DavidBreitling Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 I am fascinated by the common reference in posts for watch sales "CONUS Only pls". Of course if you are a US resident, this matters not. I realize that there are potential customs issues, I live in Canada, Toronto to be specific, and packages can go MIA. I am dealing with a potential situation like this at the moment. But if the buyer is willing to take the risk, why should the seller care? Additional shipping charges are not huge, maybe $5 to Canada, yes a customs form is required, and possible a trip to the post office to figure it all out, but most members go to the post office to ship their packages anyway. Or is it just that a market of 300 million is large enough to complete the sale, so why bother. US members are willing to take that risk every time they order from our Asian friends, so it can't be just risk aversion. European members also frequently post EU only for similar reasons. US members are lining up to send their treasured watches to Nova Scotia for service and lume mods, and seem willing to take the risk on their own account as a result. Now in practise I have found that if the vendor likes my offer, he is willing to overrule his initial prohibition on sales outside CONUS. Still, curious how often this pops up in sales posts from US members. What are other members experiences or views on this phenomenon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Why isnt this in the General Discussion where it has been previously discussed? To me, if a seller chooses to only ship to certain destinations, so be it. Its no different when sellers state that they can choose who they want to sell to (i.e. Supporters over non-supports, etc). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Personally speaking, I like CONUS transactions as Priority only takes 2 days for delivery in most cases. That's really my only discerning factor for selling and buying pre-owned (reps or gens). For trades... I like CONUS as there is less risk involved for both parties regarding customs. With two or more pieces in transit going back and forth, it's always a good idea to mitigate risk where possible when possible. I will note that I am always open to exceptions as my last trade transaction originated out of Canada... CONUS is just ideal to *me* for the reasons cited. And yes, I think this should probably be in GD instead of the trading forum... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agrippa Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Although its obviously the sellers decision, it is kind of strange. Nor is it particular to this place, it's basically much the same all over - US folk prefer to sell within the US, while the remainder couldn't care less where it ends up. Personally, if I sell something I can't see why it should matter where the buyer is. Kuala Lumpur, Kamchatka or the next town over hill; neither's any more hassle to post a parcel to than the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deltatahoe Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 sometimes it's for reasons as simple as convenience. for instance, i can ship a watch via UPS without leaving my office, whereas if i need to send a watch internationally, it involves a (long, frustrating) trip to the USPS. deltatahoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidBreitling Posted June 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 And yes, I think this should probably be in GD instead of the trading forum... Yes should be in GD, my stupid, and first topic. Won't repeat that mistake. As I thought, it is a matter of convenience, and the US member perspective is different than Rest of World perspective, like so many things in life. Having said that, I have bought a number of things from US members only too happy to oblige if asked, and, my price is right. Money talks, after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Not saying its a 1 to 1 ratio, but how many sales originating in the EU perfer the sales to remain in the EU? If you like a watch, even though you live outside of the desired shipping location, PM the seller and let them know you are willing to take the risks invovled. On a side note - yes, CONUS, as well as any buyer EU buyers buy reps from Asia. If the rep is seized, the buyer can go back to the dealer and ask for another one. However, for a private sale, the seller doesnt have that luxury to send a replacement if and when a watch gets seized. I beleive this was discussed before where a watch(es) and/or parts were either lost or were seized. THe buyer went ahead and filed a PP dispute to retrieve funds. That left the seller without any watches or funds. He lost out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triplehd Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 BTW - I have two listings...I'd be more than happy to send them to ya in Toronto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest avitt Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Some of the reasons to sell in-country only: No customs riskNo customs formsMore shipping options (For instance, Priority Mail with a Delivery Confirmation provides excellent service in the US, but there is no low-price international shipping option which also provides tracking.)Shipping shorter distances typically means less risk of damage in transit. Of course, the Conus market is smaller (and in recession), so the selling price may be lower. Plus, there are just plenty of excellent buyers located in other countries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samurai Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Perhaps the dealers should start selling Asia only Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubiquitous Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Yes should be in GD, my stupid, and first topic. Won't repeat that mistake. As I thought, it is a matter of convenience, and the US member perspective is different than Rest of World perspective, like so many things in life. Having said that, I have bought a number of things from US members only too happy to oblige if asked, and, my price is right. Money talks, after all. We can probably have a moderator move this topicto GD And I do agree- If all the factor$ of the equation line up, I'm sure that an exception is not out of the question. Me personally, my first preference is to sell or trade with the path of least resistance or