Opinions on the GMT Asian 21j Movement?

[ceocorona]

What are your thoughts on this being used in a vintage 1675?  This is a slow beat if I am not mistaken.  I want a reliable slow beat movement with matched GMT hands for a franken 1675 project (wintage).  I know there is the DG movement but what about ETA options?  

[denimhead]

if you want it to function as per the gen (non independently adjustable 24hr hand) then i'd suggest a eta 2846 with the gmt parts transferred from a eta 2836-2 Also remove the hacking lever if the dial dates in terms of font etc PRE 1973. There is a post on here somewhere and Bonesy did a nice one over on RWI

Cheers DH

[ceocorona]

I saw the build thread Sneed did.  I guess I also need to figure out by trial and error what is going to fit in my thin case.  Not sure the thickness of these movements either... Lol 

[JoeyB]

The DG3804B is a very good and reliable GMT movement that is not converted or modified, but designed to be a GMT movement from it's start. RolexAddict uses that movement in his custom 1675 builds. I have used both the DG and the ETA movements in my 6542 builds. Once completed, there is no discernible difference. You can further modify the ETA 2846 to make it work as the old gen movement did, no date quickset, no hacking, no adjustable GMT hand. But to me that makes the watch just a pain in the 6, and those non-functions are not going to fool anyone.  The beauty of the DG3804B is that at around 5 years when both movements would need servicing, the ETA will cost somewhere around $200. To service the DG3804B place the movement on the bench, hit it with a hammer, and replace the movement with a brand new one for about $25.  

[Valty]

To service the DG3804B place the movement on the bench, hit it with a hammer, and replace the movement with a brand new one for about $25.  

 

 very well said ... !

[ceocorona]

The DG3804B is a very good and reliable GMT movement that is not converted or modified, but designed to be a GMT movement from it's start. RolexAddict uses that movement in his custom 1675 builds. I have used both the DG and the ETA movements in my 6542 builds. Once completed, there is no discernible difference. You can further modify the ETA 2846 to make it work as the old gen movement did, no date quickset, no hacking, no adjustable GMT hand. But to me that makes the watch just a pain in the 6, and those non-functions are not going to fool anyone.  The beauty of the DG3804B is that at around 5 years when both movements would need servicing, the ETA will cost somewhere around $200. To service the DG3804B place the movement on the bench, hit it with a hammer, and replace the movement with a brand new one for about $25.  

 

 

That seems like a curious way to service a movement.  Do I need to buy a gen hammer or will a rep one suffice?  I want to make sure I service the movement properly just in case a seasoned watchsmith is observing me, haha.  

 

So my newb question, where to source the DG3804B and matching rep rolex gmt hands?  Or will this require some extensive modifications to mate rep hands to the DG.

 

 

EDIT:  I see where to buy the movement and matching DG hands, google is my friend. For a total of $50 it's worth a try and see if it fits the case.  

Edited August 30, 2013 by ceocorona

[JoeyB]

What case set are you using? 

[cjjoyce1]

One of the latest DG editions I recently fitted into my franken (didn't hit the old one with a hammer, though) does not have an adjustable GMT hand feature, just quickset date.  Thought that was interesting. 

[JoeyB]

I've yet to see a DG3804B that the GMT hand was not independently settable. Maybe try the hammer...

[preacher62]

That seems like a curious way to service a movement.  Do I need to buy a gen hammer or will a rep one suffice?  I want to make sure I service the movement properly just in case a seasoned watchsmith is observing me, haha.  

 

So my newb question, where to source the DG3804B and matching rep rolex gmt hands?  Or will this require some extensive modifications to mate rep hands to the DG.

 

 

EDIT:  I see where to buy the movement and matching DG hands, google is my friend. For a total of $50 it's worth a try and see if it fits the case.  

 

The DG 3804B goes anywhere the ETA 2836 will go.  Same stem height.  I've been a dyed in the wool ETA nut, but I recently bought one of Josh's 1655 to mod and it came with a 3804.  I have been running about one month and it has been solid.  I know that is not very long, but I have not had good luck with the 2813s.  I intend to run this one and see how it works.  I have a hammer, so I can fix it, at least, as well as JoeyB can.

[ceocorona]

I have an old TW case that's been thinned and shaved. Ill post some pictures up later tonight. I ordered the DG and matching hands. Hoping for the best! Ha

[automatico]

I have a few watches with the DG3804 and they all seem to run Ok but one or two do not have much reserve...dirty/dry probably. The only thing I have against them is that it is hit or miss when setting the 24 hour hand because of the slack in the wheels. You need to let the watch run for an hour or two after setting the 24 hour hand to see if it hits the markers on the hour and if not, you have to run the 24h hand all the way around and try again.

