Fireman_Fred Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 I often browse the Members Trade area of this forum and I'm dimayed when I see a watch that I would consider buying only to see the dreaded words "CONUS ONLY !". As a member of the European Union, that cuts the number of members watches available for me to purchase by about 50%. What is the big problem with US members not wanting to send their watches outside the US?? In the past, I have managed to buy a couple of watches and straps from the US (posted to the UK) with absolutely no customs problems at all... Am I missing something? Can someone explain why US members of this forum are so petrified of trying to send anything across their borders? In contrast, I have sold a number of watches in this section of the forum and the majority have been bought by RWG members from the US ! - again, no issues with customs and it maximises the number of potential "customers" for me ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peyups Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 I also don't know with them... Maybe too lazy to fill-up customs/invoice forms. Personally I think there should be no problem as long as we are going to pay for the postage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest carlsbadrolex Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 For the exact same reason some EU members do not ship to the US. Regardless of what is stated in the sales ad. people dont want to deal with customs or international shipping issues. I have often found watches in the EU that I would have liked to buy. They were being sold only to EU members. Since the loss of a $1200 genuine Rolex movement by the USPS, I will not ship internationally any longer either. Its just the way it is...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireman_Fred Posted May 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 For the exact same reason some EU members do not ship to the US. Regardless of what is stated in the sales ad. people dont want to deal with customs or international shipping issues. I have often found watches in the EU that I would have liked to buy. They were being sold only to EU members. Since the loss of a $1200 genuine Rolex movement by the USPS, I will not ship internationally any longer either. Its just the way it is...... Maybe you've hit the nail on the head - Is it because the USPS so unreliable and so much stuff goes missing ?? The postal system to and from the UK seems pretty good and in probably 100+ watch related mailings, I have only ever lost ONE watch (that was at Christmas when a lot of students are taken on part time by the mail companies!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radiohead101 Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 To me I'm kind of scared of getting screwed over. Since there doesn't seem to be any delivery confirmation for international shipments via the USPS. I sold a $40 watch to a guy in Australia, and I sent it, and he told me he would assume all risks of it getting lost etc. I never heard from him again, so I assume he got it. But I'd be scared that the person would be able to file a paypal complaint saying they never received the item, then I'd be out the money and the watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireman_Fred Posted May 18, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 ...Or is that we are less suspicious and more trusting in the EU?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robj Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 I am sure if you were to pay by bank transfer and assumed the full responsibility of any customs issue then most would send to EU. As for UK post office being reliable think you have just been lucky sending from UK is a lottery especially if there is a holiday in the month Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazarini Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 Well i feel u FF. then again i think as a seller u have right to set ure own terms and conditions regarding the sale of ure goods as long as they are in boundaries of the board rules ... As an EU member i prefer to sell my stuff in EU all do i will send it to CONUS if needed and did so with cca 5 watches i sold and some other goodies as long as the buyer agrees on customs risk ... till now all my stuff got delivered oka. On the other hand i have not received 2 watches that got lost on the way from US but at the end came to reasonable resolution in both cases all do watches never appeared ... As said still in the end i think the decision is on the seller himself ... and should be respected by the buyers ... just my 2 cent ... regards Laz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest carlsbadrolex Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 In the last three months I have had a movement go missing, a watch box, a watch (outbound to EU). I have had a watch bracelet, watch end links, and watch links go missing (in bound). In all cases tracking was available, in the case of the movement... a re-sealed and empty box was delivered. It simply is not worth the hassle... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dani Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 conus only i see no reason for as a seller can say in sale post that they don't take any customs liability also euro only is same i see no reason for it as you can also say no customs liability on sellers part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 18, 2008 Report Share Posted May 18, 2008 As much as I hate to say it, US Customs & Border Security are becoming increasingly more invasive & effective in monitoring what enters & leaves the continental United States (CONUS). Roughly half the packages I have imported from outside the CONUS over the past year have been 'Examined by U.S. Customs & Border Security' Fortunately, during this time, I have been buying more gen parts (to build frankens) than reps, so this has not been an issue for me. However, a dial I recently sent to Canada (via USPS) was hit with an additional $47 import duty (by the Canadian govt), which was unexpected. So the reason I am hesitant to ship anything outside the CONUS is because of the growing risk of having the items pinched by the US govt, or having fines levied against me (for the amount of the gen equivalents), or ending up on the US govt's master list that would cause ALL of my future shipments to be inspected for contraband. And that would definitely cramp my style. I would guess that other members have similar reasons for limiting