PAMman

Totally agree - the standard of finish on gen movements is as different as 'night and day' in comparison to the best rep. That's why all my PAM reps are solid caseback models.

Looks OK to me. I can't remember the rep caseback numbers but the only F series rep that I've ever seen was the 111.

I bought 3 genuine dials with a view to making one of my own, using a rep Daytona, Swiss ETA 7750 etc. It shouldn't be too difficult. However I then bought a gen on the 'bay and I love it. I have 3 dials that I would sell if anyone really wants to do this (black, blue and white/panda).

I have had a good trading relationship with Jimmy Fu but he is a fairly prominent Panersiti who decided, a few years ago, to produce his own homage watch. He had 200 pieces made using his own 001D as a pattern but then along came the Panerai litigation against 'Ken Trading' in respect of the original RXW Marina Militaire, where Panerai were successful. Jimmy decided not to go ahead and instead started to off-load his parts on ebay, described as 'after-market' replacement parts together with a warning that use of these parts would inavlidate any warranty from Panerai. He was deliberately disassociating himself from the rep scene and he clearly doesn't want any further part in any related activity. I asked him for contact details of the machine shop used but he told me that 'it was no longer in business' - he's a gentleman but I don't think that he will be willing to assist in any way.

DSN has the most inaccurate in terms of overall dimensions etc. He has different cases for different models and some, like his preV 5218/201A for example, are simply hideously deformed with a too high crown position and then a too tall bezel and misshapen CG to disguise the flaws. For some inexplicable reason he seems to think that the preV watches should have a taller bezel when actually the reverse is true. Check out this link, changing xx for tt and search for DSN's post of his new 201A - then compare. hxxp://www.paneristi.com/archives/casedifferences/index.html To answer your question - anyone but DSN - honestly Jimmy Fu's was the only 1:1 copy but the rest are pretty good, certainly miles better than DSN's rubbish.

Don't know the answer but don't forget that the autos have a diffent caseback from the handwind models and Jimmy's caseback is for handwinds. Maybe adding the appropriate back to Jimmy's case will help.

It's less likely that DSN's screws are too short but more likely than his case is wider at the lugs than it should be. His stuff is very inaccurate and poorly fitting. However try another set of screws just to make sure as regular reps screws vary slightly in length and you obviously need the longest that you can find. If you really want to sort this properly consider buying 26mm screws and cutting them to the exact length that you need and then recutting screw slots again. Not easy I'm sure but worth a try.

The first series, that's the G series, were all L SWISS L and I think that some of the H series were the same but since then they've been L SWISS MADE L.

Mine has also the gen dial and Swiss 7750 c/w day & date wheels, waiting to go to The Zigmeister for Chieftang's AR treatment. IMO, this is probably the best IWC rep of all. Yes, the crown is wobbly but AFAIK they're all like that. I'm considering getting my gen dial relumed in a tritium colour to match the T SWISS T on the rep, to reinforce the gen appearance.

Good point, but I think that the Palp crown went much too far in this direction. In my experience, even the shortest rep crown levers were way too long for Palp's crowns and still had to be drastically shortened, leaving them an inaccurate shape. Some feedback on this aspect would be useful, specifically; Did the Palp crowns have too shallow a recess, with the result that even short levers had to be shortened significantly further? Please respond.

In most of the older Panerai reps, including the 029, the A has its crossbar too low, resulting in a larger upper triangle and a 'droopy' appearance. Just compare most rep PAMs with the corresponding gens - the newer reps (104 some subs etc) are correct but the bulk are incorrect. The 029 pictured in that post had the crossbar at the correct height so this must be a different run of dial. However if it is for the Asain movement only then this dial will not suit the more desirable ETA 2893 movement watches.

Apart from a couple of franken PAMs that have a high content of genuine parts I have a IWC GST Ti with a Swiss 7750 and gen dial that it's easy to forget is a rep. However, straight out of the box the SOSF and the Ingy take some beating. Both feel very similar to the genuine item and with Swiss ETA movements they operate flawlessly. Both keepers for sure.

Yes, the dial is great with the corrected A.

