Victoria

That could be why Catholics feel guilt and the need to confess their sins... It's not for a priest to voyeuristically take people's confessions and offer absolution for them, forgiveness comes from God alone.

Ultimate forgiveness, yes. And that which follows, absolution.

But the Confessional, in the words of that most sublime fictional character, Sherlock Holmes, is the one aspect of the Roman Church that always struck him as very logical.

Humans feel a need to speak to SOMEONE of confidence about their troubles. Sigmund Freud later came up with the idea in which we Catholics had found release for millenia.

Jesus was not the 'son of God', he was simply a prophet who God chose to create in a certain way. His divinity was added, as Pugwash pointed out, by Constantine, at the same time that many other aspects of his life (which would challenge that opinion) were deliberately removed to be forgotten.

Yes, I once read that in a "Guide to Islam" online.

http://www.islam-guide.com/ch3-10-1.htm

It is a very interesting thing to read one's religion through the eyes of another religion's beliefs. And by interesting, I would say completely insulting, and weighted towards their own precepts.

We Catholics do it to others too. You should hear what some say about Muhammed (PBUH).

Thanks for the reply Victoria. Yes doing a bit more searching did show up a few more 'watch for my wife' posts - and I was also looking at another of your recomendations, (I think it was you), for a Piaget Emperador - just need to check on sizes etc ...

Cartier items look pretty good.

Glad to be of service, Hammy. Andrew informs me that the Emperador is sold out.

BUT that he will continue to search for me (and now, if you guys add your voice, it'll give him more incentive!). It's really a stunner. Good luck, either way!

few of mine...

Star, that Daytona is homicide on a bracelet. It nearly offed me.

Anyone else spending hours drooling at this thread?

Oh and Anton, thanks! Glad to provide some mirth, warming you up, because it's cold as a cow's teat where I am too.

Ph.DGuy's Notes

Wow, my dissertation is almost over, phew! That last chapter almost killed me.

It seems the forum specimens are not (to quote TimeZone member, SnobFU1665) "poseur slimebuckets who would sell their grandmas for a working seconds @ 6 IWC Porto."

Their latest forum thread suggests they have a surprising number of "gen" watches. Their deviant behaviour must be a manifestation of sad latchkey childhoods, and in the case of the lone talkative female, clearly penis envy.

I will observe them until semester ends.

Addendum of 28 February: There's some thread going on about me, but I don't care. One day, when Doubleday publishes my book, and it becomes a New York Times Bestseller, they will know who I really was on the forum!!11! Until then, I'm just Ph.DGuy, MWAHAHA. Snap.

You know, if ever TTK posts his gens on this thread, the internets will shut down.

hahahahaha... The kenster... Are your sure bro? ahahhaahha, i dont know but what does @VB stand for i thought it stod for Verbal Kint... So im wrong, maybe i dont know... But Ken im not drinking today hahahaha im at work... But maybe your in the bar right now?

Remember my old forum ID, Robi. Lanikai uses the shorthand, though I encourage everyone to call me Victoria, Vicky, Vic, Gorgeous Babe, anything you want.

Not that!

Movado Esperanza

Klarlund Closed Case Front

Lyndon Pilot Watch

Casio Baby-G Shock

Technomarine Tmcsun

Tiffany & Co

Elgin Closed Case Front #1

Poljot

JL

Extra shot of Omega gold

And of course...Vintage Rolex Ladies Watch (Wristcheck to follow)

Note: These are watches inclusive to the 1 Oct 2007 Wristchecks, so End of Part 1. I omitted several watches, such as the "Nantucket" ones, Swiss Army, Philip Persio, and the like because though gens, they're frivolous. Also, I need verification of models of some, so if you know or want to correct please do!

In the end there's only one answer; yours. Tim

Agree, Tim, agree. There are many answers, but only one Truth.

And if God, or whatever life force one believes in, wanted us to know the Truth, He would've made us live life backwards not forwards, from wisdom to ignorance.

Good thread, nice exchange of ideas here.

The point, is in submitting to God's will, and trusting ourselves to Him.

Let me just say that this belief is the crucial difference between Christianity and Islam. I SUBMIT to no one, not even to God. I ACCEPT God, and His son, the Lord Jesus Christ.

Modern Western culture was built on a series of breakdowns of Authority versus Free Will, and it all starts with this aspect of Christianity: acceptance.

I guess missing this thread is the price I pay for watching Torchwood

Carl is not at all eager to jump in here at this point but would say that this should have been a private matter from start to finish.

This should have been moderated.

Carl, this sounds like I was complaining, and me and TWP are at odds.

NO! Please.

This was brought to my attention first on the Shoutbox, when I logged in. I searched for it, and it had been deleted/moved (as we later found out, by Mods, not by TWP).

