Timelord

Greetings to all! This question may be a long shot but I won’t know if I won’t ask? I have a genuine date just case (reference 1601 made for 1570 mvt) without a back and was wondering if anyone knows if the thread on a replica case is the same pitch and measure so I can buy a replica to close it until I find the genuine? Has anyone ever tried measuring it as I don’t have one to try ? Also, if I recall correctly, the same thread dimensions were also used on the 18k day/date presidential as were on the SS date just! I just can’t find the post on any of the other forums to confirm this? thanks for any input

True!!! natural ageing is more than just scratches and dents!! It is not just mechanical but chemical as well. In particular stainless steel, has an interesting property; that upon the moment it gets scratched, it begins to develop a passive layer where it heals itself like a wound on your skin. This is due to the oxidation of the chromium layer evening out the appearance. This happens with the appropriate time needed and fast-forwarding this may not allow this passive layer to form in the natural way it would have if exposed to other types of wear such as rubbing against your clothing for example. It would be lovely if we could artificially age wine indistinguishable from 30 or 40 year old vintages!!! Beaten up and put through a box of nuts and bolts etc. is a different mechanism of surface deformation. Although some look rather convincing as different processes are used to give this lustre (or lack of), you will always find sections that will highlight that it might indicate abuse instead of normal wear, especially on the back section as it gets a uniform sort of wear with natural ageing. As said earlier, it is what fools the fool!!! I had a 1978 Seiko which was given to me as gift from an aunt and it went through normal wear and tear especially when I wore it in high school (with lots of sports activity) and at University. The visible section of the watch including the crystal showed fairly even wear but the back part of it especially under the lugs was intact. I foolishly polished it when I put it away but natural anything is unique!!!

Greetings, I a not sure if this is the right section to post this, but I am doing my first sterile Pam111 build with a sterile dial as no trusted dealer I know is able to get me the replica since the raids! Therefore I purchased a generic case on eBay and a 6497 to fit the case! Upon assembling it, I noticed that the interior thread on the crown is way too wide than the 0.9mm tap threaded stem on the movement! Does anyone know or have come across a similar situation and if so, what adapter would one use to attach crown onto the movement thread! I do know that some thread extenders come with different end measures for different crown and stem thickness! Any input much appreciated with thanks! 🙂

Has there been any updates regarding to factories that were raided and if any have reopened or are to reopen soon? I am just hanging out to place an order but don’t know which direction to go☁️☂️☔️⛈🌤

I agree! I visit often, but don’t post as frequent as before, - not because I have lost Interest (on the contrary ,my interest is as strong as ever) but there is very little movement in this hobby since the parts policy has become as bad as the genuine parts policy! Most of us here are quite knowledgeable and like to experiment with our builds within our own limits of skills and then share & seek the services of the more skilled members of this forum depending on our desires. In a way it feels as though this era of the rep game has been done by design to eradicate this hobby of replicas as nothing else seemed to have worked in removing the rep game from the attraction many of us have been able to enjoy! Therefore prices of replicas keeps getting higher and most of us that have been here in the earlier years have been more advantaged in comparison to newcomers facing a tougher challenge!

This is going t impact some of our trusted dealers too! Hopefully, what has happened is just a storm in a teacup! By the way, who are our remaining trusted dealers? I just had a look at the introductory post written many moons ago for new comers and most of those dealer sites may need updating! So many greats of this hobby have also vanished like TC, Paul, The Zigmeister and Jackjo to mention a few😒. The world is a sadder place🤧

Very valid points!! i myself had these issues in the past! I noticed that if the movement is not held firmly by case ring screwed in properly)I seem to have issues where the stem does not always seem to pull out into the right position! You have lateral play and this causes stretch on your keyless works! When you cut the stem, do you measure it with case ring tightly fixed or with the dial just in position of dial seat where stem is just slightly longer pushing against the case? I have had this problem also if the stems are generics or faulty! Sometimes it is also the keys works that have some slack! At the moment I have 3 mvts with keyless works problems and unless you replace the whole keyless works they don’t always mesh up by buying individual parts I have also experienced some of the issues you mention when the movement is not right for the case! Ie fitting an eta 2824-2 into a case made for the eta 2836-2. I assume you are referring to the eta 2836-2 you are having these issues! I find the correct case clamps also play an astronomical difference, as ones that come with the case from factory seem to be dead right ! Making your own or trying to file down the right size is either a hit or a miss! I struggle with case clamps in getting them right! Hope this gives some feel for what I have noticed! good luck!