process; if I can get a parcel sent with minimal headache, paperwork, delivery in two days and for $5, that's 1st choice for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5th_group Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 Here is the bottom line IMO. As US resident i would prefer to buy and sell within the CONUS. If i am buying, i get it quick, which is what i want. Selling on the other hand is a different story. I will and have sold outside the CONUS. With that being said, I am always reluctant. The truth is, most of these transactions are paid for via PP. My experience has been, when selling overseas, the seller in the beginning acknowledges all the risk, and states that he or she accepts the responsibilty if the package is lost or seized. Most buyers want the packages declared for a fraction of what the item is worth ( which impedes the CONUS seller from insuring any higher than the declared value. With this being said, let that 400 to 600 usd modded beauty disappear after you have shipped it, and see how fast the buyer changes his position. instantly.....refunds are demanded! Complaints are filed with PP! Everyone is ready to accept the risk until THEIR package is the one thats lost. Just my 2 cents.......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apowers Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 The thing is simple : as a seller, you do want to see the buyer to receive the watch he has pay for. Buyers are taking risk...until something bad happens. Then, they want a partial refund, or may think you haven't done the thing right... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jkerouac Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 The one time I purchased a watch from a Canadian seller it took just over 14 days to arrive. We were about to start discussion on an accomodation (probably split the purchase price) when it arrived. Although he used tracking, the post office never asked me for a signature, so I suppose a dishonest person could have scammed him. Another time I sold a watch box to a buyer in England. Compared to the price of the piece, tracking would have been prohibitive, and I realized that if the buyer was dishonest I could get scammed. But he wasn't, so all was well. I can't fault someone for not wanting to ship internationally, even though I sometimes lust after a watch being sold as EU only. Between the trust issue and general hassle of having to fill out customs forms, life is much simpler close to home. Suggestion: If you are Canadian and interested in a watch advertised as CONUS only, perhaps have it shipped to a friend or relative on this side of the border and have them cross ship or hand deliver it the next time they visit. P.S. When people say CONUS, does that mean they won't ship to Hawaii or military addresses? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest avitt Posted June 9, 2009 Report Share Posted June 9, 2009 P.S. When people say CONUS, does that mean they won't ship to Hawaii or military addresses? Technically, CONUS refers to the contiguous US, which excludes Alaska, Hawaii, and US territories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watchgal Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 As an Aussie, I can say it's nerve wrecking doing all this watch trading stuff. I'm impatient to recieve my parcels for sure BUT I'm more nervous shipping OS. I've just returned from the post office now after shipping the 204 and a OEM Panerai strap. I've insured both parcels and spent more money shipping than I intended, but thats for my piece of mind. The tracking numbers that I've been given at times are pretty much useless from Aus Post.. if you phone customer service they can give more direct answers than what you ever get online. Makes the buyer nervous. I've had genuine Panerais and Rolexs sent to me OS and boy oh boy, they resulted in sleepless nights. I'm not prepared to do that anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harryarme Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 A little off the point, but why does it take so frickin' long for mail to go between the US and Canada.? I just bought a Marathon bracelet from someone in Vancouver, and it took 13 days from there to Texas. I believe it was sent "expedited post" or something like that. Granted, the problem was largely on the US side. EMS from Guangzhou only takes about 6 days, including a couple of days in customs. Yeah, it's a pain to fill out a customs form, but I have to go to the post office anyway to ship to Canada, so it's no big deal, just $5 or so extra for postage. I'm willing to let the buyer take the risk with a $100 rep, but when it comes to a $400 super-rep I'd rather not ship outside the US because I don't want to be the seller in a deal where the buyer stands to lose that much. Besides the customs risk, there's the risk of loss or damage. If you ship a $400 super-rep and declare the real value, the buyer in the EU (and Canada as well, I believe) gets stuck with a big VAT bill and customs is more likely to check the package. So you declare the value as $25 or so and you can't insure it for its real value. I just looked back and saw that previous posters had made these same points, but I'll post this anyway. We really don't dislike you folks, it's just that you live in Canada... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdkno Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Technically, CONUS refers to the contiguous US, which excludes Alaska, Hawaii, and US territories. You are correct, however I think as it applies here it means anywhere that the package does not have to go through customs so Hawaii and Alaska are included. I know as a buyer I would prefer a US sale for less risk and quicker transit times. As a seller I would also prefer a US based sale for the same reasons. From a sellers prospective when I sell something I want it to get to the buyer and I want them to be happy, even if they fully accepted any customs risk I think I would still feel partly obligated if anything were to happen to the package. With that, while the buyer may have accepted the risk 100%, it would still be a risk for me as I would be compeled to make some form of gesture to make things right. As stated earlier I can mail a package to anywhere in the US from my desk, leave it with my secretary and it would be on its way. Shipping outside of the US requires me to use up well over an hour of my time