crystalcranium

I thought lubrication was only at the bearing points.

Is that a FM Conqui....? Man am I out of my league here!!!

Woa hold the projected scenarios here. Have you contacted the seller and asked him/her what is their best way to rectify the situation. How do you know the dealer won't bend over backwards to get you the right watch at no additional cost???

I don't know who you dealt with, but I wouldn't expect to put out a dime to correct this mistake. The guy I have bought 75% of my reps from would not charge me anything for getting the right watch to me and any outlay of funds from my end for shipping would be credited to my future purchases. That's why I pay a little bit more for my watches, because the customer service there is so good.

This is supposed to be an easy one???!!! I'll guess vintage rolex cosmograph, pre daytona

It sits in the box on it's...well whatever that thing is, dial up pitched at about a 30 degree forward angle. I'll try it in some different positions. I recall John H from the Poor Man's watch group posting how one obtains the COSC certificate for their chronometer. I think it involves actual letter writing and is not doable via the web.

No I wind it manually

Well my genuine COSC rated SMP chrono ran like a top out of the box almost daily dead on but after 7 monts of 2-3 day/week use and 24/7 run time, it's now +7 sec/day. Is this an anomaly among genuine COSC watches and should I ask my jeweler for a free in warranty adjustment?

I have a few questions of you horologists out there. Many times I have heard the advice to wait until a watch has gone through the "break in" period before making adjustments to get it to run accurately. Exactly, what is happening during this time period? Is it gear wear, lubrication break in, an overall geshtalt of relationships between moving parts etc...? Is there a difference between letting the watch run for a month unworn vs wearing it every day? If the actual wearing and associated movements is what effects whatever gets "customized" internally, can changing those wearing habits affect accuracy after the break in period? What exactly is the purpose of a COSC rating if the actual accuracy will change with use? Is it not a reflection of out of the box accuracy but rather an indication of "potential" accuracy once the watch is settled into user specific wear? How can they possibly predict this? Does one need to have a watch re-adjusted every time usage changes????? Thanks Chris

_t _ooks ju_t _reat!!!!!!

You're probably right but the Daytona dial shuffle is much more complex than this would be. It would just be a slight offset for the 6 and 9 o'clock dials and the 3 o'clock dial is already being moved 1/4 of the way around the dial already.

Correct about the subdial issue, this would not correct the lingering inherent problem with putting a 7750 into these replicas, but at least they would all function. I would love a plastic crystal version of this watch true to the original as well. I wonder if it is possible to gear up the 7750 to move the dials to the accurate position for the entire Speedmaster line. I guess there is no incentive to do such a re engineering of the movement for such a limited number of replicas. Just a fantasy. But I think a closed case back, fully functional chronograph, plastic crystal, manual wind only Moonwatch replica wouldn't be such a stretch for existing replica production.

The venus copy/display case back Moonwatch sold by many of our dealers here is a highly praised piece for beauty and movement quality.....but oh that 6 o'clock dial..... The dial just kills it for me. If it's functioning, it's a dead giveaway. If it's frozen, an addition of $40 + shipping to your purchase price as modified by one of our finest here, it's non-functioning. I'd love to put a closed case back on these, properly engraved. The display case back model is very rare. A closed case version is much more believeable. And let's put a 3,6,9 subdial modified 7750 into these like the Broad Arrow versions. Then we would have 3 functional subdials. As for the hand wind movement, except for shaking it, who's going to know its an automatic and you can always hand wind it in front of anyone you need to impress. If our obsessive side needs to be addressed, our vendors can always remove the rotor and sell them as "modified 7750 movement to manual hand wind only function".

Language issues aside, and I agree, they are significant and some considerable slack should given, I agree with By-Tor's statement in the other thread that perhaps the perfect claims tweak a sensitive nerve in some replica patronizers in that we would LOVE to see a perfect sub. It looks like it would be so easy to do. That being said, yes the dealers here are an honest bunch and a group conscience approved lot they are in an unmonitored, illegal, ungoverned, no national or international standardized enterprise. I have no doubt we get the best available with the smallest [censored] factor. But I'd still love to see that "perfect" sub

Think I'll wait a while before getting one of these. Looks like the folks at Sea-Gull are working on the kinks and reliability is on the upswing.