This one is a hard call from just these pictures! Bracelet is no doubt a replica, even if one were to contemplate white gold as this type of bracelet seems to have the design of a later model! The Helvetia hallmark as stamped here was replaced by the St. Bernard dog head on this type of bracelet! So that rules out the bracelet for me! The watch itself may tell another story as one striking feature on the exploded image of the movement shows the cap jewel spring exactly the same as the Zenith eta 2832 that I once owned! The picture of the collette wheel which is covered bythe rotor would nail it for me to rule it either a clone eta or the modified 2824-2 by Rolex Tudor themselves!

Gentlemen, thanks for your input! my failure is towards the end of the last turn while feeding in the mainspring! Just as I am turning the last part that latches onto the arbor,it gets a sharp bend and breaks!! Maybe it is that I am not putting enough pressure on the initial turns that makes it hard for that last loop to go in? Or maybe arthritis in fingers compounded by carpel tunnel or even lack of skills! Thanks for your support!

Well, I was in two minds whether to vent here about something that I have always been unsuccessful in my horological journey! I have over the years managed to pull apart and put together many watch movements from most of what I have learnt here and from the good will of other members volunteering their knowledge and patience! During any of my services , I have only been successful in removing a mainspring and only have been able to put it back in the barrel with the plunger tool that is specifically made for the eta 2824 which I bought o eBay many moons ago! Cheap thing but has worked so far! My embarrassment comes from the fact that I have never been successful in putting a mainspring In the barrel back by hand! 😔 on two occasions I have come close to the end and the spring just broke just before the last wind where the arbor sits! Maybe I have been winding them in the wrong direction! Maybe I am not up to it! I have even seen the already coiled up in a round steel holder which I believe is just pressed into the barrel by hand! This also makes me wonder I how to line them up straight and correctly pressing them in? I have two questions : 1. Is the one sold in the holder just pressed in and if so , are there any traps one needs too avoid from the spring flying out into my face? 2. How do you tell the direction of the mainspring before beginning the wind by looking at the shape of the spring? thanks for any advice!

Gentlemen I would firstly like to express again my thanks for your input towards my problem !!! I spent the last 2 weeks pulling the whole thing apart and re serviced the mechanism myself, after inspecting every single part . it turns out that the 3rd wheel pivot was worn and was causing side shake. It had enough power to get the pallet moving but then recoiled upon losing energy. At first I thought it was the mainspring that was broken or perhaps even the reverser wheels not transmitting energy to the mainspring, hence not forwarding enough power to the motion works. Out of curiosity I tried a generic third wheel and it works great!!!! Maybe I was lucky with a generic part for a change.. Time will tell,!!!! excuse the pun!! It is now ticking well. In all my years of tinkering, I have never had this issue. This is what makes this hobby an art, a science and a journey of passion, which is truly rewarding beyond any other!!!!!

Thanks for your reply! I disassembled the keyless works to clean them again too so that I also put enough lubrication in the joining parts! in fact this is my only mvt that has flawless keyless works! All my other 28xx series have faulty/worn keyless works. No matter how many times i reposition the parts, they always go out of place after a couple of uses as stem also pops out and Setting lever needs to be pushed in from the side! I was once recommended that lithium white grease is better for hardwearing parts! going back to the movt stopping, my only other theory workdays be a barrel issue with stem connection as there could be some wear around that area??

I just assembled (not the 1st) 2836-2 upon replacing a part ( correct part ) after a thorough clean and oiling. It kicked start brilliantly !!!!!🙂 Weird part is that upon setting the time with the winding stem, caused the balance wheel to stop.~~🤢 My first thought was that the hack lever may have got dislodged, so I removed the barrel bridge to see if this were the case!!!!. No ~ ~ all good with everything in it's right place!!! So I tried to re- set time again & same thing happened!!!🙄 Removed the barrel bridge off again to remove the hack lever (which looks like the numeral "7") hoping it may have resolved the problem! Again NO go!!!!! 🙄😒 Now for all of you with more experience in watchmaking, is there any connection between the stem positions (or keyless works components) upon setting the time and the train wheel motion works or even the balance???? I cannot see any real correlation apart from the hack lever, unless there is something that I do not know about how the movement components network together. It seems very strange that even pulling out the stem and pushing it back in can cause the watch to stop (even upon removing the hack lever) Any thoughts, comments criticisms or insults would be welcome for me to resolve this issue??? Thanks again guys!!!!🙂

Good point to investigate before purchasing !!!! I myself discovered a while back that apart from the obvious differences between the 28xx ( : | xx := 24 , the 34 v 36 ) is that the hour wheel and seconds wheel come in different heights!! However the other parts in which the escape wheel as catalogued by eta packaging is only one according to the following website; https://evergreenparts.de/spare-parts-for-ETA-2824-2 quotes also that the part number # ETA 2801 #705 (176027) is interchangeable with 2801-2 2804-2 2824-2 2834-2 2836-2

Very valid points!!!👍 when you think of it, any product that does not have a parts availability is disposable! Period!! A perfect example from the early 1990s was those no name electrical appliances found in Aldi or disposal stores that although seemed to be good value, served their purpose until they broke down and the whole item needed to be replaced as there were no parts sales! We labeled them back then as pure JUNK! At least their prices reflected their strategy! Here instead we have expensive junk! The Swiss industry have done this as a clever marketing strategy to protect an anachronistic product by making it hard to get to lift demand! Old marketing tricks!