TWP had a similar thread on modding my 190, which he did for me in complete generosity of spirit because (I hesitate to bring this up) the forum atmosphere was very different towards me in November-December 2007. He wanted to pep me up, as well as do right by my standing order with him. I was astonished at his surprising gesture, and I admit, I cried.

God, what a nice guy. Doc is right. He's not perfect, but damn his heart is golden, and he always steps up to the plate if he goofs. I feel like such a heel now...

Not really any judgement. But if I happen to see anyone with a special watch (IWC, AL&S, AP, PP, OP -- NOT Rolex, NOT Cartier, NOT Bulgari etc) I admit I feel somewhat curious about him/her/it.

Allow a guess, my dear Sssurfer?

- You wonder what series of events led to him or her choosing, then buying such a watch?

- You wonder if they are watch cognoscenti?

- You wonder how much disposable wealth they have?

- You wonder why they chose this or that colour/model/etc/ of IWC, AL&S...?

I am of the opinion that every single detail about you, says something about you. IOW, as a wise man once said, the devil's in the details.

@Stormtrooper4: LOL!! ...and I think this thread is going to get more play later. Today has been a very "funny" day on RWG.

Reviews .. write ups ... pictorials ... it would be wise to stay unbiased and not market the collector then turn into a representative for him/her .. it could cause misunderstandings.. making excuses for collectors is uncalled for, let the collector answer for themselves .. let the mods work speak for itself

Thanks for your honest response, Lanikai. I hear overall what you are saying.

However, reviews, write-ups, pictorials are the basis of this forum.

(Or in my case, would-be pictorials -- I wasn't even going to do that, simply post the watches in the Wristchecks as usual).

Haven't you recently been accused of being a shill and giving positive reviews in exchange for watches? A charge I found ludicrous, and said so, if you read my reply closely between the lines.

I know you are not accusing me of anything more than a rather strained charge of "PR" for TWP.

I say strained because as you have read, I have actually told people NOT to use TWP's services, at various times. Some PR spokeslady I am.

At most, he's a chum of mine, insomuch as anyone can be a chum online. I honour his work and commitment to his family deeply. But my watches are sacrosanct. If he messes them up, I'll tell him in no uncertain words.

AND CRUCIALLY FOR RWG...

I'll tell you guys too.

Now, let's follow Robi's advice and see what the chap has to say.

@Doc: Wow! Applause.

What, in that case, is the point of prayers?

I read my mum this entire thread. "Why are you talking about this in a rep watch place?". She doesn't have a good grasp of the internet being 300 million people just talking crap yet.

I just say I'm religious. She truly is, because she's devout. So please accept her Roman Catholic definition of prayer, as a talking point.

"A prayer is communication between you and God."

(Clearly I got my wordiness from my dad!)

Basically, humans have a need to transmit their hopes and desires to others. A prayer can also be a supplication to intercede or alter life, but you cannot tell God what to do. That's why it's called "prayer" not "command".

@Demon: EXACTLY!

@Pugwash: Sorry, I know it wasn't addressed to me, but basically it means you wish them well, perhaps also that you will speak to God so that He may intercede for them. We are indeed, vastly off-topic.

Great idea, Anton! (Cuando no?)

...you know my parents' strictures by now. So I'm limiting myself to those watches I have "outted" as gens before. More later.

Josef Megele was a Nazi war criminal who commited unspeakable horrendous acts. I don't think Khalid Muhammad is anywhere near that league However I should research more into who he was.

Any moment now, I'll be Godwin Lawed.

Thanks, Demon, for answering my question so kindly. I hope you find the answers which interest you, and please know that I have no agendas -- I love History, warts and all.

I am at your disposal anytime!

You want others who have researched this to give you facts, is that right? Why don't you research it and find facts? I don't mind conversation, but tend to shy away from becoming an instructor in history.

I tend to be a little heavy-handed, for which I apologise, Lyndonville.

But I am an Historian by training and profession. Religion is a contentious topic, and one which there are many reasons why people ask questions.

Some are genuine because they are curious, like I think Demon is, but others, because they wish to tear down religion because they don't like it (specifically Christianity).

I don't care about any of that. I just want as much fact as I can muster. If it's in the Scriptures, I'll take it, as flawed as they are.

If not, then we're all just shooting the breeze, and one person's information is another person's factoid. Is that cool with you?

Interesting.. What scripture is that quoted from Victoria?

http://www.painsley.org.uk/re/signposts/y8...ent/c-hindu.htm

I have, of course, read the Bhagavad Gita in school.

