A possible remedy for secs at 6 7750s?

[EuroTimez]

Hi Freddy,

I was just browsing the internet, and read something here about stuff even better than graphite or so they say..... read for yourself.

What you guys think? http://graflex.org/speed-graphic/lubricants.html

Better Lubricants than Graphite

Graphite powder, although it is an excellent dry lubricant, has been shown to be corrosive to aluminum when there is possibility of moisture being present. Consequently, the USAF banned the use of Graphite lubricants on any USAF aircraft, several years ago. While graphite was the standard when the Speed Graphics were now, there is now a much better alternative: Molybdenum disulfide powder (Chemical symbol=MoS2).

A Graflex booklet on their roll film backs (with the film flattening pin rollers) advises how to lubricate them, with Z Molykote powder (Dow Corning trade name for MoS2 powder) dissolved in alcohol and applied in small quantities to the ends of the pin rollers, letting the mixture penetrate. The alcohol evaporates, and after wiping off the excess, you have the MoS2 powder left behind in the rollers. Graflex even sold this powder under their part number. It is a dark, almost black powder, similar to graphite in appearance. Messy if you spill it. Used just like graphite powder. You can "burnish" it on metal parts by rubbing it in with a cloth or stiff bristle brush. Some target shooters burnish MoS2 powder on their bullets--better accuracy, less bore fouling with lead. Ought to work really good on shutter leafs (carefully!!) Some motorcycle chain lubes have MoS2 powder in a carrier liquid to penetrate the chain links and then evaporate, leaving the powder behind. Ought to work in shutters too.

MoS2 can be purchased from at least two sources: local distributors (bearing supply houses, for example) normally have the Dow Corning Molykote Z powder in 10 oz bottles for almost 50 bucks. Or online at: Rose Mills Company, LLC.

Click on Bemol Lubricants and scroll down to the three grades of powder they sell online. I like the superfine grade, with particle sizes avg. 1.5 microns. It really gets into tight spaces. (.001 inch of clearance equals 25 microns--I expect some camera shutter clearances are much less that this) Sold in 1 pound tubs (several lifetimes supply) for around 30 bucks plus shipping. (a bargain) Buy a tub and sell small quantities on Ebay for mucho bucks each!! Spray the powder in your door locks. Plenty of other potential uses, it won't go to waste. Use your imagination.

The Z Molykote powder averages 4 to 10 microns particle size, and would also work if you want to buy locally and use exactly what Graflex specified, but it is expensive. Read about it at: Dow Corning Click on "Products/data sheets" and follow the rabbit trail to get a PDF file you can download. (product information sheet mentions use on camera shutters) The site will also give you a list of local distributors in your area.

Contributor: LtCol Rick Jones (USAF-Retired)

116 Freeman Dr

Warner Robins, GA 31088-3902

LtCol Jones is an engineer with the USAF, and has worked aircraft on corrosion problems and many others.

[freddy333]

Interesting & it might work also. But since powdered graphite seems to be 100% effective on the watches treated so far & our watches contain no aluminum (or water), I think graphite, which is available at most auto parts stores, is probably the better way to go.

[tootall]

Thanks for the write-up.

Could you please let us know what tools you are using? And maybe the spring issue that arises with the daytona's?

I would like to do this, but the only thing holding me back is the taking off and putting back on of the hands.

[Francisco]

Thanks for the write-up.

Could you please let us know what tools you are using? And maybe the spring issue that arises with the daytona's?

I would like to do this, but the only thing holding me back is the taking off and putting back on of the hands.

This is not a task for newbies. However, if you have been working with movements you can follow the tutorial, and the only problem, in the case of the Daytona, is how to place the spring and the plate that covers the spring.

The tuto is here:

http://www.rwg.cc/members/index.php?showtopic=67644

Best wishes,

Francisco

[freddy333]

Just to update, I just checked with the owner of the 1st watch treated with powdered graphite & it continues to run within COSC specs.

[ChronoKing]

Just to update, I just checked with the owner of the 1st watch treated with powdered graphite & it continues to run within COSC specs.

Great news, thanks for the update.

[jjfesq]

I wonder if this works on the ROO sec/12

[freddy333]

This is intended to treat the problems relating to the additional gearing added to the A7750 used to relocate the subdial functions. If your watch contains 1 of these A7750 movements with relocated subdial functions, then this treatment will address the problems associated with the extra gearing (you should read Ziggy's reviews of the A7750 for a detailed explanation of the issues involved). Unfortunately, I am unable to take in any additional work at this time, so you would need to find another member or local watchmaker to apply the graphite for you. For best results, I would recommend that you have your movement properly serviced (disassembled, cleaned & lubed) & apply the powdered graphite during reassembly. That way, you greatly reduce the likelihood of your watch dying from some other problem right after it has been treated with graphite. Remember, these movements are often used & come from the factory without being serviced. Unless you service them, they have very limited lifespans with or without being treated with graphite.