My commiserations!! I had a similar event 18 months ago, with a seconds wheel! Try getting a seconds wheel for the day date version -34 or -36 and you never need to chop onions ! This is not advice. But my opinion only! I would not bother looking for a spare as you would pay almost one fifth of the value of the movement! Better to replace the complete movement with a new one without tags if you cannot live without a 28xx series or it is the only movement that fits your project! Keep the other for spares as it will be handy! Surely lightening will not strike twice with the same thing happening to the escape wheel next time you service your own movement! You will be more mindful of the last event! You may be better off buying a non working movement with some parts already on it for possibly a fraction more than the cost of the one wheel! Maybe someone on this forum may have one for sale! I replaced all my projects with the 27xx series as it is easier to find parts or at least until the market dries up. The cheapest escape wheel delivered to your door will set you back easily over USD20 plus tax, I am sorry that it happened because parts prices are absolutely ridiculous which is why I am slowly getting out of this hobby! good luck!

Totally agree !!!!!! In my opinion the 2783 was the best module of the mechanical watch world outside the inhouse brand watches prior the the quartz invasion. They were robust well designed ( incabloc setting) and easy to work with unlike the later generation higher beat 2824-2 where they are a pain in the A$5 to work on during a service!!! Most newer 2824 are a pain with their novodiac cap jewel spring flying off if you are not super careful , near impossible to replace the balance wheel without high risk damage the hair spring and their flimsy keyless works developing easy stretch. As mentioned in a reply above here, they are also many clones and you do not know what you are buying when sourcing wrecks for parts. Genuine parts availability are very expensive hens teeth!!!! You cannot go wrong with a 27XX series as they were also found in the Tudor snowflake submariner fetching high premiums if I am not mistaken. Let me add that a 2782 and a 2784 will work equally well as their height and stem height positions are identical http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&2&2uswk&ETA_2783 http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&2&2uswk&ETA_2784 and http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&2&2uswk&ETA_2782 which will be an easier substitute to the Rolex 15XX series with the stem height position not needing as much fiddling around The 2824-2 may or may not work but in addition to the stem positioning, you will need to use the right spacers, make sure that the date wheel overlay will not drop down the hour and seconds pivot height etc. This Russian doll will cost you a lot of grief!!! 🙂

I myself purchased from them a speed master with the st1902 as a gift for a family member , just before Christmas and it safely arrived in mid January! When it arrived I was very pleased & impressed with the packaging and the watch itself! Have not heard back from the recipient, so I believe all is well! I first learnt of them as trusted members from the forum! I purchased circa 2005 from them and had been very pleased with all transactions including one where I was not initially happy with, which they went beyond to fix the problem! They even sent me a replacement before I sent back the faulty watch - a Cartier Santos with back screw threads that needed to be drilled out to access the mvt for adjustment At the time it was managed/owned by Jay and Angel and I could not say a negative comment about them no matter how hard I looked! A year later they emailed me saying that the were no longer going to be running the business because they were not happy with the new factory and with the quality of modules! Months later I emailed to make a new order and a person named Jee was in charge! He was ok, but I am not sure who is the new manager, but I have not had any negative experiences so far! If there has recently been something new about their management or a new take over from someone else, which would benefit us all to know, it would be nice for others to share it with us! I am open minded! Thanks for sharing

thank you for the information! Very valid points indeed! I checked the train wheel works without the pallet and it spins freely without any issues I can immediately see when trying to wind the mainspring! However I am inclined to go along with your suggestion of the seconds wheel being the issue as I needed to replace it some months ago and could only get a clone generic. So as you say it may well be a tad too tall as it was labeled for eta 2801,2836-2 2824-2 and as I found out with an eta 2836-2 that the seconds wheel was in my case too short in not allowing the second had to be attached even though labeled as 2836-2 on packet! Probably the reason why most clone mats are a dud! The other issue was the mainspring barrel feeing a bit rough upon winding! Not sure if it is the keyless works as they seem rough and uncooperative at times, If parts are needed then these movements become scrap for parts as spares are now near impossible to get or impossible to justify for the price tag! At least I now know where the problem is and not necessarily just my skills!😁 many thanks again!!!

thank you for your input! Before responding to your reply, I wanted to leave no stone unturned in taking my time to inspect every single wheel and pivot being free from any debris or lint, making sure nothing is causing any obstructions! I reassembled it again and the pallet fork did kick upon testing it so I placed the balance assembly! It ran for a little while and was optimistic that I had resolved the problem until the same thing happened before I first posted my enquiry! I am not so sure what is happening as it might be something to do with the keyless works as they seem worn, because they keep falling out of position almost every time I try to set the time or even wind it! I have to always disassemble them to reposition the operations! The problem could even be there! anyway thanks for that as it was worth a try!

