TeeJay

Couldn't stant it any more... Had to put it back on

I felt like a change from the 127 today, so wearing this old favorite combo:)

"Little White Lies" doesnt always just concern the dealers on board.

THis happens alot when a person is unsatisfied with a watch and they just want to pass it on to another member.

Natron

Precicely, which is why I think Ztech should take the bull by the horns and post pictures of the watch detailing it's condition, and compare them to the PMs which describe it's condition. No one deserves to get scammed like this, least of all, by a forum supporter.

Wow! I just tried to find the "for sale" post from the seller so I could get the pics he originally posted, but for some wierd reason it's gone. Is it common practice that for sale posts are deleted after the sale is made???

Now I can't show the pics he originally posted. Am I missing something???

I have the PM's he and I traded back and forth. First, there was no mention of the mark on the dial. He said he never even saw it. Huh? I wonder. Also, before the payment he had mentioned something about hands so I asked him if the hands were scratched. He answered no. I was surprised to see the scratched hands when I got it. His answer was for me to go buy some new ones and that during the re-luming process hands get scratched. I did read that scratches do happen during re-luming, but shouldn't he had not lied about it when I asked him?

Personally, I'm [censored] about the situation, but I'm trying to put it behind me. He's a supporter of this forum and since I'm a noob I didn't want to shake the boat. Plus he could decide not to send me the missing CG screw.

Okay, if you've got PMs, that will prove that he said the hands weren't scratched. Yes, hands can get scratched during re-luming, but, not to the extent that they render the watch unwearable. I wouldn't like to say how quickly sales photos disappear, it rather sounds like they were removed to cover his tracks. I have to admit, if the scratches are as bad as you describe, I'm surprized they didn't show up on the sales photos, but, that's neither here nor there, as he obviously told you that they weren't scratched (within acceptable limits for a relume) As you say, he shouldn't've lied to you when you asked him.

As for him being a supporter, that doesn't mean a thing. You have the watch, you can take photos of it, and post them, as well as the PMs, which should state the condition of the watch, compared to the condition of the watch you received. If he's sending you the CG screw, that must mean he knew it wasn't on the watch when he sent it. Another black mark. Don't let a tiny screw be held over your head as leverage. If you're not going to wear the watch anyway, what difference does it matter if the CG is screwed on? Yes, if you send the watch for repair, I'm sure a replacement screw could be fitted, but, that's not the point. The point, is that a supporter of this forum sold you a watch with badly scratched hands, a scratched dial, and, a CG which was missing a screw. That, is an outright scam, my friend, plain and simple, and not the behaviour which is tollerated here. Whoever they are, they'd be wise to accept the watch back and refund you the money, or, I suspect the admin and mods will be rather displeased... This is a community, where folks are supposed to look out for each other, and trade fairly, not ship out things they know to be defective.

My advice to you is take some decent photos, post them up, and name and shame. If the watch is as bad as you say, then no one else is going to tollerate a supporter who pulls such tricks on a newcomer.

Best of luck

Thanks for all your advice. Unfortunately, the scratches are quite noticable. It's the first thing I noticed when I took the watch out of the box and looked at it under "normal" indoor lighting. The seller didn't disclose the fact that the hands were scratched and he won't take the watch back. Heck, the watch came filthy like it was just taken out of a dirty closet and it had a CG screw missing. Oh well, what can you do, you live and learn. I guess the guy was in more desperate need of the $450 than I. That's that...

I also do understand that this was a "used" watch and on top of that a rep, but I don't see why even a rep has to flash such a noticable fault to the world. Oh, did I tell you guys about the mark on the dial that also gives away the watch to anyone who looks at it at arms distance? I know it's a rep, but I don't want to wear something that screams it. So I guess, I'll either try to see if I can buff the scracthes off or source another set of hands, which by the way, what the seller told me to do if I wasn't happy with it. Umm.... yeah after he never mentioned anything about scratched hands or posted pics of it.

So now I'm looking to see if I can source some parts for it so I can, at least, salvage something from it. At least the movement and saphire AR crystal look pretty good, so that's a start. I just had the CG sanded down to something acceptable as the lever stuck way~~ out of the CG itself. Now it's somewhat acceptable.

By the way, it's been a full week since I e-mailed Angus and no reply. Is that normal for him?

Teejay = yep this one is upside down. Hey I'm learning. To date, this is the first 47mm PAM I've ever seen up close, rep or gen. Now that I'm paying more closer attention, I noticed that the chronos also have their CG's upside down too.