driving to the post office, standing in line, and trying to explain to the post man that I need a customs form to send a package outside of the US. On a side note I think you will find alot of the people that put CONUS or EU only in their sales add would be willing to accomodate shipping outside of their comfort zone. For example if I had something marked CONUS only and someone from EU pm'ed wanting to buy it. If they were someone who has been here a while and knows full well what they are risking(customs seizure, long transit time, lost package) I would not have a problem with it. I think the fact that I put CONUS in my add would discourage all of the noob's from other countries from trying to buy it if that makes sense. How many times have we seen noobs initiate paypal disputes and start threads on here complaining and bashing people over things like customs seizures or lost packages and or long transit times. I know if I purchase something from over seas I am looking at atleast 7 days and I would not really be worried until I started to get closer to 20 or so days. Some people start freaking out if more than 3 or 4 days pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdkno Posted June 10, 2009 Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 Besides the customs risk, there's the risk of loss or damage. If you ship a $400 super-rep and declare the real value, the buyer in the EU (and Canada as well, I believe) gets stuck with a big VAT bill and customs is more likely to check the package. So you declare the value as $25 or so and you can't insure it for its real value. You know I never thought of that when it came to our rep trade. I know I buy and sell guns in the US which have to be shipped, I always state their value and insure them for almost double their acctual value. If someone paid me for the item I have to have enough insurance to give them their money back, then I also need enough insurance to either make what I wanted to make in the sale or replace the item itself so that I am not left ass out. For example you sell a $400 super rep for $350. Now you have to insure the package for $750.00 plus any and all shipping cost meaning what it would cost to have another $400 rep shipped to you from a dealer ~$30, plus the shipping you just paid for. SO you would really have to insure that $350 sale for close to $800 to cover all cost involved if the package is lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidBreitling Posted June 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2009 A little off the point, but why does it take so frickin' long for mail to go between the US and Canada.? I just bought a Marathon bracelet from someone in Vancouver, and it took 13 days from there to Texas. I believe it was sent "expedited post" or something like that. Granted, the problem was largely on the US side. EMS from Guangzhou only takes about 6 days, including a couple of days in customs. Answer: Canadian and US postal services are run by the government, need I say more? An interesting parallel question is why a US shipper can ship a small package from California to NY for under $5 via private courier, and in Canada its over $30. Same distance, same type of aircraft and roughly same fuel prices. 2nd Answer, lack of competition north of border. We have to have an exchange rate below the US, because EVERYTHING costs more here, except health insurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fakemaster Posted June 11, 2009 Report Share Posted June 11, 2009 My experience has been, when selling overseas, the seller in the beginning acknowledges all the risk, and states that he or she accepts the responsibilty if the package is lost or seized. Most buyers want the packages declared for a fraction of what the item is worth ( which impedes the CONUS seller from insuring any higher than the declared value. With this being said, let that 400 to 600 usd modded beauty disappear after you have shipped it, and see how fast the buyer changes his position. instantly.....refunds are demanded! Complaints are filed with PP! Everyone is ready to accept the risk until THEIR package is the one thats lost. +1000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave123 Posted June 12, 2009 Report Share Posted June 12, 2009 David, Breitling and from Toronto. Amazing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shundi Posted June 12, 2009 Report Share Posted June 12, 2009 Personally speaking, I like CONUS transactions as Priority only takes 2 days for delivery in most cases. That's really my only discerning factor for selling and buying pre-owned (reps or gens). For trades... I like CONUS as there is less risk involved for both parties regarding customs. With two or more pieces in transit going back and forth, it's always a good idea to mitigate risk where possible when possible. I will note that I am always open to exceptions as my last trade transaction originated out of Canada... CONUS is just ideal to *me* for the reasons cited. And yes, I think this should probably be in GD instead of the trading forum... I echo Fakey's x1000 and raise it x1000^99... free market...sell how you'd like Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadtorrent Posted June 18, 2009 Report Share Posted June 18, 2009 I echo Fakey's x1000 and raise it x1000^99... free market...sell how you'd like I can sympathize with SOME Of the CONUS requests, as there are known issues with bringing stuff into some countries and out of others...but between CONUS and Canada...those issues are about as minimal and low probability as shipping WITHIN CONUS. Cross border CONUS to Canada transactions are so easy. In Canada, the customs forms, postage and mailing label can be printed straight from the internet from the Canada Post site so no lineup in any post office is required...just drop the thing in a box. Receiving stuff is equally as easy...just a green customs stamp you can get without a lineup at any post office, and just slap on the right postage based on dimensions and weight. The risk between Canada and the US in my experience have been non-existent. I can see shying away from shipping stuff between Africa or even some EU countries (shipping TO EU countries, not receiving packages in Canada FROM EU countries)...but shipping TO Canada is so easy, and getting stuff from Canada has negligble risk as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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