the pool of potential buyers to the CONUS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dani Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 As much as I hate to say it, US Customs & Border Security are becoming increasingly more invasive & effective in monitoring what enters & leaves the continental United States (CONUS). Roughly half the packages I have imported from outside the CONUS over the past year have been 'Examined by U.S. Customs & Border Security' Fortunately, during this time, I have been buying more gen parts (to build frankens) than reps, so this has not been an issue for me. However, a dial I recently sent to Canada (via USPS) was hit with an additional $47 import duty (by the Canadian govt), which was unexpected. So the reason I am hesitant to ship anything outside the CONUS is because of the growing risk of having the items pinched by the US govt, or having fines levied against me (for the amount of the gen equivalents), or ending up on the US govt's master list that would cause ALL of my future shipments to be inspected for contraband. And that would definitely cramp my style. And I would guess that other members have similar reasons for limiting the pool of potential buyers to the CONUS. The terrorist stuff is realy making all customs in all countrys go nasty on us..But if you assure no liability on shipping or customs then their shoud be no problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest carlsbadrolex Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 conus only i see no reason for as a seller can say in sale post that they don't take any customs liability also euro only is same i see no reason for it as you can also say no customs liability on sellers part. SURE, thats all well and good... But as a seller, I would feel a MORAL obligation to compensate the buyer for the loss. And I have compensated buyers for the loss. In fact, tomorrow I am refunding $125 to a buyer for a box that disappeared somewhere between the US and the EU. Even after he accepted the responsibility for the package. And since I WONT be doing any international shipping in the future, I no longer need to take these hits! Regardless of your opinion, or mine... The seller can set whatever limits and terms he wants. If the buyer wants the item, he will comply with the terms! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shundi Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 I agree with CBR... the reason I've done CONUS is simply because I: 1. Don't like it when expensive things go missing 2. Don't like dealing with the US Govt... trusts and moving assets around gets me audited by the IRS anyways 3. I'd rather pay $20 to insure the package for $1000, have it delivered, signed for, and confirmed within 2-3 days than have to wait, deal with customs, etc. 4. I'd feel a moral obligation to refund the money, which would mean I'd be out the asset and the cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 Some people base their decisions to ship only to CONUS on their own experience but for others it is laziness, ignorance, or a generalized sentiment that the rest of the world really doesn't matter. Every time I return home I am frustrated by the lack of media coverage of international events. To an American who has never lived outside of "CONUS" it may seem sufficient but having lived for a decade overseas I can say with absolute certainty that the picture of the world painted by the U.S. news media is not only incomplete but also simplistic and skewed to the sensational. I mention this because when purchasing on eBay I have noticed two things. When sellers state that they will only ship to the U.S. and I ask if they will ship to Spain they sometimes answer that they would be willing but are hesitant because they have never done so before. They are unaware that the additional "paperwork" consists of one small and easy to fill out customs declaration form. The other thing that I have noticed is that if I identify myself as an American living abroad, the likelihood that the seller will make an exception rises dramatically. Many Americans are at least mildly distrustful of all things (or people) not American. Some assume that things outside of their borders don't "work" as well. While many people have valid reasons for shipping CONUS only, based on their own experience with customs or theft, often the engine of resistance is ignorance. I have always been willing to assume the customs seizure risk when purchasing items from a non-dealer or very low volume seller and I always say as much. If an assignation of risk to the buyer is an explicit part of the agreement there is no practical reason not to sell to a person residing outside of the United States. I don't know why someone would feel morally obligated to refund my money in the event of loss or seizure when I expressly absolve them of any such obligation in advance of the transaction - but obviously each person is different. I am troubled, however, by a buyer who would accept such a refund. They are neither legally nor morally entitled to it. As to EU sellers who only ship within the EU, a quick browse through the old sales threads reveals that U.S. sellers are approximately THREE times more likely to state that they will not ship outside their own borders. I am not referring to the raw number of sellers - I am speaking of the percentage of U.S. sellers who state CONUS only compared to the percentage of EU sellers who state EU only. That there are risks associated with shipping replica watches internationally there is no doubt. But I don't believe that alone explains the entire "CONUS only" phenomena. