured it all out. If you pay for a Josh/Cartel 5513 and it's only 100 to 110 then it's going to come with the DG2813 which is good if you want to fit a swiss ETA 2824-2 which I happen to already own. If you pay for the more expensive cartel 5513 you get the better cloned movement but will be easier to fit a 2846 or 2836. Now here is one more question for you guys about movements and the case. Wouldn't the Cartel 5513 case still be the same but just comes with a different spacer ring if it's the 2813 or the cloned 2836? Is it not a single spacer ring that would move the stem height and center the crown stem? I also ask because from what I'm reading, the 2813 Cartel 5513 may be coming with a plastic ring insert instead of a metal one like the better cloned movement. (unless I'm wrong from the other threads), And I would want to purchase a metal insert ring anyways to fit my movement. Can anyone tell me if there really is a difference in the cases or is it just a single spacer ring like I assume?

Nice!!! So the latest info I have is that the Cartel/Josh 5513 that I'm getting has 21 jewel movement. If it's 21 Jewels, doe this indicate if it's the 2813 clone? I'm just wondering so I can plan on what spacers I will need, etc.