[flex]

Hi Freddy, i just went to the local watchmaker tools shop after work to look for graphite power........interestingly, they recommdned me the graphite chorno grease..so i just bought one bottle of the graphite chrono grease...they did highly recommdned this for chrono watches.

may be of your interest, attached is the pic

[freddy333]

Hi Freddy, i just went to the local watchmaker tools shop after work to look for graphite power........interestingly, they recommdned me the graphite chorno grease..so i just bought one bottle of the graphite chrono grease...they did highly recommdned this for chrono watches.

may be of your interest, attached is the pic

No, that will not work for this particular issue. Graphite grease is great for lubricating mainsprings & some gears or levers that have been designed with proper bearings. In this case, the additional gears that were added to the 7750 engine to relocate the subdial functions are just set onto bare staffs, without any type of jeweling or bearings whatsoever (Ziggy's reviews of the A7750 here & here are MUST READS). The reason powdered graphite is so effective is that it reduces friction while not physically attaching or 'bridgeing' the metal surfaces to each other, which adds additional drag to an already overtaxed engine.

But you had the right idea.

[FxrAndy]

Good news that the first one is still working,

[falconetti]

Good news that the first one is still working,

I am in the UK. Can anyone suggest where I can get my Portuguese fixed with graphite?

Many thanks

[falconetti]

I am in the UK. Can anyone suggest where I can get my Portuguese fixed with graphite?

Many thanks

I guess that's a "no" then

[freddy333]

I guess that's a "no" then

Have you tried Ziggy yet?

[falconetti]

Have you tried The Zigmeister yet?

Thanks - but I was hoping someone in UK (to save double customs problems.)

[freddy333]

As of November 2010, I understand that the original test watch is still running fine.

[acesup_11]

As of November 2010, I understand that the original test watch is still running fine.

That is great to here I just wish that there was people in the CONUSA that would be willing to do the treatment. I live in Connecticut/ Massachusetts if anyone knows someone who could help. Also if you know just a good watchsmith in these areas to work on reps please let me know.

[Irontomkidd]

That is great to here I just wish that there was people in the CONUSA that would be willing to do the treatment. I live in Connecticut/ Massachusetts if anyone knows someone who could help. Also if you know just a good watchsmith in these areas to work on reps please let me know.

+1

Anyone interested in giving it a shot… currently a boat anchor.

[acesup_11]

Is there a list of approved watchsmiths for different areas of the USA that would be a great idea.

[freddy333]

Any watchmaker who works on chronographs can handle this during a standard overhaul. Look in your phone book under 'watch repair' or 'watch & clock repair' & phone the shop to see if they will work on a rep containing a ETA 7750 (I doubt the watchmaker will identify the movement as Asian-made & if he does, just plead ignorance & thank him for letting you know). Tell him you need yours overhauled & would like to have powdered graphite applied to a few locations on the top plate during reassembly. If he agrees, pick up some powdered graphite at a local hardware, auto parts or home store, print out my initial post (including the pics) & give it to the watchmaker when you deliver your watch (make sure to redact the RWG names & links).

[acesup_11]

Any watchmaker who works on chronographs can handle this during a standard overhaul. Look in your phone book under 'watch repair' or 'watch & clock repair' & phone the shop to see if they will work on a rep containing a ETA 7750 (I doubt the watchmaker will identify the movement as Asian-made & if he does, just plead ignorance & thank him for letting you know). Tell him you need yours overhauled & would like to have powdered graphite applied to a few locations on the top plate during reassembly. If he agrees, pick up some powdered graphite at a local hardware, auto parts or home store, print out my initial post (including the pics) & give it to the watchmaker when you deliver your watch (make sure to redact the RWG names & links).

Thank you so much I really appreciate that advice. If I had common sense I would have thought of that lol. I was also wondering if you could tell me what movement to ask for if my pam 111H is not working as well to see if they will work on that movement as well.

[acesup_11]

Any watchmaker who works on chronographs can handle this during a standard overhaul. Look in your phone book under 'watch repair' or 'watch & clock repair' & phone the shop to see if they will work on a rep containing a ETA 7750 (I doubt the watchmaker will identify the movement as Asian-made & if he does, just plead ignorance & thank him for letting you know). Tell him you need yours overhauled & would like to have powdered graphite applied to a few locations on the top plate during reassembly. If he agrees, pick up some powdered graphite at a local hardware, auto parts or home store, print out my initial post (including the pics) & give it to the watchmaker when you deliver your watch (make sure to redact the RWG names & links).

I have called all watch repair places in a 70 Mile radius in Connecticut and Massachusetts and no one is willing to do the mod. Do any of the members here work on watches from the CONUSA. I would love to get a couple of daytonas done and order a new IWC port to get done as well. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

[freddy333]

As of today, the original test watch is still running.

[LeSentier]

Great to hear that. It would be interesting, who else has done the graphite treatment, and what the results are.

[kevin300z]

Going to try this, Thanks freddy