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fireman_Fred Posted May 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 Some people base their decisions to ship only to CONUS on their own experience but for others it is laziness, ignorance, or a generalized sentiment that the rest of the world really doesn't matter. Every time I return home I am frustrated by the lack of media coverage of international events. To an American who has never lived outside of "CONUS" it may seem sufficient but having lived for a decade overseas I can say with absolute certainty that the picture of the world painted by the U.S. news media is not only incomplete but also simplistic and skewed to the sensational. Many Americans are at least mildly distrustful of all things (or people) not American. Some assume that things outside of their borders don't "work" as well. While many people have valid reasons for shipping CONUS only, based on their own experience with customs or theft, often the engine of resistance is ignorance. As to EU sellers who only ship within the EU, a quick browse through the old sales threads reveals that U.S. sellers are approximately THREE times more likely to state that they will not ship outside their own borders. I am not referring to the raw number of sellers - I am speaking of the percentage of U.S. sellers who state CONUS only compared to the percentage of EU sellers who state EU only. That there are risks associated with shipping replica watches internationally there is no doubt. But I don't believe that alone explains the entire "CONUS only" phenomena. This basically confirms what I thought ! I fully appreciate that it is etirely down to the seller to sell to whomever and wherever they want, however, in this game (buying and selling replica watches), there is ALWAYS a risk wherever you send any package. The sheer size of the US and the number of US based members on these forums will always allow sellers to specify "CONUS only" and still be guaranteed a good number of potential buyers. For the "rest of us" in the EU we will have to continue to ship our conterfeit goods across foreign borders and hope the customs are lenient ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dani Posted May 19, 2008 Report Share Posted May 19, 2008 SURE, thats all well and good... But as a seller, I would feel a MORAL obligation to compensate the buyer for the loss. And I have compensated buyers for the loss. In fact, tomorrow I am refunding $125 to a buyer for a box that disappeared somewhere between the US and the EU. Even after he accepted the responsibility for the package. And since I WONT be doing any international shipping in the future, I no longer need to take these hits! Regardless of your opinion, or mine... The seller can set whatever limits and terms he wants. If the buyer wants the item, he will comply with the terms! I have paid back more then 1000$ in my time on this boards to members for lost parcels. Moral has nothing to do whit it, you are shipping a illegal item over some country's border if you want refound on lost parcels it better have your name on the return sender or invoice..So i no longer ship whit delivery garante its just have it is, sometimes i go to Sweden and send expensive watches to members here then their is garante as it is eu/eu I agree on the last, sellers dictate the terms. Cheers, Dani Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surpur Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 So far every time I offered to send a watch to EU at the buyers risk with customs I never heard back from the buyer. I would never put my real address on a package sending a rep across international borders. Somebody in China can do that but not from the US. Being myself from Germany I know that every time I send perfectly legit items to my family they have to go to the customs office... Now - why do I not want to send outside CONUS ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Question - if sending from the US to EU and it gets flagged from EU customs, do they go after the recipient or the shipper? I know that throughout the EU, customs varies. I just sent over packages to Norway and Holland, where both buyers stated that there are no issues with customs over there, as long as you declare it properly. BTW - good idea Surpur - not using real names/addresses when shipping. Should have thought of that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 Question - if sending from the US to EU and it gets flagged from EU customs, do they go after the recipient or the shipper? Neither. Do you really believe that any country is going to apply to their own courts for an extradition warrant and then ask the United States to execute it - all over a replica watch? In case you are not sure, the answer is absolutely not. They just seize the watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 How do members send out watches to be repaired to our modders in different countries and have it arrive safte and sound ? Same question - how does th modders send the watches back to members in different countries and arrive safe and sound ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 In case you are not sure, the answer is absolutely not. They just seize the watch. How many times has a member stated that they received a letter in the mail from customs...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkerouac Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 I regularly send parcels to my brother in the UK, mostly computer parts that are often half the price in the US as there, and birthday or Christmas presents. Because the parcel is to my brother, I don't use tracking. But I am mindful of the description and value that I place on the parcel because once or twice he has had to pay a duty, which is a particular [censored] when the parcel is intended as a present. But I also become nervous at the risk of a $500 package simply disappearing without a trace. It probably helps our case that both the shipper and sender have the same last name. For non-relatives, I would consider selling a rep to someone in the EU, but it would have to be someone I felt pretty comfortable with, and who would pay the extra shipping charges. One other point: A few years ago I purchased a watch from a well-regarded Canadian member. The watch took almost three weeks to get to me (the postmark confirmed the shipping date), so I'd almost given up the watch as lost and concluded that he and I needed to negotiate a settlement. Otherwise, shipments to-from Canada have gone without a hitch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnG Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 How many times has a member stated that they received a letter in the mail from customs...... How many times was it an arrest warrant? When you ask about customs "going after" someone I assume you are talking about legal action and not a mere inquiry which if ignored will trigger the return of the watch to the sender or in the worst-case scenario the seizure and destruction of the watch. Customs does not "go after" anyone for this type of thing in the way the expression is commonly understood. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddy333 Posted May 20, 2008 Report Share Posted May 20, 2008 'CBP maintains an aggressive program to intercept shipments containing commodities which violate any laws of the United States, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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