I presume this is DSN's 029?

If the Palp crown is being used as a sample please correct the recess, where the lever closes. This should be deeper than Palp's to allow a more normal CG lever length because Palp's crown required the levers to be shortened too much. BTW, DSN's latest SS crown and tube is excellent except for the bevel on the edge being too much. If he could produce the same crown with less bevel it would be perfect and it comes with its own case tube.

The photos aren't great but it looks 100% to me.

I have researched this topic and I came to the conclusion that Rolli can provide the best finish for the preA and A series Panerai. In fact I would have already sent mine if I could get a tube made to suit my genuine crown. I'm intending to use a gen Ti crown with a Jimmy Fu case & crownguard, get it PVD'd and drop my genuine preA1 dial / movement into it. My current problem is getting a wider tube to take the genuine B series crown as Jimmy's cases are 1:1 copies of the D series watches. The B series had seals on the shaft of the crown and the shaft was thicker to allow for the grooves that seat the seals while the D series had a narrower smooth shaft and a seal within the tube. Unless anyone can demonstrate that there is a better source for the correct PVD finish I am likely to go with Rolli as soon as I get this problem sorted.

I have no idea what he produces but I agree that it's unlikely that he actually commissions anything other than dials. However he uses cases which are a departure from the usual reasonable accurate rep case and in fact, with the exception of a couple of his dials and his crowns I don't consider that any component which is uses is even equal to the normal rep. Every other component is less accurate, less well finished and very carelessly assembled together to make a watch. See Uncle Jay's assessment of his recent delivery of DSN's 'premium products'.

I am very sorry but not at all surprised. However I must commend you for being willing to be honest about his rubbish. I must have posted at least 50 posts warning that DSN's stuff is highly inaccurate, poorly finished, very carelessly assembled and not compatible with any alternative parts which may otherwise be used to correct his peculiar interpretation of what a Panerai looks like. Can we please accept that his products are tripe? - yes they are different than the regular rep offerings but he is making fools of a lot of people. I have sent him numerous emails and PM offering to assist in improving the accuracy of his products but he has never had the manners to respond to a single message. He is not interested in improving anything as long as he has a bunch of supporters who won't speak up, lest they end up being blacklisted like me.

I'm certainly intending to get a Jimmy Fu case & CG PVD'd and my intention is to go to Rolli unless someone tells me otherwise. If we can join together to make this a worthwhile project then count me in.

Too close to the bezel. This is a factor in all of DSN's 44mm handwind 6497 cases but it is worst in his latest preV cases (the 2-screw cases). AFAIK his Ti case is worse than his normal SS cases but they all have the crown & stem too close to the bezel and he attempts to disguise this by using a thick misshapen crownguard, with the top segment (above the lever) the same thickness as the lower. In the older genuine / Jimmy Fu / normal rep CG the top segment is approx one third the thickness of the lower part, along its outer edge. If someone sets out to provide a superior product at a premium price then, where bespoke components are being used, these should be better finished and / or more accurate than the regular production rep. DSN's are demonstrably less accurate, are more poorly finished (if you have one of his Ti crownguards check out the finish on the lever) and frequently don't fit together properly (CG to case is a good example). Compare these areas to a regular Cartel offering at a lower price. Then ask youself, 'How does this handbuilt Panerai replica compare with my regular Steelfish / IWC GST / Navitimer?' I cannot understand how he has persuaded so many people that his product is desirable.

I know someone who, together with an accomplice as bright as himself, took a day off work and made a 2 hour train journey to rob a bank in Dublin. After successfully robbing the bank they dashed outside, hailed a taxi to take them back to the station and (according to the taxi-driver who gave evidence at their trial) paid the taxi-driver with a large banknote and told him to keep the change. When he thanked them for their generosity and wished them 'Good Luck' they said, 'Thanks, we'll need it.' Needless to say they didn't complete their train journey home before being arrested and taken from the train en-route. Maybe Asad's his brother??

Dunno who makes them but those sold by Timefactors in UK are top quality. Contact Eddie Platts @ timefactors.com. His associated forum is TZ-UK.com and it's a great gen watch resource.