Were the scratches not visible on the sale photos of the watch? Same question about the mark on the dial...

Please tell me you didn't buy the watch without at least seeing a photo of it...

If the person is refusing to take it back, then the route is 'name and shame'. Take pictures, post them, and give the name. Doesn't matter who it is, how desperate they were for the money, or anything. Ripping off people is not cool, and people need to know that they can't be trusted.

If you can turn it into a project watch, or even have it repaired, it might not be a complete loss

Best of luck

RWG is my favourite waste of time !!

Just bought this classic track to mind

My Favorite Waste of Time - Owen Paul

(Ignore the movie, just enjoy the music )

For me RWG is not about the watches.....not any more....yes there will be future purchases but I know I already have enough to last a lifetime.

No to me RWG is about the people, people who will reach out in times of crisis to console my wife and report back to my many friends on any progress (my health scare), people who left so many pages of good wishes for me it took days to read on my return.

And people who were moved to send me small gifts, you will never know how much you brightened my day.

I am so honored to be a part of the Admin team of this board full of so many fine people.

So yeah RWG is not about the watches to me, it's about the people and to the people I say thank you.

Ken

Edit to add; I see I am getting some stars, please when time to tally exclude me from any winners list, I only wanted to give my feelings on our site.

Well said, Ken, and, with the boldened text, likewise. I do not want to win supporter status. My support of this forum will be from nothing but my own efforts of support. I just wanted to say what the forum means to me

A respected seller selling an Asian movement as Swiss?!?!

I'm shocked!!

Shocked and apalled at such fraudulent behaviour!!

RWG means being able to learn new things on a variety of subjects, not just watches, from a great variety of people.

Clear polish will eventually wear off with use so not recommended in case of allergy.

Do rock, ceramic and other watches have the same material for the caseback or is this SS with nickel in it?

The ones I thought of, still had an SS caseback, which was why I thought abuot titanium.

hello,

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To be honest, I'd reply to a PM like that. Unless it is actually abusive, then 'poor manners' can be ignored, and, as I've already taken the time to read the PM, not answering it would make that time wasted. If someone is actually abusive and vulgar, then yes, ignore and report. I think the distinction needs to be what constitutes 'rude'... Poor manners are one thing, outright vulgarity is another. What one person considers a reasonable quick request for information, another might find offensive, and, what might offend the recipient, might not have been intended to offend by the sender.

Are the scratches something that someone passing you in the street would notice? Or sitting next to you on the bus/train?

I understand totally the disappointment of receiving something which is less than perfect. But, please remember, these are not gen watches, they are only reps, and, often are less than perfect. Even gen watches can have imperfections. I once saw an Omega 2531.80 on sale in a jeweller, where the bezel insert not only had a scratch in the color, but, had a raised ridge in it as well, (about the same appearance as if a hair caught under a piece of clingfilm) The watch was still not in the window a week later, so either someone was happy to buy it, or, it was removed.

If you're that unhappy with the watch that you wouldn't wear it outside, send it back to the person you bought it from. If the scratches are that bad, they should have disclosed them prior to sale, and they should have been visible on any photos of the watch shown.

Personally, I'd say give it a little time. If, after 48 hours, you still feel the scratches are hideously noticeable, send it back, and name and shame the member for selling a watch in an unacceptable condition. If, on the other hand, you find you aren't really noticing the scratches, then keep it. Best of luck

PS I hope the crown guard wasn't on upside down

I think that a documentation of the mod/repair process is certainly more feasable than the idea of an escrow service.

The only reason I say that, is because with the escrow service, there will be two opinions about the watch. The owner, and, the observer. I've seen comments on TZ where someone criticized a gen Rolex because the hands weren't perfectly lining up with the dial markings. Some people have unreasonably high expectations of things. I've seen a photo of a gen PAM, where the quality of the lume (in terms of consistency) was appalling. Again, a gen product, falling way under what some would consider acceptable. The level of work provided by those like Ziggy surpasses that level. His lume work is better than gen. The problem that creates, is that having seen such work before, that is all they will accept. Now, say Mr A sends his watch to Ziggy for a relume. Mr B checks the watch on completion, and thinks that the work has been carried out to a satisfactory standard. Mr A could still disagree (unlikely, but possible) I think the only way an escrow service could work, is if the client provides a specific 'check list' of what they want done, and how they want the results to appear. That would at least provide the observer with something to specifically look for. But, that's hellishly time consuming.