I found a video presentation on Youtube by a man called Dr. Khalid Muhammad who I believe was a part of the Nation of Islam. I believe the presentation took place in a University in California in the early 90's or late 80's.

Dr. Khalid Muhammad and the Nation of Islam being cited in this thread trying to bring information not disinformation?

Wow. That's like me trotting Dr. Mengele about anthropological insights...Demon, I'm a little nonplussed.

May I ask why you are asking these questions, friendly-like?

Resurrection is a nicer way to look at rebirth than all that bonking.

Speaking of bonking, and all that good stuff, the Hindus have several Universe creation stories, but the prevalent one goes like this:

"Before time began there was no heaven, no earth and no space between. A vast dark ocean washed upon the shores of nothingness and licked the edges of night. A giant cobra floated on the waters. Asleep within its endless coils lay the Lord Vishnu. He was watched over by the mighty serpent. Everything was so peaceful and silent that Vishnu slept undisturbed by dreams or motion.

Vishnu

From the depths a humming sound began to tremble, Om. It grew and spread, filling the emptiness and throbbing with energy. The night had ended. Vishnu awoke. As the dawn began to break, from Vishnu's navel grew a magnificent lotus flower. In the middle of the blossom sat Vishnu's servant, Brahma. He awaited the Lord's command.

Vishnu spoke to his servant: 'It is time to begin.' Brahma bowed. Vishnu commanded: 'Create the world.'

Brahma,

God of Creation

A wind swept up the waters. Vishnu and the serpent vanished. Brahma remained in the lotus flower, floating and tossing on the sea. He lifted up his arms and calmed the wind and the ocean. Then Brahma split the lotus flower into three. He stretched one part into the heavens. He made another part into the earth. With the third part of the flower he created the skies.

The earth was bare. Brahma set to work. He created grass, flowers, trees and plants of all kinds. To these he gave feeling. Next he created the animals and the insects to live on the land. He made birds to fly in the air and many fish to swim in the sea. To all these creatures, he gave the senses of touch and smell. He gave them power to see, hear and move.

The world was soon bristling with life and the air was filled with the sounds of Brahma's creation."

I had read a saltier version once. Vishnu ejaculated and thus were born the oceans, etc.

But snakes and lotus flowers are pretty cool.

Hey, 1899 and 1900 are the same century!

You have no sense of showmanship! I bet she wowed the Dalmatians for years with that.

Fact?

I'm not there yet. I would like to have the exact reference for you to say that though.

Everything I have said, including that bit of fluff on Queen Marie, can be backed up with noted historical sources. I'd just like to read the passage which allows you to state your claim with such validity.

And then I'd like to read why it was excised.

In short, give me history, or give me Cheetos.

So basically this information is kept low-key? Well in my case it is, I always thought Jesus was a celibate. I mean I've read about the Da Vinci Code and watched the movie, but I didn't know there was actual fact to back it up.

Oh God...Demon, ask Pugwash to provide the source. The exact source and then read up on the history.

Mentioning the Da Vinci Code in this context is well, more than a little forced. Next, the Priory of Sion will be mentioned, and there we go.

Is this somewhat true?

It isn't only somewhat true, that is the case precisely.

Jesus' so-called "Lost Years" which no one knows where he went, or what he did, range from the age of 12 to 30.

@Doc:

"The date Christmas is celebrated was actually moved by the Roman Catholic church from January to December to compete/coincide with the aforementioned pagan holiday, which is why some orthodox churches (Greek, Armenian) still observe Christmas in January. "

Did Matt Stone and Trey Parker really say that? That's wrong, and I'm surprised since I love them.

They celebrate later because the Orthodox Christian churches are on Julian calendar time, not on the revised Gregorian calendar which we use, in the modern-day.

They are 14 days behind us, presently. In Russian History as well as Greek History, you will see annotations of (OS) which means Old Style.

The last Queen of Yugoslavia was called "The Child of Two Centuries" because she was born in December 1899 in one, and January 1900 in the other. She was born Romanian Orthodox.

I knew you'd like it Victoria : I'm the right in the middle, without moustache...

I LOVE the indian!

And of course, the construction worker. Everyone else looks gay.

Thanks for the link Victoria. Do you personally know any Christians who do celebrate the approx date when Jesus is thought to have been born?

No, I do not. It's pretty much accepted that 25th December was his birthday. Because the calender was changed many times, it is also thought the year of his birth is closer to 3 BC, but who knows. We're going by Claudius, the Roman Emperor and Historian, who wrote that.

Recently, I read of Christians or more specifically, a proto-Christian sect in Iraq, who venerate John the Baptist, not Jesus Christ as the Messiah.

Now that's interesting. There are Jews and Catholics in Iraq (Tariq Aziz was RC), of course, but that I didn't know.