Greetings,, just had an issue with a 2801 manual movement after reassembly from cleaning. Got to oil it and upon running, it stops almost immediately. The only issue I noticed is that the escape wheel just rocks backwards and forwards without moving in it's circular orbit to make the seconds wheel turn. I believe the roller jewel is in the pallet fork but this seems strange. Has anyone ever had this issue as it is the first for me after having cleaned and oiled over 20 similar movements? Seems rather odd to me unless there is something that I do not know. Thanks for any input, or suggestions!!!

Greetings, just wanted to clarify to anyone who is replacing a seconds wheel in their eta 2836-2/2834-2 movement that one from a 2824-2 will not work!!!! as it will not accept the seconds hand as the top pivot is shorter. I did not know this even though I should have suspected it as the 2836 is thicker than the 2824 allowing for that extra height. I ordered a generic one on ebay which was advertised for eta 2824-2/2836-2/2834-2 which I thought contained tallest one to suffice for each of these movements. but they are not!!!!! Yesterday evening I replaced the wheel that had recently arrived, in my 2836 but the post of my seconds hand l did not reach it!!!! Just informing you all that you will have problems if you are in this situation. Genuine ones may have been labeled differently, but I could only find generics . Unless you can find a seconds hand with a longer tube, you might get away with this, but that is another problem if they are advertised as such but do not do the job.

New Years greetings to you ALL! Anyone ever had experience with a threaded gold crown ( crown no longer screws onto case tube)? Can the internal threads of crown that mates onto tube be reconditioned on the inside? My understanding is that they are gold capped with a normal metal sleeve that contains threads! Due to the drying market of parts, was hoping that something could be done as the aftermarket ones with the logo are plated and buying a good second hand one could be risky with how much life they have resulting from wear and tear! thanks!

I like many or all of you have a liking of wrist watches because we all have a special taste in the traditional watch as it has been known since the very wrist watch hit the market some two centuries ago! We have that special bond between what was once known as an item privileged only to a small number of people who were able to afford to buy one and be able to keep it by the maintenance costs of being able to keep using it for what it was designed for. Back in the 1950;'s or even 1960's not every one could afford a watch!! it was also something that was meant to last and be handed down from generation to generation!! In other words it was something more than an instrument that told the time!!! It was somewhat also tool, a piece of jewelry ( as they were also made in solid gold with diamonds) and a functional machine that ranks in a genre of its own similar to a luxury item such as a presentation fountain pen or even a prized painting !!! In the days before microelectronics this was a BIG THING!!! Some very small group of today's generation may also see this like us, but to most people a watch is nothing more than something that tells the time which can be found on your mobile phone or even on a pocket calculator. PERIOD!!!! In many cases it is also an anachronism just like the trend of the cart and horse being replaced by the motor running car. When I was a young boy, a friend of the family that was well off, had many luxury items, but wore a basic mechanical watch. He mentioned in a conversation back in 1974 that he would not buy anything like an Omega or a Rolex as they were no different to his Timex watch!!! He said that both had to be overhauled for the oils to be replaced like a Rolls Royce needed a service just like our Datsun (old name for Nissan) did!! In other words they both averaged to have the same lifetime without maintenance!!! The watch industry has reflected on this ever since the days of rapidly changing technology and have used Draconian measures towards those like us that see outside the square that a watch is more than something that tells the time. It is their way to keep their industry flourishing by making old watches disposable in cutting parts supply in an attempt to sell new ones!!! Sad but true!!! Therefore the ones most loyal to the industry are the ones that are the most harshly treated!!! Reminds me of when I was working for a boss, that the harder I worked and the more I did, the less I was appreciated since I was the first to be fired!!! Guess what?? His remaining less loyal complacent employees sent him to the cleaners!!!! Got what he deserved!!!🤩

thanks! I had seen ofrei, but they have a minimum order of USD18 and a minimum international order shipping cost of USD9.77 . They also come in 1.5 and 1.7 mm in size! I Am not sure what the right size is as the balance side on my movement surprisingly has a different setup like the incabloc gate style,! I don’t want to remove the broken spring to measure it as I could cause further damage and still not know size! I may be pushing it, but if I can find the right size Info, it will help a lot as other sources I found sell by size, thanks!