I'm not particularily proud of the fact that I support an illegal activity. I can't rationalize the perspective that this is a "protest purchase" to demonstrate the insanity of the mark up in the genuine industry because there are plenty of legitimate manufacturers out there like Tissot and Hamilton and Swiss Army to name a few that I can patronize and make the same claim. Bottom line is I just think some of these replicas based on gorgeous original designs are just beautiful and this allows me to afford one without getting a second mortgage!! I think anyone who tries to pass off a replica for a genuine for profit is pretty scummy. I would never dream of doing that nor do I wave my reps in the noses of friends and associates and say "Lookie what I got!!!!" If someone notices, and my new Bentley GT is certainly getting some looks, and comments on the beauty, I say thank you. If an inquiry goes to origins, that makes it just a little more complicated. The fact is I don't mind people looking at my watches and admiring them. If their minds take them to other places and assumptions, some of them grandiose, so be it. But if someone asks, I let them teeter in doubt for a second or two, tease them into asking again, and then tell them the truth.

Got to agree. All I can think of is "Hey we sell so many, we don't have to make it great" is the logic. For something as customer specific and in as small a market as selling a Bentley to a Breitling afficiando who might have a higher expectation of accuracy, and is going to pay twice as much for it, they might assume they need to be more on the mark. I'm not sure

What incentive do the replica factories have to make a better submariner when almost all of the buyers are less informed about flaws than we are here and they buy them up by the tens of thousands? It seems Josh and Andrew and others are trying to attach bells and whistles and platitudes to time pieces that are far from perfect in an effort to give the appearance of bridging the gap, for semi informed buyers, between run of the mill and top of the line. The fact is we would all love a replica factory to look at a sheet of our problems with the classic sub, CGs, pearls, rehaut, print font, bracelet feel etc and come up with the ultimate in copies, but the fact is there is no advantage and gain for them in doing so. We would buy them up like wild dogs but I dont think any factory is going to re-tool for a couple of hundred replica nuts to salivate over when the stock 98% accurate replica is selling just fine. These "Perfect" and "Ultimate" and "Swiss technician serviced" submariners are just appealing repackaging of the same "as good as it gets these days" watch that we all have our particular issues with. When that true ultimate sub ever does show up, you can be sure the fireworks and sirens will go off here loud and clear.

If it's Josh's Perfect SD this guy is talking about, I got an education here prior to pulling the trigger on one as to just how inferior to the genuine ALL SD replicas are and while better than most, this one is still 3-4 glaring flaws off from "perfect". If a reputable and known dealer has cleaned up the very well known problems with the SD copies that would be VERY big news here and, I would suspect, a very big advertising boost on one of the "well known" sites. Just who is hiding this new, so called perfect SD??????

Do we have any input yet from longer term owners of replicas with this movement, the VC Tor or the Breguet et al. as to the mechanical reliability? They sell in the $600-1000 range on Josh's site and I'm wondering if they are worth the risk. I would think repair of this movement if it fails would be prohibitive compared to the purchase price.

Are these Chinese made watches marketed as "legitimate" name brands???? Whenever I see a Steinhauer advertised, I think "that's straight from a Chinese factory because it has the replica "formula", a high quality mechanical watch, perhaps swiss movement, for a fraction of the cost of a genuine swiss movement watch." There just isn't the complicating addition of it being a counterfeit as well

Isn't it amazing??? I'm no expert, but as soon as I looked at the photos, my brain registered the overall quality. I've never seen a rep with the depth and angle of rehaut in the genuines.

We loose sight of "Entertainment purposes only" and it's easy to do so here where the knife edge of perfection is discussed daily. The fact is that a 98% accurate replica is usually as good as it's going to get and when we get gems like the Link Chrono that are 99.5%, we buy them up as fast as we can. The businessmen and women who trade and advertise on this site are, by group conscience and definition, the best as far as reliability and honesty in a trade that is ILLEGAL. I just can't understand why people expect fair trade practices like they are shopping at Wal-Mart in the buying and selling of counterfeits. These dealers are the ones who have passed the test of walking the walk and anyone who smells of talking the talk while getting over on us is quickly brought up for group thumbs up or down. To intimate these pictures are, as a whole seeking to decieve, is insulting AND naieve. The dealers here all try to sell a little but they certainly know we are a very educated group and no amount of over the top claims or hidden by photographic sleight of hand defects are going to fly here for very long. Do they attempt to emphasize the positives rather than the defects in their products? Sure. What businessperson worth a damn doesn't? Do they attempt to sell us crap while claiming it's gold? Not that I've seen.

I just weighed my genuine SMP Chrono Diver. Ahem......219 grams. Sorry GT!!

Just got an email from Josh that he's selling the decorated movement versions now for about $195 delivered. Hmmmmmmmm!!!!!