A documentation of the process would be quicker and easier. Yes, this is the internet, and the ability to steal material to pass off as one's own exists, but, sometimes, things have to be taken on faith. The title of the thread includes 'collectors and scammers', so I will use them to illustrate the point. When people look at a collector's site, they take it on faith (because of the reputation of the collector) that the watches on display are the ones which will be sent. There have been instances though, where collectors have received new stock of X watch, which has a minor variation to the shown illustration, and, when people received them, they complained (rightly so) that the watch received, was not the same as the watch advertized. Were the collectors a) trashed and barred for it? Or b ) where they given the benefit of the doubt? That's right, Option B. They were given the benefit of the doubt.

If collectors are to be given the benefit of the doubt about the 'sales catalogues' they provide, (even when there have been proven cases of alternate stock, or un-serviced watches sent out) then the same benefit of the doubt has to be given to a modder's 'documentation portfolio'. It has to be an even playing field for all who provide services and product to this community. It is unfair to say that X's work is above question, and doesn't need to prove anything to anyone, but Y's work is nothing short of incompetant, and that they have to prove everything they do. There have recently been several topics requesting modding services other than Ziggy, and those requests were mostly shot down by the peanut gallery, despite the fact that Ziggy's workload is reported as so much, that he is forced to turn away work. That proves that there is a need, no, a demand, for other watchsmiths/modders to step up and offer services to people. But. Given the air of negativity and suspicion which such people are treated with, is it any wonder there are so few stepping forward? Why should people offer services to others, knowing that they face such schepticism? Demands for 'proof of work', for example, will do nothing to encourage people, and more to drive them away/remain silent.

Thanks for the options, guys, those're some great suggestions

TeeJay, just to note that people will suggest you coat the buckle with clear nail varnish.

This past year I went through a highly allergic time in my life. I'm still in a critical moment, with many triggers. So I can say without doubt that the clear nail varnish only partially works.

I still have angry rep splotches where the buckle is coated.

Looked this up online for you.

Grade 1, Commercially Pure Titanium Composition

Titanium 99.67

Carbon 0.08

Iron 0.03

Nitrogen 0.03

Oxygen 0.18

Hydrogen 0.015

So no nickel...the problem is, most rep watch makers cheat. Many Ti watches are hardly that.

Thanks for the information. Clear coat might work on the buckle and back (or partially so, as you point out) but, if the watch itself is also metal, the whole watch would need to be coated That's why I wondered about PVD coatings. I wondered about the titanium option, but wouldn't want her to buy something based on that, only to have him then react to it as well

One of my friends is looking to get a watch for her partner for his birthday, and asked if I could suggest anything. The problem, is that he has severe allergies. Any kind of metal in a watch is likely to bring about a severe nickel reaction (think Vampire wearing silver ) I suggested a bund strap, which would keep a watch back off his wrist, but, there's still the issue of the buckle. I'm figuring this really only leaves ceramic options, like the Chanel range. I wondered about PVD, and said I would enquire, as to if the PVD coating itself acts as a barrier against contact, with regards nickel allergies, or, if it is just considered 'part of the metal', or, if it is chemically similar enough to trigger a reaction itself.

There's no hurry, I'm just soliciting opinions which I could pass on.

Thanks in advance [Edit to add]

I just thought: Would titanium contain nickel?

I know of someone right now in production of a replica Ford GT40. I have seen it and it will be amazing when it is done. They actually had a doner GT40 to use for making body molds. I will see if I can get some pics next time I am over at the shop.

If that's the model of car I think it is, I saw one once on a program, and the owner said that when it came to scavenging the parts, to get the correct sweep of the windscreen wiper, they had to use a wiper moter from a JCB

I'd definitely suggest something like this as well. I got a Muller jump hours for my mother in law for Christmas, and she loves it. Recently, she went to London for dinner/show with friends, and said they were all fascinated by the watch, and waited to see the 'jump' Awesome dial texture, and, on a leather strap, look fantastic

I'd agree with SS that the movement is defective, although, I would suggest that it might be repairable (keyword being 'might' ) If you have a jeweller/watchsmith near you who would work on a mechanical watch, it might be worth taking it in for an examination, as a repair might be cheaper (and less hassle) than a movement replacement (which in itself, from what you've said, you'd still need to source a watchsmith to perform) Best of luck with it

Excellent stuff

I admit, I was rather hoping to have seen a 'Ferrari' cobbled together from parts from various models though. I saw a car in one modded car magazine, where most of the accessory parts (lights, door-handles, mirrors etc) had been replaced, but by parts for other cars by the same manufacturer, so, although it was obviously a customized car, the parts all 'fit' together, rather than clashing with each other

How often are you planning on shaving your head?