Another problem is if you turn the crown the wrong way when setting the date and mess the 24h hand position up. I do not know how many trips around the dial the 24h hand drive is good for (during resetting) before it causes trouble but I guess they are fairly rugged.

I had good luck with the older DG2812/13 with the 24 hour conversion but most of them needed to be cleaned/oiled or at least r/r the balance wheel jewels and clean and oil them along with anything else that looks dry (a half azz fix but it usually works). I do not know if they came from the factory as 'GMT' movements or were modified but I do know they are pretty tough. The main problems I have seen is the winding rotor screw falling out or a rotor bearing going bad.

I like the 'magic lever' Seagull ST16 better than the DG2812/13 but do not know if the 24 hour stuff will swap over...probably not.

Something else...date wheel overlays are available for Etas but all the DG 2812/13 I have (including 24 hour conversions) are 10mm date offset and I do not know about fitting a DW overlay...especially since it is putting a $25 or $30 overlay on a $25 movement. The last few DG2812/13 (non GMT) I bought from a supply house came with rolex style date font but with 10mm date offset. All the older watches I have (10 or 12 years old) with DG2812/13 GMT conversions have regular font (not rolex style) and all are 10mm offset.

The newer watches I have (3 or 4 years old) with DG3804 all have rolex type font and look like they are less than 10mm offset...closer to 9mm.

I like converted swiss Eta 2836/46 best of all but as the man said, they cost a lot more $$ compared to a DG to buy, service, or replace.

[ceocorona]

I like the fact that you brought up. A $30 DWO on a $25 movement. Haha I never thought about that. Well I bought it and will see how far I get. Worse case I just lose some and sell it to someone who can put it to use.

[JoeyB]

The date wheel overlay that came with the cartel 1655 I last used was 'stepped', and clipped into the date wheel on the DG3804B. It's the first I've seen like that. That made aligning my black/red printed sticker on the overlay really easy to do. The step in the overlay makes for better clearance and fewer hangups. I have the ETA 2846 in my first 6542 and in a 6204, and the DG3804B in my 1675 Cornino and my 2nd 6542, and the ETA 2836-2 in my 16710 and my 166710. I've had no 4th hand issues with any. I love `em all. 

[ceocorona]

That's exactly what I'm building. A 1675 Cornino (PCG). So I wonder if that silver DW that's being sold on these forums would work with that movement. Or is a white DW more gen accurate?

[JoeyB]

I used a silver date wheel, but I don't know if that is gen accurate for a 1960 1675. 

[woof*]

I like both methods, but as auto pointed out some of the con's for the DG, sneed's Eta 2846 method can be purchased from eBay seller "Swisstickers" for as little as 89$ shipped. That's a nos real Swiss movement.... no need for a hammer at service time.

[ceocorona]

I like both methods, but as auto pointed out some of the con's for the DG, sneed's Eta 2846 method can be purchased from eBay seller "Swisstickers" for as little as 89$ shipped. That's a nos real Swiss movement.... no need for a hammer at service time.

Well 89 for one movement I'll still need the other eta to build the slow beat. Now I wonder if I should have gone the route of Swiss eta vs the DG... Lol.

[woof*]

Sorry, I didn't mean to throw a wrench into the works.

Both methods have positives.

[automatico]

"... is a white DW more gen accurate?"

 

I believe almost all are white. Can not remember seeing a silver DW on one.

Some earlier models were R&B on white.  

 

http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images?_adv_prop=image&fr=mcsaoffblock&va=rolex+1675

 

http://images.search.yahoo.com/search/images?_adv_prop=image&fr=mcsaoffblock&va=rolex+6542+gmt+master   

[civic4982]

The DG3804B is a very good and reliable GMT movement that is not converted or modified, but designed to be a GMT movement from it's start. RolexAddict uses that movement in his custom 1675 builds. I have used both the DG and the ETA movements in my 6542 builds. Once completed, there is no discernible difference. You can further modify the ETA 2846 to make it work as the old gen movement did, no date quickset, no hacking, no adjustable GMT hand. But to me that makes the watch just a pain in the 6, and those non-functions are not going to fool anyone.  The beauty of the DG3804B is that at around 5 years when both movements would need servicing, the ETA will cost somewhere around $200. To service the DG3804B place the movement on the bench, hit it with a hammer, and replace the movement with a brand new one for about $25.  

 

I <3 the way this man thinks.

 

I think in a couple of years when I get my build list down to the point where can build a 6542 I'm gonna be going with the chinese movement mainly to simplify replacement.