Is this a Valjoux 72

[davids100]

Hi folks,

I'm in a franken 6263 / 6265 build and seek for a valjoux 72.

I found this one freshly serviced at a fair price but I'm not 100% sure it is a V72.

Can you tell me your opinions please.

Thanks

[cls]

you need a dial side pic too, as the VJ72 also has it's variants. 

looks like a 72 from this pic.

[davids100]

Thanks for the reply. Here is the dial side.

If i understood correctly I should need a V726 for a screwed down pushers build ortherwise it would be a push down pushers right?

I wish this one is a 726...

[lhooq]

It's a Valjoux 72; the 726 didn't have a needle regulator.  Gallets of that era either used a V72 or an Excelsior Park movement, and I'm not aware of Gallet ever making a chronograph with a 726 inside. 

[davids100]

Thanks again for the reply.

Is there any mod that would make this one fit a 6265 case?

[lhooq]

Is there any mod that would make this one fit a 6265 case?

 

Although I've heard of some problems fitting very early V72s into Daytona cases, the dimensions should be identical i.e. you shouldn't need to mod it. 

 

In fact, most of the Daytona frankens I've seen use V72s rather than V726s.  The main reason why the newer movement is preferred is because it ticks at 21600bph (rather than 18000), which matches the beat rate of the Rolex 727.

[cls]

The pushers are incidental although if you're using a DSN case, you need to shorten the shanks. You also have to muck with the case clamps quite a bit, DSN does not have gen like mounting. The movement you're looking at has a screw and spring type mounting system that is not drilled through the main plate. In order to mount in a DSN case you need to either drill and tap the main plate or fabricate very thin L shaped clamps and then slightly mill the case back to fit.

[alligoat]

What is a DSN case? I'm familiar w/ a DW case, but not a DSN.

[fitmic]

DSN=Davidsen

[davids100]

I wanted to use a phong or dw case. Look like I'd rather go to a 6239 build?

But does the issue with the mounting remains?

[cls]

What is a DSN case? I'm familiar w/ a DW case, but not a DSN.

brain fade, I meant DW

I wanted to use a phong or dw case. Look like I'd rather go to a 6239 build?

But does the issue with the mounting remains?

As far as I can see, they're the same case. I think others have discovered this to be true.

[lhooq]

As far as I can see, they're the same case. I think others have discovered this to be true.

 

The cases are different, and there are multiple sub-types for each supplier.  DW's case has gone through at least two or three evolutions, while ordering from Phong can get you one of several cases--some more accurate than others! 

 

Valty had a nice comparison last year. 

[alligoat]

This is a DW case on ebay and this is his new ebay name

http://www.ebay.com/itm/231079288866?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_217wt_1123

qkyvaljouxshop

DW has had his ups and downs, he's somewhat of a gamble these days. You can ask for the valjoux cases.

Hopefully it all works out ok. For the price, his cases have always been the best deal.

This is his 6239 7750 case with a cartel 6238 dial and 7750 movement

[davids100]

I already have 2 DW ones but one with his mystery movement and one with a 7734. The 7734 is a 6263 case reshaped by Rolexaddict.

I want to pull the trigger for this V72 but the concern about the screws holding the movement affraid me.

I'm not sure I understood the answer totally. Will this particular movement fit a DW case without any additionnal work or should I drill it?

Thanks guys

[alligoat]

If you got DW to send you a case for the valjoux movement, the movement should fit in the case. But there are no guarantees. that's just the nature of the DW cases and this hobby. Also, as LHOOQ pointed out, there are some V72 movements that are bigger than the standard 13 lignes which is around 29mm. This Heuer had bigger plates and couldn't be made to fit in a DW V72 case, but another Wittnauer V72 did. Heuer V72 on the left, Rep 6238 on the right

Undertaking a V72 build is not for the feint of heart, and don't forget to bring your checkbook along for the ride- it's going to take some serious money.

[freddy333]

Adding to Alligoat's comments, the bridles on the pillar plate are supposed to align with the grooves that run along the inner case walls as you can see here

 

The problem is that, on most aftermarket V72 Daytona cases, the grooves are either too high, causing the bridle screws to come into contact with the caseback &/or the dial a bit too far away from the case opening, or too low, making it difficult (often impossible) to vertically align the bridle in the groove. In the latter case, you are kind of screwed because, apparently, no one makes a bridle in the required shape. So you pretty much have to manufacture a custom, z-shaped bridle that makes a right-angle down the side of the pillar plate & then another right-angle into the lower case groove. Both I & Ziggy have spent quite a bit of time trying to make a bunch of bridles that fit, but, unfortunately, nearly all of them break when bent sufficient to accomplish their purpose. Because of this, 2 of my Daytonas have their movements held in the case by 1 (weak) z-shaped bridle. Oh, & just getting the bridle in there is quite a chore, making the idea of removal something you must think twice about before attempting.

 

Actually, the early DW cases had the grooves positioned almost perfectly. But there were 2 problems with those cases - the lug engravings were laser etched (they are always engraved on gens) & the cases had deep/wide cut-outs for screw-down pushers, which ID'd them as Oysters (not a problem if you are doing a 6263 or other Oyster 62xx Daytona model).

[wiesn089]

All fitment issues aside, your movement doesn't seem to be in very good shape. It may be the lighting, but imo there's significant discolorisation visible on some parts, which might indicate moisture damages (rust etc.). I would definitely pass on that.

Daytona builds require a considerable investment, from my experience saving a few bucks on dubious parts along the way will cost you more in the long run.

[davids100]

Well... I feel a bit demotivated for this build considering the high probability to fail.

I was attracted by this V72 cause of his price ($750 + $50 for shipping) and the invoice for overhault.

I'd rather buy an assembled one where final cost will be the same with no headaches.

Thanks guys for all your advices

[automatico]

"Both I & The Zigmeister have spent quite a bit of time trying to make a bunch of bridles that fit, but, unfortunately, nearly all of them break when bent sufficient to accomplish their purpose."

 

 

I use automotive feeler gauge stock to make case clamps and they will usually bend a lot before breaking. Another plus is that they are available in just about any thickness you might need.

I drill the hole first then use a battery powered Dremel tool with a cut-off wheel to rough them out.

 

Always drill the hole first... 

[freddy333]

We tried a number of springy metals, but they always broke when bent. I will give a feeler gauge a try. Thanks.

[automatico]

"We tried a number of springy metals, but they always broke when bent. I will give a feeler gauge a try.

If they still break you might have to heat them with a butane torch before bending them. I did not make any real sharp bends.

[freddy333]

Unfortunately, I cannot (easily) remove 1 to show its shape, but both bends need to be clean right-angles & we did a bit of heating. But I will try a feeler gauge when I have more time to experiment just to cover all the bases.