Probably every other day. I plan on keeping my scalp clean shaven, Lex Luthor/Hitman-style, rather than just zero-clipped, Jason Statham/Vin Diesel-style. Clean-shaven is neat and tidy, zero-clipped makes me look like a football hooligan

There's not a rating adequate to cover that, so I'll just say awesome post, incredibly indepth, and very insightfull

Try the tip of drying the blade immediately after shaving. You can also apply a little surgical spirit on it though I'm not sure if it has much difference apart from 'sterilizing' the blade. Nevertheless I read that it does help keep the blade sharp. From my experience, simply drying the blade after shaving has allowed me to use the same blade for more shaves than usual, in fact quite a bit more.

EDIT TO ADD: Wilkinson currently have a buy one get one free deal on the blue II's

Indeed, that's where I got my Blue IIs from I like to buy in bulk That said, looking at the Headblade site, that certainly is a good price for the shaving products. My only concern, would be how long the blades themselves remain sharp for (although $s isn't bad for the amount when converted to

I have shaved my head daily for years. I use an electric foil type razor, then once every other week I use a mach 5 or similar to get the stuff the electric misses over time. Works great.....Tracy

Thanks for the suggestion

Cold water, never personally tried that. In fact I do just the opposite--ever since high school I shave in the shower. It's awkward for some with no mirror but I just do it all by feel. Now when I shave at the sink it doesn't seem like I can get the same results, seems like the hot water and steam helps soften the hair?

Indeed, yes, the hot water and steam softens the hair and opens the pores. What I took the tip to mean, was to use hot water to wet the face and apply the lather, but then use cold water to rinse the blade, so the blade itself remains cool. I can honestly say I've never had razor burn following this method (even if the the last 3 years I had a full beard )

Drying the safety razor right after use is much better than letting it air dry, you want to avoid the buildup of minerals from the tap water on the edge.

Ahh, interesting about the minerals

you be needing one of these: www.headblade.com

Sweet I might have to invest in one

I hate shaving against the grain on my face, my hair is so thick the razor wants to dig down or catch. No idea what to tell you TJ.

When I shaved my head with the wet razor, it was a few days after my head had been shaved with clippers (the barber went over my head first with a guardless 'large' clipper, but then went back over it all, with one of those tiny 'touch up trimming' clippers, which he kept cool by spraying with lubricant spray) so the regrowth was about what it would be on the face for the same period. I spent quite a while before shaving my head, simply running my hands over it to determine the precice growth patterns, so I wouldn't have to shave against the grain. I went over my head once with the wet razors, then re-lathered and went back over everything just to be sure The result, was, touching my scalp 'with' the grain, it felt totally smooth, it was only touching against the grain, that it felt like very fine finishing paper

Its funny because I've been pondering something similar. How to mastermind the shave on, well.. the family jewels.

I would say carefully On another forum, one person once said how they gave themselves a nasty gash with clippers, but were too embarassed to get help Another person (same forum) said that they used a wet razor, and, as they had an interview one day, were slightly more hurried than usual, and nicked themselves slightly (as can happen shaving the face) so, they used the old 'toilet roll trick', got dressed, and didn't think any more about it untill they undressed later, to find their Y-Fronts looked like they'd been castrated

I actually dont know how to use one, it was a barber who shaved my head with the straight blade Very close shave actually. Its also much more efficient as with a normal razor, the hair can get clogged into the blade, whereas on a straight razor you just wipe it after every few strokes. I have also seen straight razors with disposable blades, you might be able to sharpen them when they dull so that might be worth looking into if you want efficiency.

Yes the electric razor is another option. I have never used one personally so I don't know how close it shaves, but I'm sure some of the better ones give a close shave. You can always do a 'once over' with a razor after the initial shave so you catch all the hair that you missed

I guess I'm really going for an unattainable balance of ultimate 'to the skin' closeness, but at the lowest possible price, due to the frequency of repetition I think the best thing will be to assess the options, and see what gives the best results, before then 'buying in bulk'. Then again, I could just take